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The "new" Class D vs A/B amps

Where do you get oxygen free jumper cables? I'm having trouble finding them at my local auto supply. :)
As we all know, there is no need for oxygen free copper. It offers no benefits in audio applications. Nor for car starting applications. :p
 
Even automotive wire is often electrolytic copper, either 99.9 or 99.95% pure. The latter counts as OFC too, just isn't marketed as such. Perfect as cheap speaker wire, for low output impedance class D amps too - to stay at least vaguely on topic. :D
 
Other (anecdotal) reviews regarding Class D have said that the distortion is low, power is abundant....but mid's and lows lack texture and slam.

Maybe some people like a bit of emphasis on the midrange, including a bit of second order distortion, and a very low damping factor in the bass (read: less control). Then they need an amplifier that is defective by design.
 
Class D and SMPS have a big advantage for manufacturers and retailers.. cheaper to manufacture, shipping cost is reduced a lot. But also storage throughout the whole process from manufacturing till it ends up in a Retail store. Even if you put the stuff in a fancy case it’s usually 8-10kg vs 30kg for a traditional A/B big boy amp.

Also way more efficient :) but we are not saving money by throwing a perfectly fine A/B amp away and replacing it with a fancy Class D amp . Nor are we saving the planet by producing Landfill class D amps .
 
They use less electricity as well of course, an advantage for the consumer, not sure what a ‘landfill’ amp is but if customers don’t buy them manufacturers won’t make them.
Keith
 
The only antidote is education in the nature of modern electronics (pretty much universally transparent) AND the mechanisms by which our human auditory system fools us. Calling people mentally ill will not help (and is insulting to those who suffer from actual mental illness)
Agree on the 2nd sentence. But education by demonstration is useful too. We don't need to turn people into scientists to make them aware of how senses don't work in isolation, that one input channel integrates with other inputs and memory to produce perception. There are lots of good demos how vision is lot more than imaging from the eye, e.g. we can show a lack of color discrimination outside the center field and that the color we see out there must then be coming from somewhere else. It would be good to collect a set of such audio demos.
 
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Slam: sufficient amplifier power to play dynamic range peaks without clipping;
We can point to D amps with plenty of power and to non-D amps without. So a classist account doesn't work there.

Texture: fully subjective reviewer's creative way to rather describe the quality of the recording they're listening to... :D
If it describes the recording then it doesn't describe the amp.

If we charitably assume the reviewer was describing audible differences between amps then if the difference is so big that we can hear texture in one that's absent in the other then surely we can measure that difference. We have after all very sensitive instruments. Let's find out if the non-D amp is adding texture or if the D amp is removing it. I think the reviewer should be very pleased to have this info.
 
Works for me!

It's not welding cable, but it is 2AWG, so I've got that going for me, which is nice.

View attachment 420668

And bi-wired too, because I could, at speaker and amps, same terminals both ends, all from the junkbox.
Looks ok except for color coding and insulation. Do it again properly! :P
 
Getting ready to purchase a Buckeye NCx500 2 Ch amp to drive B&W 802's. I have read glowing reviews and Amir has put this on his recommended list above other seriously expensive amps. I was originally considering ATI 6002-2, Anthem STR, Mark Levinson 5302. From reading reviews of the Hypex and Purify amps, it seems that the new class D amps are outperforming the "higher-end" A/B monsters. Is this actually the case?
I don't know for sure without comparable bench test results. But I am inclined to assume that all three of those expensive amps are competent. Even if the Hypex and Purify amps test better I would expect that the differences will not be significant in practice, assuming all are suitable for your application.

However, we can engineer a better sounding system with the less expensive Class D amps by reassigning system budget to speakers. It remains the case that high performance speakers cost a lot. Crutchfield lists 5302 at US$11k. Spending instead 1k on an amp and 10k on speakers should produce good sound.

But if you are departing, as it seems you might be, the world of audiophile aesthetics, marketing, and review poetry then take a look at and try to understand some modern gear. The audio pros that rely on good sound for their livelihood are moving (or already moved) to systems using one amp per speaker driver, e.g. active studio monitors. These days they often use hardware that allows crossovers, driver compensation and time alignment, and cabinet compensation to be implemented in software. The individual amps are specified for the job and uninteresting from the audiophile perspectiv: they are small, light, inexpensive and boring/ugly to look at. But there's no denying the resulting good sound.
 
Other (anecdotal) reviews regarding Class D have said that the distortion is low, power is abundant....but mid's and lows lack texture and slam.
Texture and slam?!
Oy vey.

I've found the Class D amplifiers I've listened to to be generally both adequately slammy and texturous in both midrange and lowrange ranges.
 
I'm in the process of converting a stereo 3-way passive speaker to fully active.

Sorry to be a little bit out of the scope/theme of this thread, but...

I am very happy finding you are doing what I have been engaging/enjoying for the past almost 5 years!

