"Things that cannot be measured"

[Wes]

Still, let's say that we are reasonable enough not to settle a dispute by the means of "brute force"
.

Why do you want to throw out an entire field of applied mathematics?

esp. since it has greatly aided in the design of speakers?

 

[audiofooled]

This doesn't make sense to me. If we can measure individually then together they will measure as good as the least component. So if separate they pass with flying colors so to together.

I like the way you're thinking, but in this case we don't know which margin of error we need to apply to any of the components. Therefore, how can we know for certain which one is the least component? They all measure great, but in total, something could be wrong. We don't need to get too serious, it's just a thought experiment. We may think about it, or not.

 

[audiofooled]

There is a clinical term for it. They call it "word salad":

View attachment 125034

..while some go even further and call it "word diarrhea".

Ouch.

 

[audiofooled]

Why do you want to throw out an entire field of applied mathematics?

esp. since it has greatly aided in the design of speakers?

What do you mean? I never meant to do that. Just thought I'd point out some things we can, and others we can't know 100%. Food for thought. Or maybe not.

 

[KSTR]

I grow goosebumps when listening to mono bootleg recordings of Senri Kawaguchi made with a lowly camcorder.
I don't get any listening to Sarah K and other "blah audiophile records" on a $100.000 "SOTA" HiFi.

 

[audiofooled]

I grow goosebumps when listening to mono bootleg recordings of Senri Kawaguchi made with a lowly camcorder.
I don't get any listening to Sarah K and other "blah audiophile records" on a $100.000 "SOTA" HiFi.

Yup. Priceless and happens to all of us.

 

[pkane]

I grow goosebumps when listening to mono bootleg recordings of Senri Kawaguchi made with a lowly camcorder.
I don't get any listening to Sarah K and other "blah audiophile records" on a $100.000 "SOTA" HiFi.

But can you measure goosebumps? Do you count them, or just measure their elevation above the skin? That's one thing we can't know 100% for sure: if the goosebumps were caused by that new, expensive power cord or by the amazing talent and artistry of the performer. Nope. We can never be sure, at least not better than with 99.999999999999999% certainty, so I'm guessing the power cord had something to do with it

 

[audiofooled]

But can you measure goosebumps? Do you count them, or just measure their elevation above the skin? That's one thing we can't know 100% for sure: if the goosebumps were caused by that new, expensive power cord or by the amazing talent and artistry of the performer. Nope. We can never be sure, at least not better than with 99.999999999999999% certainty, so I'm guessing the power cord had something to do with it

There you go. Now no one can say that we completely disregard the power of the snake oil

 

[Wes]

But can you measure goosebumps? Do you count them, or just measure their elevation above the skin? That's one thing we can't know 100% for sure: if the goosebumps were caused by that new, expensive power cord or by the amazing talent and artistry of the performer. Nope. We can never be sure, at least not better than with 99.999999999999999% certainty, so I'm guessing the power cord had something to do with it

you can measure galvanic skin response and use electromyography to measure the inputs to the tiny muscles that cause goose bumps

 

[pkane]

you can measure galvanic skin response and use electromyography to measure the inputs to the tiny muscles that cause goose bumps

Show me a study that relates galvanic skin response to goosebumps and then, in turn, to my reaction to a $10,000 power cable. Specifically, one that demonstrates this with 100% certainty

 

[RayDunzl]

Uh-huh.

(not directed at any particular person, so don't flame me unless you just can't hep yersef)

 

[Wes]

Show me a study that relates galvanic skin response to goosebumps and then, in turn, to my reaction to a $10,000 power cable. Specifically, one that demonstrates this with 100% certainty

I'll be glad to write one up if you're a program officer at NSF or NIH.

 

[pkane]

I'll be glad to write one up if you're a program officer at NSF or NIH.

Unfortunately, I'm not. I guess I'll have to go dig in the REW user's manual to look for how to measure galvanic skin response and goosebumps. I'm sure it's in there, somewhere...

 

[ahofer]

You will all be glad to know this debate has been resolved over here : https://forum.audiogon.com/discussi...=website&utm_source=sendgrid&utm_medium=email

 

[kristiansen]

I grow goosebumps when listening to mono bootleg recordings of Senri Kawaguchi made with a lowly camcorder.
I don't get any listening to Sarah K and other "blah audiophile records" on a $100.000 "SOTA" HiFi.

I agree, the argument that goosebumps is related to a particularly good reproduction is flawed and must stop.
It typically has something to do with memories, have never gotten goosebumps to a live concert, only if they play something I have a relationship with.
Jethro Tull's "bad recordings" give me goosebumps even reproduced from boombox, especially Thick as bricks, because It was my first music.
Chalk against blackboard actually gives me goosebumps too

 

[solderdude]

Then there is foot-tapping... said to be another 'quality' related indicator. Should stop too.

 

[kristiansen]

Then there is foot-tapping... said to be another 'quality' related indicator. Should stop too.

Yes theoretically, because it is not the rendition that should do this, but the musicians, again I have been to many live concerts where I did not feel the urge for foot tapping. And so it is with recordings.
One has to be more objective if this is going to be about hi-fi.

 

[KSTR]

But can you measure goosebumps? Do you count them, or just measure their elevation above the skin?

My wife is pretty good at measuring my goosebump elevation level, and she can even provide positive feedback for the underlying mechanism, haha!

 

[audiofooled]

My wife is pretty good at measuring my goosebump elevation level, and she can even provide positive feedback for the underlying mechanism, haha!

Yup, synergy through synchronicity results in goosebumps. Doesn't have to be related to audio

 

[Gregss]

Yup, synergy through synchronicity results in goosebumps. Doesn't have to be related to audio

Hello All,

Guess we need a new measurement standard. Level of goose. Say let it run from zero to 10 with I'm dying from the cold at level ten.

“A day without sunshine is like, you know, night.”
― Steve Martin