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The Case Against OLED

amirm

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Our cost of entertainment services (cable bill) is about $260/month. Over just one year we pay over $3000! The cost of the display to watch that on then becomes nothing amortized over a few years. So to the extent we are talking about just a few thousand dollars for the display, I would get the best and be done with it. For me, this became OLED once price gap shrank and sizes increased.

For dedicated theater, the largest ones are still too small regardless of cost. Our projection screen is 144 inches wide which translates into 165 inches diagonal. We could go to a slightly smaller size to get a direct screen but we are way far from that. Until then, we will have to put up with dim projectors.
 

JSmith

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At that price you'd be much better off getting a projection system for your home theatre room
Agree... although a projector won't get you OLED blacks.
Going down to 77" they can get an OLED for about $2,000. However, if you go to QLED you can get an 85" TV for under 1K and a very highly rated QLED for about $2,000.
If watching TV in medium to high ambient light conditions, often a QLED is better in this situation having a higher peak brightness.
there is no way I would want to watch a 65" OLED over an 85" LED TV
Well this part comes down to what screen size is appropriate for the viewing distance... one doesn't get an 85" TV when sitting 1.2m away. On that note, if people are going to be watching 4K sources, it can be a pointless endeavour if sitting too far away or the screen is too small for the viewing distance, visual acuity etc.
optimal-viewing-distance-television-graph-size.png



JSmith
 

Tks

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Me too, still holding on to my 10+ years old Panasonic 46' Plasma. The intention is to replace it with an OLED. Besides the level of black, the viewing angle is also better than LCD.
There is a new "Quantum OLED" from Samsung. Not to be confused with their "QLED". Apparently it's the first OLED from Samsung. Reviews seem quite good, will be checking it out.
Yeah, QD-OLED, Sony's implementation of Samsung's panel in their latest Bravia A95K is basically the best television on the market currently for typical sized televisions at humanly approachable prices (MicroLED folks please spare me).

One thing I don't get with all the people praising Plasma colors in this thread, all of these televisions are sporting long outdated color gamuts, and panel bit depths, that being 8-bit. All OLED panels today are sporting 10-bit panels, which allow for far more color gradation, and that paired with wider color gamut, you're basically looking at far better color rendition once calibrated.

I'm still using a 42' Panasonic Plasma, but I don't hold to these silly platitudes from yesteryear about Plasma being the best for something like color or image quality overall compared to the upper tier televisions of today. One thing I will say though, the viewing angles, both vertical and horizontal are pretty spectacular, with very little color shift which I never really bothered to think much about and only noticed when I went TV shopping recently in store.
 

bboris77

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Yeah, QD-OLED, Sony's implementation of Samsung's panel in their latest Bravia A95K is basically the best television on the market currently for typical sized televisions at humanly approachable prices (MicroLED folks please spare me).

One thing I don't get with all the people praising Plasma colors in this thread, all of these televisions are sporting long outdated color gamuts, and panel bit depths, that being 8-bit. All OLED panels today are sporting 10-bit panels, which allow for far more color gradation, and that paired with wider color gamut, you're basically looking at far better color rendition once calibrated.

I'm still using a 42' Panasonic Plasma, but I don't hold to these silly platitudes from yesteryear about Plasma being the best for something like color or image quality overall compared to the upper tier televisions of today. One thing I will say though, the viewing angles, both vertical and horizontal are pretty spectacular, with very little color shift which I never really bothered to think much about and only noticed when I went TV shopping recently in store.
Like I said in my post earlier, it is all about motion resolution for me when it comes to plasma. It was the only technology that managed to preserve most of the resolution once there was any motion, especially during camera panning. As a big fan of soccer which includes a lot of camera movement, I still have not found a TV that can do what CRT or Plasma could when it comes to motion at standard broadcast rates of 60hz.
 

