Superlux HD668B Review (headphone)

[Tup3x]

I do have HD668B... IMO it's a physical and aural torture device. Hurts to use it in so many ways.

 

[AnalogSteph]

You get what you pay for, though I would argue that basic driver performance is pretty darn solid if a bit unrefined. They are pretty much made as cheaply as they can be at this price point, and better don't think about working conditions too much.

Anything even remotely comparable in both sound quality and formfactor used to cost like 3 times as much. At least you've got options now.

 

[abdo123]

You get what you pay for, though I would argue that basic driver performance is pretty darn solid if a bit unrefined. They are pretty much made as cheaply as they can be at this price point, and better don't think about working conditions too much.

Anything even remotely comparable in both sound quality and formfactor used to cost like 3 times as much. At least you've got options now.

I have to very much agree. While the build quality and comfort are very questionable, they're really beasts tonality wise with EQ.

 

[3125b]

Just tried the suggested EQ for these and for me, it's really good (and badly needed). I lowered both low shelfs by one dB because I think it makes the bass a little more precise.
With EQ, these are actually good for casual listening. They still need better pads though.
A few things to add:
The headband thingies are adjustable, you just have to pull really hard. When it feels like you are about to break these seemingly flimsy headphones, that's about right

 

[abdo123]

Just tried the suggested EQ for these and for me, it's really good (and badly needed). I lowered both low shelfs by one dB because I think it makes the bass a little more precise.
With EQ, these are actually good for casual listening. They still need better pads though.
A few things to add:
The headband thingies are adjustable, you just have to pull really hard. When it feels like you are about to break these seemingly flimsy headphones, that's about right

on page two of this thread there is EQ settings by user @Maiky76 (Maiky if you're reading this, thank you!)

The settings are actually amazing and I slightly prefer them over Amir's

check them out.

 

[Chrise36]

Ar these better than the Superlux HD681 EVO? I also own the AKG 240 and the Marantz Pro HPM 2. Any experience on their differences? The Marantz takes eq well cause it has too much bass but the midrange and the treble is lacking a bit.

 

[solderdude]

HD668 and HD681EVO differ massively.
I would not call one better than the other... just very different.

 

[aasearles]

Ar these better than the Superlux HD681 EVO? I also own the AKG 240 and the Marantz Pro HPM 2. Any experience on their differences? The Marantz takes eq well cause it has too much bass but the midrange and the treble is lacking a bit.

I own both pairs of the HD668 that Amir reviewed. One is still new in box, the other I've used regularly for about 3 months. I've compared the HD668 against Sennheiser 58x, AKG 371, Beyer HD880, and Beyer HD770. I have no experience with AKG 240 or Superlux HD681 EVO.

Aside from comfort issues (they are not wearable more than an hour on my ears), the biggest drawback for me with the HD668 is their lack of deep bass response. Even with very boosted EQ, they just aren't able to produce the 40Hz-down region with the same authority as the Senn 58x and AKG 371. I prefer a ramped up bottom end, so this may not be a huge deal for listeners who prefer a flatter response.

I'm thinking about selling one of the HD668 pairs. If you're interested in a good deal on either, please send me a message.

 

[Chrise36]

HD668 and HD681EVO differ massively.
I would not call one better than the other... just very different.

Can you describe if the 681 has audible distortion and their sound in general?

 

[Chrise36]

HD668 and HD681EVO differ massively.
I would not call one better than the other... just very different.

Can you describe if the 681 has audible distortion and their sound in general

I own both pairs of the HD668 that Amir reviewed. One is still new in box, the other I've used regularly for about 3 months. I've compared the HD668 against Sennheiser 58x, AKG 371, Beyer HD880, and Beyer HD770. I have no experience with AKG 240 or Superlux HD681 EVO.

Aside from comfort issues (they are not wearable more than an hour on my ears), the biggest drawback for me with the HD668 is their lack of deep bass response. Even with very boosted EQ, they just aren't able to produce the 40Hz-down region with the same authority as the Senn 58x and AKG 371. I prefer a ramped up bottom end, so this may not be a huge deal for listeners who prefer a flatter response.

I'm thinking about selling one of the HD668 pairs. If you're interested in a good deal on either, please send me a message.

