The Courteous Vinyl Playback Discussion

[antcollinet]

When playing loud, I can easily feel strong vibrations in my feet through the floor. I would assume those vibrations will also affect the turntable, but that is only based on how much it is affected by my very light knocking on the surface underneath the player.

All this may be totally unnecessary, but it's fun to optimize things.

If the feet were expensive - send them back if you can.


In a similar situation I attained excellent isolation by using car soundproofing material sandwiched between the furniture and a heavy section of old oak door, and between that piece of wood, and the feet of the turntable. Marble worktop offcuts or tiles, or nicely finished paving slabs are probably suitable alternatives to the oak.

something like this:

Yaheetech 12 PCS Car Sound Proofing Mat, Flexible Trim Mat Car Sound Proofing, Vehicle Insulation Self Adhesive Closed Cell Foam, Sound Deadening Sheet, 50cm X 30cm, Black : Amazon.co.uk: Automotive

Yaheetech 12 PCS Car Sound Proofing Mat, Flexible Trim Mat Car Sound Proofing, Vehicle Insulation Self Adhesive Closed Cell Foam, Sound Deadening Sheet, 50cm X 30cm, Black : Amazon.co.uk: Automotive

www.amazon.co.uk

 

[Soniclife]

When playing loud, I can easily feel strong vibrations in my feet through the floor. I would assume those vibrations will also affect the turntable, but that is only based on how much it is affected by my very light knocking on the surface underneath the player.

All this may be totally unnecessary, but it's fun to optimize things.

I used to want to move my TT to my office which shares a wall with the lounge, it would have reduced this vibration hugely. But the reports from others that have done this don't all go the way your expect, some people preferred the extra reverb, and moved it back. My hunch is that I would be the same, if I want objective accuracy I play digital, if I want some extra seasoning I play vinyl. Making recordings with speakers loud, and turned off, will let you hear what is gained and lost, and will give you a benchmark to aim for.

 

[Bob from Florida]

I have come to the conclusion that the feet on my Technics 1200GR aren't sufficient enough to dampen vibrations. When the needle is playing a silent part on a record, and I knock very slightly on the furniture underneath the turntable, it can easily be heard through the loudspeakers.

I have bought damping feet that I place underneath the existing feet. This works great and I can no longer hear any problems when knocking on the furniture, but the new problem is that the turntable doesn't stand sturdy enough with these extra feet directly under the existing feet. So now I'm looking for something like a surface that I can place between the existing feet and the dampening feet, something like a piece of thick glass or something made of wood.

What type of material do you think will work best, some dense wooden material, or a thick sheet of glass?

I did this last year and have been satisfied. Once in place, the feet are very stable. A bonus for me was the ability to store stuff under the table that wouldn’t fit otherwise.

The Courteous Vinyl Playback Discussion

i don't think we can elaborate a "thesis" about cleaning ... because the "hypothesis" doesn't have a clear aspect: record status. what i said (in my experience) i also saw it in the opinions here: used records improvements can be from low to exponential and brand new records usually are low...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[goat76]

If the feet were expensive - send them back if you can.


In a similar situation I attained excellent isolation by using car soundproofing material sandwiched between the furniture and a heavy section of old oak door, and between that piece of wood, and the feet of the turntable. Marble worktop offcuts or tiles, or nicely finished paving slabs are probably suitable alternatives to the oak.

something like this:

Yaheetech 12 PCS Car Sound Proofing Mat, Flexible Trim Mat Car Sound Proofing, Vehicle Insulation Self Adhesive Closed Cell Foam, Sound Deadening Sheet, 50cm X 30cm, Black : Amazon.co.uk: Automotive

Yaheetech 12 PCS Car Sound Proofing Mat, Flexible Trim Mat Car Sound Proofing, Vehicle Insulation Self Adhesive Closed Cell Foam, Sound Deadening Sheet, 50cm X 30cm, Black : Amazon.co.uk: Automotive

www.amazon.co.uk

The feet are very cheap, only $16.

They are Sylomer pads, which are well-documented and widely used here in Sweden. I already use them for my subwoofers for my bookshelf speakers. The feet are made for different weights.

I dare to say that Sylomer is one of the best damping material you can find. It’s stiff enough to hold the weight, but still soft enough to squeeze just enough to be effective as a dampening material.

 

[antcollinet]

The feet are very cheap, only $16.

They are Sylomer pads, which are well-documented and widely used here in Sweden. I already use them for my subwoofers for my bookshelf speakers. The feet are made for different weights.

