• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

The founding of ASR

BillH

Active Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 10, 2018
Messages
129
Likes
260
Location
Bedford, MA
Given the recent threads on the ASR logo and panthers I found myself wondering about the very beginning - the founding of ASR. I then had the pleasure of reading some very early postings in the thread about Parlor tricks

So I set off to find the first posts - and now give up....
Besides wanting to know how to compose the right search to find the darn things on this site it would be nice to hear a little bit about the early days of ASR from those who were there...
 
Last edited:

North_Sky

Major Contributor
Joined
Oct 31, 2019
Messages
2,741
Likes
1,554
Location
Kha Nada
Amir is the best positioned to answer your question.
 

amirm

Founder/Admin
Staff Member
CFO (Chief Fun Officer)
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
44,595
Likes
239,589
Location
Seattle Area
I don't think I have ever written it down. So here is a brief one.

Before forming this forum, I co-started another one with a "subjectivist." The idea was to appeal to both camps in audio. It worked for good number of years. Then the wheels came off with my partner getting disillusioned with my views on audio and expressed the same in the forum. The situation got quite ugly behind the scenes and in the forum. It became clear that what I needed to exist in a forum would no longer be something that could be done there.

Thomas was a member there and we had built a relationship. In one of the messages back and forth he said something to the effect of "do you really want to spend your energy fight this?" That was all I needed to radically change directions and think about starting this forum.

My original thought was to start a forum were we review published literature and research in audio and discuss that. You may have seen some of my early efforts on this. We got some subjectivist members and the usual food fights started and went on for a year or so.

Meanwhile I had this Audio Precision analyzer gathering dust at home. I decided to use it to measure some audio tweaks (USB filters and such). That went on for a bit but then someone asked if I would measure a cheap DAC with it. I said sure and started to buy and test DACs in the $100 range. Little did I know that there was a huge audience there for such products, one that was far larger than high-end audio I was focused on in the previous forum. So I bought more and more products to test.

Then the next phase started where people started to loan me gear to test. With many of them being USB devices, I had to buy a new Audio Precision analyzer which set me back near $30,000. At that point, "I was all in" and I decided I needed to do this seriously and committed to very high rate of reviews (almost one a day).

Membership and traffic heavily grew, proving that original content like reviews is key to attracting and retaining membership. Just having a forum where people come and argue with opinion alone has no where near the same traction. Such sites are dime a dozen.

This led to another one liner by a member, @Blumlein 88 I think, saying something like: "we are spending so much time and energy testing things in audio that don't matter as much, while not testing what matters a lot (speakers)." This was last summer. I decided I needed to potentially tackle speakers too. The cadillac system just as Audio Precision was the Klippel Near-field scanner. Alas, that made the Audio Precision look cheap in comparison. Months of pondering eventually led me to make that investment too last fall. The system arrived just before Christmas and here we are.

Today, we enjoy a position that is way ahead of vast majority of audio forums. Only a few sites do better than us. It is a group effort, fueled by much expense and time investment on my part to keep advancing it. Meanwhile the kind commentary and financial support of many members keeps me going.

Last year I polled on us using ads and other sources of funding and the overall view was negative so I have not gone there. Donations from members and my own money are the main currency to make this all work.

As to panthers, I thought my equipment pictures were too boring. So I thought of what to put next the gear and remembered that my wife had given me these Pink Panthers years ago when the movies were popular. I dug them out and put them next to the gear with secret meaning which is now in the open.

I think that is it. Let me know if you have questions.
 

McFly

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Mar 12, 2019
Messages
905
Likes
1,877
Location
NZ
Nothing wrong with (ad) banners either side of the forums main feed. Most screens have the real estate to accommodate this The ones that drive me insane are popup or in between post types.
 

mansr

Major Contributor
Joined
Oct 5, 2018
Messages
4,685
Likes
10,703
Location
Hampshire
As to panthers, I thought my equipment pictures were too boring. So I thought of what to put next the gear and remembered that my wife had given me these Pink Panthers years ago when the movies were popular. I dug them out and put them next to the gear with secret meaning which is now in the open.
How did it lose its head?
 

North_Sky

Major Contributor
Joined
Oct 31, 2019
Messages
2,741
Likes
1,554
Location
Kha Nada
Bob is one of the few members that were/are from the other forum.

Your take is much solider; you came from a long way...before the majority of us, and with much deeper experience from years and years ago ... twenty on other forums, and with your Microsoft knowledge, Harman Kardon's team, the highly knowledgeable people you frequent, your company (sig), etc., etc., etc.
 

Ivanovich

Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 17, 2019
Messages
88
Likes
87
Location
Ellicott City, MD USA
Amir,

Thanks for sharing the back story. It’s great your hard work and perseverance has paid off, even if not literally. You‘re like the patron saint of truth in audio!

Now hurry up with that plate amp will ya, I’m almost ready to test the prototype! ;)
 

amirm

Founder/Admin
Staff Member
CFO (Chief Fun Officer)
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
44,595
Likes
239,589
Location
Seattle Area
How did it lose its head?
I was working on my electronics desk and it was so cluttered. Went to push things aside to make room. Something toppled it and the head became disconnected. The break was clean so I was going to glue it back on but then testing something that didn't perform well. Got the idea of using it for that purpose and here we are.
 

stunta

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 1, 2018
Messages
1,155
Likes
1,401
Location
Boston, MA

mansr

Major Contributor
Joined
Oct 5, 2018
Messages
4,685
Likes
10,703
Location
Hampshire
I was working on my electronics desk and it was so cluttered. Went to push things aside to make room. Something toppled it and the head became disconnected. The break was clean so I was going to glue it back on but then testing something that didn't perform well. Got the idea of using it for that purpose and here we are.
Do you still have the head? I'm sure there's some category of devices it would suit.
 