Thanks but i am interested in the 681

 

[solderdude]

I already described the HD681 (red) and HD681EVO

 

[Chrise36]

I already described the HD681 (red) and HD681EVO

Ok thanks

 

[abm0]

basic driver performance is pretty darn solid if a bit unrefined. They are pretty much made as cheaply as they can be at this price point

Exactly, and this is why I can't believe people are still seriously evaluating them in stock form, with 0 hours of break-in. Even just "measuring" them with my phone's mic showed smoothness differences in the treble visible from orbit, after 50h of break-in with frequency sweeps. (Attached image shows them at 0h, 50h, 100h and 200h, unfortunately I decided to switch microphones after the first 2 "measurements" and used the other end of the HTC One M7 phone for the last 2, because I got the impression it was a better mic.)

You break them in and the needed EQ can get much simpler, you could even get away with just adding some paper layers in front of the driver and you've got a massive price/performance winner. If only they had put in a proper headband like they did for the Evo models or the old 681 or old 662, and better pads, they would compete head to head with the 662 Evo even today.

 

[markanini]

What's the best mod to hone in 5-9kHz keeping the rest as it is? I'm thinking foam discs or tissue paper in between the drivers and pads.

 

[Feelas]

Exactly, and this is why I can't believe people are still seriously evaluating them in stock form, with 0 hours of break-in. Even just "measuring" them with my phone's mic showed smoothness differences in the treble visible from orbit, after 50h of break-in with frequency sweeps. (Attached image shows them at 0h, 50h, 100h and 200h, unfortunately I decided to switch microphones after the first 2 "measurements" and used the other end of the HTC One M7 phone for the last 2, because I got the impression it was a better mic.)

You break them in and the needed EQ can get much simpler, you could even get away with just adding some paper layers in front of the driver and you've got a massive price/performance winner. If only they had put in a proper headband like they did for the Evo models or the old 681 or old 662, and better pads, they would compete head to head with the 662 Evo even today.

Driver break-in is a myth, your perception does learn how to mitigate the most obvious problems though in a period of a few weeks.

 

[solderdude]

It's a little confusing whether this is HD688B or HD668B.

Here is the HD688


https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/brand-superlux/hd688/

 

[abm0]

Driver break-in is a myth, your perception does learn how to mitigate the most obvious problems though in a period of a few weeks.

My perception had nothing to do with it, I broke them in for 200h and measured them every 50h before using them to listen to music for any length of time. I tried a couple of songs along the way and they seemed to go from piercing and unbearable to just generally bright but bearable, but that's not what I based my break-in conclusion on, I based it on what the microphone got from them, which you can see in the attached picture.

Break-in is definitely not a myth, it's been demonstrated and measured multiple times, most obviously in (sub)woofers but also in headphones, even in Tyll Hertsens' experiment where he strangely decided to claim there was no difference even though you can clearly see it in his results. The myth that there is no such thing as break-in is perpetuated because too many times the experiment is performed with high-quality headphones that have no room for change left (they probably get broken in just by going through the testing/QC that high-quality headphones go through at the factory). Test it with cheapo sets like the 668B and you will find that break-in is very much a reality even in headphones, just not every headphone. It's physics, it's what happens to elastic materials after some exercise, you can't go around just flat out denying that.

 

[Feelas]

My perception had nothing to do with it, I broke them in for 200h and measured them every 50h before using them to listen to music for any length of time. I tried a couple of songs along the way and they seemed to go from piercing and unbearable to just generally bright but bearable, but that's not what I based my break-in conclusion on, I based it on what the microphone got from them, which you can see in the attached picture.

Break-in is definitely not a myth, it's been demonstrated and measured multiple times, most obviously in (sub)woofers but also in headphones, even in Tyll Hertsens' experiment where he strangely decided to claim there was no difference even though you can clearly see it in his results. The myth that there is no such thing as break-in is perpetuated because too many times the experiment is performed with high-quality headphones that have no room for change left (they probably get broken in just by going through the testing/QC that high-quality headphones go through at the factory). Test it with cheapo sets like the 668B and you will find that break-in is very much a reality even in headphones, just not every headphone. It's physics, it's what happens to elastic materials after some exercise, you can't go around just flat out denying that.

I mean you could show it on FR or THD if break-in wasn't just a myth. I remember that Tyll has shown that it just doesn't work, since there was no repeatable difference which could be attributed to break-in only and that makes sense. Not to mention that he didn't assess any kind of statistical significance of the results.

Assuming that The myth that there is no such thing as break-in is perpetuated because too many times the experiment is performed with high-quality headphones that have no room for change left (they probably get broken in just by going through the testing/QC that high-quality headphones go through at the factory is incorrect, since it has been reported anecdotally on gear of whatever QC levels.