I dare to say that Sylomer is one of the best damping material you can find. It’s stiff enough to hold the weight, but still soft enough to squeeze just enough to be effective as a dampening material.
View attachment 522325

Then they will be fine under a slab of material such as wood/tiles/slabs etc I mentioned earlier - doing pretty much the same job as the sound insulation material I used.

Good thing is you can get that sort of stuff inexpensively and experiment to see how they work. Even a large wooden chopping board would be worth trying, as long as you can get one big enough for all your turntable feet to fit on.

This one would fit mine:

https://www.ikea.com/gb/en/p/aptitlig-butchers-block-bamboo-00233429/

 

[goat76]

Then they will be fine under a slab of material such as wood/tiles/slabs etc I mentioned earlier - doing pretty much the same job as the sound insulation material I used.

Good thing is you can get that sort of stuff inexpensively and experiment to see how they work. Even a large wooden chopping board would be worth trying, as long as you can get one big enough for all your turntable feet to fit on.

This one would fit mine:

https://www.ikea.com/gb/en/p/aptitlig-butchers-block-bamboo-00233429/

That Ikea cutting board is exactly the same size as the measurements of my Technics turntable. I probably end up ordering one of those. Thank you for the suggestion.

 

[MattHooper]

My equipment rack that holds my turntable is on a very springy wood floor and vibrations get to the turntable very easily especially footsteps.

I tried tons of different materials as isolation (many of the standard recommendations) but nothing came close to the effectiveness of spring-based pods beneath the turntable base:

Not that I’m recommending it for any other situation where a simpler, cheaper version of isolation would do. Just chiming in with a bit of my own experience.

 

[Thomas_A]

My Linn Axis has no adjustable feet so I had a plan to sandwich two MDF with damping glue + add adjustable feet to level it. But calculating work time + material costs I changed my mind and bought the Fluance IB40 isolation board instead, having adjustable feet.

 

[rdenney]

Does anyone have any experience with the Nanocamp Blue Belts offered by Dindiki out of Germany? They are molded silicone with no joint, so materially different from the butyl or neoprene “official” belts. The subjectivist forums like them, but as usual unpersuasively. Target turntables are my Linn Axis (which uses the same belt as the LP12) and Thorens TD166.

On the Thorens, belts don’t seem to last a year but I gather Thorens decks are hard on belts. And stock aging has to be a problem, in addition to fakes. The only problem with Linn belts is that they are ridiculously expensive from authorized sources. The Blue Belts are much more affordable.

Rick “tired of replacing Thorens belts” Denney

 

[rdenney]

My Linn Axis has no adjustable feet so I had a plan to sandwich two MDF with damping glue + add adjustable feet to level it. But calculating work time + material costs I changed my mind and bought the Fluance IB40 isolation board instead, having adjustable feet.

I’m using black cardboard beer coasters as shims plus adjusting the suspension feet, which Linn says is a feature.

I find the Axis less subject to floor vibration effects compared to the spring-suspended Thorens TD166 that used to be there. But I know which floor joist is going to be a problem and I don’t step on it with any momentum.

Rick “got it pretty close on an unlevel cabinet” Denney

 

[Bob from Florida]

Does anyone have any experience with the Nanocamp Blue Belts offered by Dindiki out of Germany? They are molded silicone with no joint, so materially different from the butyl or neoprene “official” belts. The subjectivist forums like them, but as usual unpersuasively. Target turntables are my Linn Axis (which uses the same belt as the LP12) and Thorens TD166.

On the Thorens, belts don’t seem to last a year but I gather Thorens decks are hard on belts. And stock aging has to be a problem, in addition to fakes. The only problem with Linn belts is that they are ridiculously expensive from authorized sources. The Blue Belts are much more affordable.

Rick “tired of replacing Thorens belts” Denney

I used that belt on my Clearaudio before I upgraded to the SL1300G. Excellent quality belt, better than stock.

 

[Thomas_A]

I’m using black cardboard beer coasters as shims plus adjusting the suspension feet, which Linn says is a feature.

I find the Axis less subject to floor vibration effects compared to the spring-suspended Thorens TD166 that used to be there. But I know which floor joist is going to be a problem and I don’t step on it with any momentum.

Rick “got it pretty close on an unlevel cabinet” Denney

The suspension feet adjustments have dual "functions", adjusting the top board being flat and adjusting the inneplatter axis vs. the pulley axis. For optimum belt tracking the two axes should be parallel.