In my case, I have added L&R super-tweeters and L&R subwoofers to my main 3-way SP, and converted all of them fully active, i.e. all of the SP-drivers are now driven dedicatedly and directly by each of the four HiFi stereo amplifiers (my subwoofer have powerful amplifier in it); consequently the present stereo system is 5-way 10-channel.

Only if you would be interested in my "long exploration journey", your visit and participation on my project thread will be much welcome.
You can find here (on the thread) and here (remote independent thread post) the Hyperlink Index of my project thread and some of my related posts in remote threads.

As for the latest (almost completed) system setup, you would please visit my post #931 on the project thread.

Edit:
This separate thread hosted by myself would be also of your interest, I assume, since several ASR members share their active (and passive) audio system/setup:
Let's share diagrams (and photos) of our total physical audio system and the whole signal path, with a few words and/or links
 
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Don't get me wrong, I loved the AHB2s, but the Hypex measure almost every bit as well as the AHB2s and are audibly identical.
I really like your post and argument.

However, I have a question. Hypothetically, had there been an audible difference where the hypex was found lacking in comparison you may have stayed with your AHB2s (inferred from your post). I am curious, is it correct of me to come to this conclusion?

Pressing the issue, you already had the data and trust the test results. What could you possibly have learned in a non scientific approach to comparing the two?

I believe I can answer this. Your ears, brain, and heart matter.

I apologize for using your post as an example. Seriously. I have been struggling daily with whether or not I am missing something in my system which is powered by a pair of ncx500s. Your post gives me a degree of confidence that that is a rabbit hole I may not need to fall into.

For me it's not a question of missing something specific, it's the question of what does better sound like and how do I get that better within my very limited means. So mostly it's fomo.

You have genuinely helped me, and maybe help others to see that we all have subjective biases. And it's ok to let them guide us.
 
I believe I can answer this. Your ears, brain, and heart matter.
In this case the ears don't matter, as they won't perceive a difference. You heart probably won't notice a difference either, unless your brain causes your blood pressure to increase :), but yes, the brain is what matters. Many people eat a morning cereal that is much more expensive than a totally equivalent generic cereal just because they want "their" brand.
 
However, I have a question. Hypothetically, had there been an audible difference where the hypex was found lacking in comparison you may have stayed with your AHB2s (inferred from your post). I am curious, is it correct of me to come to this conclusion?
Had there been a discernable audible difference in favour of the AHB2s, I would have kept them.
Pressing the issue, you already had the data and trust the test results. What could you possibly have learned in a non scientific approach to comparing the two?
I didn't expect there to be any audible difference between the AHB2s and the Hypex, but I wanted to be sure and compared them level-matched on some familiar tracks to see if I could detect any difference. I even listened with a mono Hypex and and a bridged AHB2 (level-matched) as a stereo pair.
For me it's not a question of missing something specific, it's the question of what does better sound like and how do I get that better within my very limited means. So mostly it's fomo.
You won't find better sound by looking at amplifiers.

If you haven't already, then take serious stock of your room. Get hold of a microphone (a UMIK-1 costs about US$100), download a free copy of REW, find one of OCA's guides, take some measurements and do some room digital correction. I promise, you will gain more improvement than with any component change.
 
Had there been a discernable audible difference in favour of the AHB2s, I would have kept them.

I didn't expect there to be any audible difference between the AHB2s and the Hypex, but I wanted to be sure and compared them level-matched on some familiar tracks to see if I could detect any difference. I even listened with a mono Hypex and and a bridged AHB2 (level-matched) as a stereo pair.

You won't find better sound by looking at amplifiers.

If you haven't already, then take serious stock of your room. Get hold of a microphone (a UMIK-1 costs about US$100), download a free copy of REW, find one of OCA's guides, take some measurements and do some room digital correction. I promise, you will gain more improvement than with any component change.
Thank you very much for your thoughtful reply, and for not taking offense.
 
If you haven't already, then take serious stock of your room. Get hold of a microphone (a UMIK-1 costs about US$100), download a free copy of REW, find one of OCA's guides, take some measurements and do some room digital correction.
This will be my next purchase and endeavor. I must admit this frightens me more than just a tad. I have no idea how to interpret any of the graphs or charts you both know and understand.

I have come to trust the pink panther and what the consensus seems to be. It's sad, I know, but it is pretty much the best one can expect of me at this stage of my life.
 
This will be my next purchase and endeavor. I must admit this frightens me more than just a tad. I have no idea how to interpret any of the graphs or charts you both know and understand.

I have come to trust the pink panther and what the consensus seems to be. It's sad, I know, but it is pretty much the best one can expect of me at this stage of my life.


There's a really good pdf tutorial linked in the video description.
 
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There's a really good pdf tutorial linked in the video description.
I hope they are better at audio than at typography and visual design. :)
 
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