Keith_W

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Am I the only one who can't spot the difference between panels? If I go to a TV shop and look at the OLED and QLED side by side, I honestly can't see the difference in picture quality. The only difference I see are the price and the size. I am hardly a TV expert and yes I know there are measurable differences, but somehow I haven't tuned my eyes to spot them the way I can hear differences between speakers or taste the difference between wines. That might be a very good thing!

Having said that, I did go for a 65" Sony OLED a few years ago. That thing is annoying, it takes so long to launch the Netflix or Youtube apps. Are modern TV's faster?
 

Marc v E

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Am I the only one who can't spot the difference between panels? If I go to a TV shop and look at the OLED and QLED side by side, I honestly can't see the difference in picture quality. The only difference I see are the price and the size. I am hardly a TV expert and yes I know there are measurable differences, but somehow I haven't tuned my eyes to spot them the way I can hear differences between speakers or taste the difference between wines. That might be a very good thing!

Having said that, I did go for a 65" Sony OLED a few years ago. That thing is annoying, it takes so long to launch the Netflix or Youtube apps. Are modern TV's faster?
Maybe a chromecast ultra would be enough to solve that problem?
 

JaMaSt

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My 2013 60 inch Panasonic Plasma is still going strong. The Viera OS was pretty much DOA, but for sports (which is pretty much all I watch) I'm fine with it.
 

JSmith

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I still have not found a TV that can do what CRT or Plasma could when it comes to motion at standard broadcast rates of 60hz.
Have you tried a TV with BFI (black frame insertion)? This should mitigate the effects of sample and hold.
Since OLEDs don't have a backlight and can turn individual pixels off completely, they can achieve the same effect with even more efficiency.
One thing I don't get with all the people praising Plasma colors in this thread, all of these televisions are sporting long outdated color gamuts, and panel bit depths, that being 8-bit. All OLED panels today are sporting 10-bit panels, which allow for far more color gradation, and that paired with wider color gamut, you're basically looking at far better color rendition once calibrated.
Yep, agree... :cool:


JSmith
 

Kachda

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One thing I don't get with all the people praising Plasma colors in this thread, all of these televisions are sporting long outdated color gamuts, and panel bit depths, that being 8-bit. All OLED panels today are sporting 10-bit panels, which allow for far more color gradation, and that paired with wider color gamut, you're basically looking at far better color rendition once calibrated.
It could possibly be because I was using LCD monitors before that. So the 42" Plasma was spectacularly better than anything I had seen before. The improvement to picture quality (if any) from there to OLED doesn't seem as substantial, though of course weight and power savings are much better.
 

Philbo King

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It only cost me $50 to fix it and it's been going for almost 20 years now. If I bought the extended warranty it would have been a net loss.
Glad that worked out for you. Worked out for us also. Win/win
 

Philbo King

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Am I the only one who can't spot the difference between panels? If I go to a TV shop and look at the OLED and QLED side by side, I honestly can't see the difference in picture quality. The only difference I see are the price and the size. I am hardly a TV expert and yes I know there are measurable differences, but somehow I haven't tuned my eyes to spot them the way I can hear differences between speakers or taste the difference between wines. That might be a very good thing!

Having said that, I did go for a 65" Sony OLED a few years ago. That thing is annoying, it takes so long to launch the Netflix or Youtube apps. Are modern TV's faster?
The only 'smart TV' I've ever seen that is truly smart (didn't need a Roku or Firestick or whatever to give it brains) is our current Samsung. It has a remote with voice commands. I can tell it to hunt for a show or movie or start a streaming service and it does it. By comparison, every other TV/Bluray player we've had is dumb as a bag of hammers, making me suspect the software was coded by unpaid summer interns.
 

bboris77

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Have you tried a TV with BFI (black frame insertion)? This should mitigate the effects of sample and hold.