 

[Thomas_A]

Does anyone have any experience with the Nanocamp Blue Belts offered by Dindiki out of Germany? They are molded silicone with no joint, so materially different from the butyl or neoprene “official” belts. The subjectivist forums like them, but as usual unpersuasively. Target turntables are my Linn Axis (which uses the same belt as the LP12) and Thorens TD166.

On the Thorens, belts don’t seem to last a year but I gather Thorens decks are hard on belts. And stock aging has to be a problem, in addition to fakes. The only problem with Linn belts is that they are ridiculously expensive from authorized sources. The Blue Belts are much more affordable.

Rick “tired of replacing Thorens belts” Denney

Belts are a mess. I think belts coming folded in those small plastic bags cause them to be deformed. They should be stored and delivered folded in a perfect circle.

If you take a belt and hang it by your finger, the fold should be symmetric on each side no matter what position you hang it. None of my two new belts are symmetric; the Thakker belt has "bends" in four corners and has a square shape. I am doing some experiments to see if they can be fixed or if that deformation is permanent.

 

[rdenney]

The suspension feet adjustments have dual "functions", adjusting the top board being flat and adjusting the inneplatter axis vs. the pulley axis. For optimum belt tracking the two axes should be parallel.

Yeah, but I get it pretty close with the beer coasters.

Rick “belt tracks fine” Denney

 

[Thomas_A]

Yeah, but I get it pretty close with the beer coasters.

Rick “belt tracks fine” Denney

If you turn the outer platter upside down you can make a movie of the belt tracking on the pulley. It should be steady and not oscillate even a fraction of a mm. If it does, it indicates belt incosistency.

 

[rdenney]

Belts are a mess. I think belts coming folded in those small plastic bags cause them to be deformed. They should be stored and delivered folded in a perfect circle.

If you take a belt and hang it by your finger, the fold should be symmetric on each side no matter what position you hang it. None of my two new belts are symmetric; the Thakker belt has "bends" in four corners and has a square shape. I am doing some experiments to see if they can be fixed or if that deformation is permanent.

The silicone Blue Belt shouldn’t take a set the way butyl rubber will. The do instruct the user to make sure the inside surface as molded is used inside, and that is determined by loosely hanging it both ways and using the orientation that hangs with the smallest radii. But that’s the molded shape. Silicone is more elastic and less plastic than butyl, and less subject to creep. It’s also far more temperature-stable, but that feature isn’t much use in this application.

Rick “whether any of this is really important is another matter, but I ordered a couple” Denney

 

[MattHooper]

Belts are a mess. I think belts coming folded in those small plastic bags cause them to be deformed. They should be stored and delivered folded in a perfect circle.

If you take a belt and hang it by your finger, the fold should be symmetric on each side no matter what position you hang it. None of my two new belts are symmetric; the Thakker belt has "bends" in four corners and has a square shape. I am doing some experiments to see if they can be fixed or if that deformation is permanent.

I’ve got a spare belt and maybe I should take it out of the bag and store it in a circle?

 

[Thomas_A]

I’ve got a spare belt and maybe I should take it out of the bag and store it in a circle?

You can always check it by hanging it around your finger. Turn it so at it hangs a different positions. Look at the belt and it should be symmetric at all positions. It there is a slightest kink or bend of the belt it is deformed. Long term storage should be in a circle perhaps around a fixed support at minimal tension.

 

[somebodyelse]

I’ve got a spare belt and maybe I should take it out of the bag and store it in a circle?

Or maybe just give it the hot water treatment then some talc before use? It does bring into question the common recommendation to replace the belt every 1/2/5 years, depending on who you ask, since the new belts performed significantly worse than the old one as supplied. With the gaps between the posts I've lost track of whether the hot water brought the new ones up to the level of the old one or not.

 

[goat76]

It seems somewhat problematic to use a belt-driven turntable. I'm glad I opted for a direct drive, as I'm not keen on too much maintenance. And speaking of maintenance, I do realize it's pretty much unavoidable with any turntable, not having to fiddle with things, but it seems like Technics has thought of everything, making it very easy to adjust everything in the construction of their turntables. Besides the direct drive, it has height adjustments for the feet, an easily adjustable height of the tonearm with good precision, a gauge for alignment of the length position of the cartridge, and the anti-skating wheel is as easy as it can be. Anyone can probably set this turntable up without any external help, even if they are a complete novice like me.