The New King?

[Vhond]

What about the new SMSL VMV D2??

VMV D2R

Foshan ShuangMuSanLin electronics Co., LTD. founded in 2009 which located in Shenzhen, China. And our branch company VMV Technology(HK) Company Limited registered in HK in 2013. Our company is specialized in the audio DAC, stereo headphone amplifier, power amplifier, and with own R&D...

www.smsl-audio.com

 

[Vincentponcet]

What about the new SMSL VMV D2??

VMV D2R

Foshan ShuangMuSanLin electronics Co., LTD. founded in 2009 which located in Shenzhen, China. And our branch company VMV Technology(HK) Company Limited registered in HK in 2013. Our company is specialized in the audio DAC, stereo headphone amplifier, power amplifier, and with own R&D...

www.smsl-audio.com

The challenge now seems to me more to do 120db sinad + more features (headphone, PEQ, streaming, etc...) at a lower price point, than releasing another 123db DAC at 2,000$

 

[Vhond]

Though it would be nice having the VMV D2 being measured...

 

[xaon60]

French, translate

I allow myself to add a comment on this passage from the d90se :

"To say that I was surprised or stunned hearing a micro-detail that I never heard at around ~1 minute and 58 second mark on No Surprises by Radiohead (Qobuz / Tidal)"

This detail is audible with my SMSL A8 (AK4490), the power supply has been tested here (Ice Power 125ASX2),
I listen every day with Qobuz, the sound of this dac is really good.
Klipsch R-820F / 115 SW or AKG K701 headphones.
I shed my little tear a few times.
I will buy the d90se in the coming days.

 

[mocenigo]

French, translate

I allow myself to add a comment on this passage from the d90se :

"To say that I was surprised or stunned hearing a micro-detail that I never heard at around ~1 minute and 58 second mark on No Surprises by Radiohead (Qobuz / Tidal)"

This detail is audible with my SMSL A8 (AK4490), the power supply has been tested here (Ice Power 125ASX2),
I listen every day with Qobuz, the sound of this dac is really good.
Klipsch R-820F / 115 SW or AKG K701 headphones.
I shed my little tear a few times.
I will buy the d90se in the coming days.

This is all very nice but it has happened to me many times: while listening to a new device I hear at some point some new detail. What I then do is I put another device, an older one, a “worse” one and I hear the same detail. With any decent DAC all details are rendered. We just tend to attribute to the new device the fact that we notice that detail for the first time. But, it is not necessarily the device that makes us notice it, we just did not notice it before. Maybe it is the fact that we are listening more carefully to the new toy the real reason we are noticing many little ones things.

This is not to detract anything from your DACs, but never underestimate the power of autosuggestion. And maybe you do not really need a D90se in place of the SMSL A8.

 

[Mihalis]

How does Topping keep pumping out new products every couple months? It is really impressive.

Is it impressive? Or is it a marketing strategy focusing on one or two measurement characteristics and causing people who believe it matters to keep buying? If they believe in the meaning of measurements, shouldn’t they just say: none of this is audible, so we are fine with our previous model?

They are smart in marketing and are exploiting a new kind of audiophile, the sinadiophile.

And the decimal places, imo, are silly. Does the reviewer wait for hours to screen grab the highest level that pops up as they oscillate constantly?

 

[mocenigo]

Is it impressive? Or is it a marketing strategy focusing on one or two measurement characteristics and causing people who believe it matters to keep buying? If they believe in the meaning of measurements, shouldn’t they just say: none of this is audible, so we are fine with our previous model?

They are smart in marketing and are exploiting a new kind of audiophile, the sinadiophile.

And the decimal places, imo, are silly. Does the reviewer wait for hours to screen grab the highest level that pops up as they oscillate constantly?

You are absolutely right. But at least the measurements — which go way beyond the SINAD, if you have been paying attention to Amir’s reviews — tell the truth (or at least a truth). Subjectivist blah blah that is included in the marketing of many hifi and hiend product tell nothing - well, to be honest, to us they tell that a particular product is overpriced and overhyped if not outright in the snake oil category.

 

[trl]

@Mihalis, what would you think it actually matters when talking about Hi-Fi devices, especially DACs?

 

[Tokyo_John]

Amir’s measurements show that many DACs have SINAD that far exceeds human hearing capacity to distinguish. DAC is now a solved technical problem, so we can move on to other facets and practical considerations, which seem to be:

(1) Roll-off: What some of us CAN hear are the characteristics of the roll off filter, although less so as we get older. I get the impression that many people who are doing subjective comparisons of DACs are actually hearing differences in the roll-off, and nothing else (if anything at all).

(2) Practical: Ease of use, features, compatibility with other components/systems, reliability/longevity of the device, and of course the price. This is why I gave up using my own D90 on my main system for a MiniDSP SHD with a technically less superior DAC (but audibly indistinguishable)…because it is integrated with a DSP running Dirac Live, and more.

(3) Source files/production: A transparent DAC basically transmits the source file faithfully, so streaming a quality source is critical. Any flaws can be heard. This is a question of studio production/mixing, digitization, formats, etc.. As the controversy surrounding MQA shows, it is an unsolved issue between producers and consumers, especially in light of understandable business/copyright interests.

…so it is probably better to move on to these other issues. Arguing about DAC fidelity (anything connected to SINAD) seems to be a waste of time at this point.

 

[trl]

(1) Amir is measuring DACs with all digital filters already.
(2) Yes, I do see your point for sure John and I totally agree with you. Amir is briefly covering price, features and ease of use of most audio devices tested by him, but for in-depth talks about these you may look elsewhere, fr example to soundnews.net or other similar audio reviews portals.
(3) Not sure ASR can have much influence on this matter, especially about the Loudness War, increased compression on lots of songs etc.

Given that more and more audio devices have passed the barrier of 120 dB SINAD, I think that Amir's review will cover more aspects like the ones indicated by you above. Things like display quality, look&feel of the device, how the rotary knob is operating etc. will make up consumer's mind in choosing wisely. I'd personally pick one the device that has the higher warranty and preferably in the same continent I leave in, but this is a no-brainer for most of us already.

Also, teardowns from this ASR and from other Internet forum as well will try to cover some aspects about what kind of electronic parts are inside audio devices.