MZKM

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 1, 2018
Messages
4,250
Likes
11,551
Location
Land O’ Lakes, FL
I don't think I have ever written it down. So here is a brief one.

Before forming this forum, I co-started another one with a "subjectivist." The idea was to appeal to both camps in audio. It worked for good number of years. Then the wheels came off with my partner getting disillusioned with my views on audio and expressed the same in the forum. The situation got quite ugly behind the scenes and in the forum. It became clear that what I needed to exist in a forum would no longer be something that could be done there.

Thomas was a member there and we had built a relationship. In one of the messages back and forth he said something to the effect of "do you really want to spend your energy fight this?" That was all I needed to radically change directions and think about starting this forum.

My original thought was to start a forum were we review published literature and research in audio and discuss that. You may have seen some of my early efforts on this. We got some subjectivist members and the usual food fights started and went on for a year or so.

Meanwhile I had this Audio Precision analyzer gathering dust at home. I decided to use it to measure some audio tweaks (USB filters and such). That went on for a bit but then someone asked if I would measure a cheap DAC with it. I said sure and started to buy and test DACs in the $100 range. Little did I know that there was a huge audience there for such products, one that was far larger than high-end audio I was focused on in the previous forum. So I bought more and more products to test.

Then the next phase started where people started to loan me gear to test. With many of them being USB devices, I had to buy a new Audio Precision analyzer which set me back near $30,000. At that point, "I was all in" and I decided I needed to do this seriously and committed to very high rate of reviews (almost one a day).

Membership and traffic heavily grew, proving that original content like reviews is key to attracting and retaining membership. Just having a forum where people come and argue with opinion alone has no where near the same traction. Such sites are dime a dozen.

This led to another one liner by a member, @Blumlein 88 I think, saying something like: "we are spending so much time and energy testing things in audio that don't matter as much, while not testing what matters a lot (speakers)." This was last summer. I decided I needed to potentially tackle speakers too. The cadillac system just as Audio Precision was the Klippel Near-field scanner. Alas, that made the Audio Precision look cheap in comparison. Months of pondering eventually led me to make that investment too last fall. The system arrived just before Christmas and here we are.

Today, we enjoy a position that is way ahead of vast majority of audio forums. Only a few sites do better than us. It is a group effort, fueled by much expense and time investment on my part to keep advancing it. Meanwhile the kind commentary and financial support of many members keeps me going.

Last year I polled on us using ads and other sources of funding and the overall view was negative so I have not gone there. Donations from members and my own money are the main currency to make this all work.

As to panthers, I thought my equipment pictures were too boring. So I thought of what to put next the gear and remembered that my wife had given me these Pink Panthers years ago when the movies were popular. I dug them out and put them next to the gear with secret meaning which is now in the open.

I think that is it. Let me know if you have questions.
More a question about your background; I know that you worked on the audio software/ digital media stuff at Microsoft and you worked at Sony, but someone in another forum referred to you as an “ex Microsoft amplifier design engineer”, which I couldn’t find you every talking about that (the user also said it’s stated on your LinkedIn, which I couldn’t find and asked where and was just directed to look harder...).
 

pozz

Слава Україні
Forum Donor
Editor
Joined
May 21, 2019
Messages
4,036
Likes
6,827

pacdpm

Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Oct 20, 2019
Messages
24
Likes
22
Mr. M... with all gratitude...... CENT'ANNI....it's probably gonna take that long before I see a review of COCKTAIL AUDIO X50D...X45PRO....AUDIOCONTROL X9 (or X7)...Oh and don't forget to get into TVs Very Important and then there's always room treatments....In other words..thanks for ALL the invaluable insights....and education you've provided....Paul
 

6sigma

Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Apr 20, 2019
Messages
77
Likes
61
Location
The South
What are those? I hope you are not talking about stereophile.

With or without naming "those other sites," I'd be interested in what @amirm considers better & what might be required in additional donations or membership to become as good or even better than they are.
 

amirm

Founder/Admin
Staff Member
CFO (Chief Fun Officer)
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
44,595
Likes
239,589
Location
Seattle Area
What are those? I hope you are not talking about stereophile.
We past stereophile last year. I just looked and they are a bit ahead of us but not in a material way.

The ones that are pretty far ahead are head-fi, AVS, and DIYAudio. The first two are 10X more busy than us so we have a long way to go.
 

amirm

Founder/Admin
Staff Member
CFO (Chief Fun Officer)
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
44,595
Likes
239,589
Location
Seattle Area
With or without naming "those other sites," I'd be interested in what @amirm considers better & what might be required in additional donations or membership to become as good or even better than they are.
The best thing is spreading the word.
 

DonH56

Master Contributor
Technical Expert
Forum Donor
Joined
Mar 15, 2016
Messages
7,880
Likes
16,666
Location
Monument, CO
More a question about your background; I know that you worked on the audio software/ digital media stuff at Microsoft and you worked at Sony, but someone in another forum referred to you as an “ex Microsoft amplifier design engineer”, which I couldn’t find you every talking about that (the user also said it’s stated on your LinkedIn, which I couldn’t find and asked where and was just directed to look harder...).

Look here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/a-bit-about-your-host.1906/

Amir has a long and storied background with a depth and breadth far beyond most of us.
 

McFly

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Mar 12, 2019
Messages
905
Likes
1,877
Location
NZ
The only way you'll get close to AVS is testing more AVRs and having a (more structured) multichannel forum subsection or a sister forum called HTSR.

The only way youll get close to HeadFi is, well.. you won't. They arent science people. I'd like to think the surround sound guys are though, being the whole pro audio and rack mount type etc
 
Top Bottom