You can go around just flat out denying that, since no of break-in believers have shown how this supposed elastic material break-in applies to small dynamic drivers, presumably even ones found in IEMs. Even for guitar speaker cabinets utilizing 12" - 15" it is not so clear that break-in does happen.

You could try talking @solderdude or @amirm to running a burn-in experiment on any type of measurement fixture for 100-200h and seeing what happens over time. Any kind of methodology without fixed placement stinks funny. How did you measure it? Everything above 300-400Hz is highly directional, thus placement sensitive.

 

[Robbo99999]

I mean you could show it on FR or THD if break-in wasn't just a myth. I remember that Tyll has shown that it just doesn't work, since there was no repeatable difference which could be attributed to break-in only and that makes sense. Not to mention that he didn't assess any kind of statistical significance of the results.

Assuming that The myth that there is no such thing as break-in is perpetuated because too many times the experiment is performed with high-quality headphones that have no room for change left (they probably get broken in just by going through the testing/QC that high-quality headphones go through at the factory is incorrect, since it has been reported anecdotally on gear of whatever QC levels.

You can go around just flat out denying that, since no of break-in believers have shown how this supposed elastic material break-in applies to small dynamic drivers, presumably even ones found in IEMs. Even for guitar speaker cabinets utilizing 12" - 15" it is not so clear that break-in does happen.

You could try talking @solderdude or @amirm to running a burn-in experiment on any type of measurement fixture for 100-200h and seeing what happens over time. Any kind of methodology without fixed placement stinks funny. How did you measure it? Everything above 300-400Hz is highly directional, thus placement sensitive.

Solderdude has already done break-in testing on at least one set of headphones - if I recall there were some very small changes, that were likely explained away by increased pad compression the longer the headphone stayed on the measuring device - as it would have been on there for hours or days (can't remember how long he tested it). Break in is only gonna be pad related in my opinion. Pad break-in is definitely real, and that certainly affects frequency response. In fact pad break-in will continue to happen over the years, getting to a point where frequency response may be significantly changed - hence people saying that it's good to replace headphone earpads every so often.

 

[solderdude]

My perception had nothing to do with it, I broke them in for 200h and measured them every 50h before using them to listen to music for any length of time. I tried a couple of songs along the way and they seemed to go from piercing and unbearable to just generally bright but bearable, but that's not what I based my break-in conclusion on, I based it on what the microphone got from them, which you can see in the attached picture.

Break-in is definitely not a myth, it's been demonstrated and measured multiple times, most obviously in (sub)woofers but also in headphones, even in Tyll Hertsens' experiment where he strangely decided to claim there was no difference even though you can clearly see it in his results. The myth that there is no such thing as break-in is perpetuated because too many times the experiment is performed with high-quality headphones that have no room for change left (they probably get broken in just by going through the testing/QC that high-quality headphones go through at the factory). Test it with cheapo sets like the 668B and you will find that break-in is very much a reality even in headphones, just not every headphone. It's physics, it's what happens to elastic materials after some exercise, you can't go around just flat out denying that.

HD681EVO. Directly out of the box, after 8 hours of blasting bass heavy music on repeat continuous at unbearable high level and then measured again.
Please note that also the room temperature changed.

The headphone did not move during this. Unlike your experiment where you just held a phone next to it (never the exact same position) and even worse changed microphones. That measurement can not serve as any evidence.

Also note that before I had a measurement rig I modified HD681 and bought a bunch of them. 2 out of 10 had noticeable less bass (I assume the ones with these drivers later were called HD681B and HD681F). One of them got more bass during the song and the other one improved a little (subjectively)
Anecdotal, no hard evidence.
Note that this is the only headphone (€ 15,00) I experienced this with.

Later on I had a Fostex T50RPmk3 which had a problem with 1 driver.
Read about it here.
This one was broken. That said I also modified quite a few T50RP and 2x T40RP and while these did not change over time there was a considerable difference between L and R drivers. Obviously no matching was done and assembled some matched T50RP from them.

Over years of measuring new and 2nd hand headphones I sometimes revisited headphones and measured them again (after years of usage) and they did not change much.
Especially when new pads were fitted. Pad wear is IMO the main reason for headphones needing/experiencing 'break-in' especially the ones where over 100 hours is mentioned.
Also people get used to sound, hear somewhat differently from day to day, temperature can be an issue.
Ofcourse, some drivers (woofers in speakers mainly) change properties. Headphone drivers may also slightly change resonance frequencies a bit over time.
However, this will be in the first few hours.

So while break-in mechanically can be proven to exist (both I and Tyll measured tiny differences) they would have to be substantial to become audible. At least in headphones in my experience.