Yep, agree... :cool:


JSmith
BFI does help a lot, but it significantly diminishes the light output which is already average on OLEDs. On IPS monitors, it is more effective, but borderline not necessary when running 120Hz as motion resolution gets very respectable. My main issue is motion resolution on 60Hz sources which is 99% of sports broadcasts on TV. Engaging BFI on 60Hz sources tends to create very visible flickering which is worse than CRT flicker IMO.

Plus, I hate the soap opera effect that fake 120Hz motion interpolation gives to 60Hz native content. I would rather live with the mild sample and hold blurriness. This is why I am hoping my plasma lives another few years until a solution to the problem is found.
 

Rufus T. Firefly

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I've purchased three TV's in the past two months and spent a considerable amount of time comparing pictures at my local Best Buy.

I like Sony's. I'm a huge fan of their Master Series line and was lucky enough to find a 48 inch on massive sale ($799 no sales tax/free shipping) from Crutchfield. It's magnificent and though it was planned to be in a guest bedroom I'm not able to part with it in the living room as our main TV.

I'm setting up a media room on our third floor and went with a 75" 90K (the full array model) instead of the 65" 80K OLED. The picture is very nice but it's hard to look at critically because I now know how great great can be.

I have a few words of advice that I don't think have been mentioned here. TV's on display are jacked up on a vivid or "retail" setting and those settings are not usually recommended for normal day to day viewing. The Sony mini LED looks far brighter than the Sony OLED's but the difference isn't all that great when all are on standard or cinema settings. Our living The viewing angle for OLEDs is far superior than LED's. IMHO the LED's degrade pretty quickly off center. I wouldn't spend the money for an 8K as there really isn't much in the way of content.

TV's are super cheap right now and it's a pretty great time to pull the trigger if you're on the fence. Might get a little cheaper when the new years models roll in this spring but I wouldn't expect much.
 

Sal1950

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Contrary to many claims, OLED still are susceptible to screen burn.
I wouldn't dare use one as an alternative PC screen as I often do and then fall
asleep with ASR or whatever on the tube.
 

JSmith

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Plus, I hate the soap opera effect that fake 120Hz motion interpolation gives to 60Hz native content.
Yes it's horrible... turn that off. Many models have separate deblur and dejudder settings now, so best to have deblur off completely.


JSmith
 

Bleib

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Contrary to many claims, OLED still are susceptible to screen burn.
I wouldn't dare use one as an alternative PC screen as I often do and then fall
asleep with ASR or whatever on the tube.
Yes it still happens. But it's possible to make sure that a screensaver goes on after a certain time or even the screen itself turning off without user input.

The problem with OLED monitors for me is mainly the picture structure as it is not very suitable for text. This could be fixed by higher dotpitch but it probably won't come out this year anyway.

The ultimate technology appears to be microled.
 

Sal1950

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Yes it still happens. But it's possible to make sure that a screensaver goes on after a certain time or even the screen itself turning off without user input.
Sure but as the saying goes, shit happens.
I had a very expensive rear projection set ruined by station logo's back in the 90s.
Once bitten, twice shy. LOL

I'm looking to replace my $4k 75" Sony XBR75X940D soon and this time it will something else, maybe Samsung ???
The first one blew up in 8 months, now the warranty replacement looks like this after 3 years. :mad:

smearing.jpg
 

dshreter

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I would imagine there are many homes that don’t have space for a TV much bigger than 50” - 65”. Last I checked, OLED was the best picture quality in that range.

They are not ideal in bright rooms, but they’re still very good, and they have noticeable benefits when used at night.

That’s the situation in multiple rooms in my house, so I have a hard time relating to OP’s thesis.
 

Sal1950

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I would imagine there are many homes that don’t have space for a TV much bigger than 50” - 65”. Last I checked, OLED was the best picture quality in that range.

They are not ideal in bright rooms, but they’re still very good, and they have noticeable benefits when used at night.

That’s the situation in multiple rooms in my house, so I have a hard time relating to OP’s thesis.
Sure, both types have their strenghts and weaknesses when evaluated honestly.
Only you can determine whats best for your situation.
 
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