Sufficient DAC AMP for HD 800 S?

[delta76]

what did you mean by "something was off for me"?

and no one's denying the rme aint more reliable, but most people who talk about the adi also act like it has some secret ace up its sleeve that makes listening to stuff on it better than the rme.

Besides, for that price difference, it better be reliable.

The OP asked for something that was sufficient, the DX5 II is more than sufficient and you just pay for reliability. You said something was off, someone could take it in any number of ways bud.

Wasn't I clear? Did you even read my post in full? Reliability and stability. I read through the review thread and I realized it is the same with my SMSL C200.
You don't need to pay much more, JDS Labs Element IV is not much more expensive, made in USA, same excellent performance.

there are "cheap" products that are more reliable. like 3e audio.

 

[BlueTunes]

What specification of amplifier does the 800S need? (I assume any DAC will do, take yer pick)

 

[staticV3]

What specification of amplifier does the 800S need? (I assume any DAC will do, take yer pick)

Choose your desired Peak playback SPL and you get the required Amplifier output voltage via 0.265*10^( desired SPL - 94 / 20) .

If you'd rather have a number in output power per channel @300Ω, then you can use the result from above and do Output voltage^2/300.

 

[Jiraya369]

Wasn't I clear? Did you even read my post in full? Reliability and stability. I read through the review thread and I realized it is the same with my SMSL C200.
You don't need to pay much more, JDS Labs Element IV is not much more expensive, made in USA, same excellent performance.

there are "cheap" products that are more reliable. like 3e audio.

how are you so sure it's not because those don't sell as well?

and yeah, the jds ones are the exception, and even then, the element iv is 500 dollars with less power. "Same excellent performance" lol

 

[Jiraya369]

Less power? It output more than 3w into 33ohm. Which headphone needs more power?
Arguing with you seems to be pointless, I will stop.

if we're talking about needs why not just use a little dongle like the jm20 max?

 

[solderdude]

What specification of amplifier does the 800S need? (I assume any DAC will do, take yer pick)

I have seen peak voltages (EQ'ed HD800 when doing some short duration loud listening) of 6V = 100mW in 300 ohm = 120dB peaks
The driver can handle 500mW continuous.

So I would say any amp rated between 0.1W and 0.5W in 300 ohm with distortion below 0.01% is all you need.
That is ... when you occasionally want to play loud without hitting amp limits.
When driving it from (E.U.) phones an amplifier needs to have 12x gain (+20dB).
When driving it from non E.U. phones 6x gain (+15dB)
When driving it from 2V out DACs then 3x gain (+10dB) is enough.
Output resistance is of little consequence but should keep it below 100 ohm. Some (AV) receivers and integrated amps with headphone out can be between 100 and 500 ohm out.

When you only want to reach comfortable loud levels 2V out is enough (15 mW in 300 ohm)

The driver will be able to handle occasional short peaks (in music) reaching 2W in 300 ohm but the danger lies in an accidental full power (when not on the head) for more than several seconds. This could only happen when the gain is higher than the numbers posted above.

 

[BlueTunes]

I have seen peak voltages (EQ'ed HD800 when doing some short duration loud listening) of 6V = 100mW in 300 ohm = 120dB peaks
The driver can handle 500mW continuous.

So I would say any amp rated between 0.1W and 0.5W in 300 ohm with distortion below 0.01% is all you need.
That is ... when you occasionally want to play loud without hitting amp limits.
When driving it from (E.U.) phones an amplifier needs to have 12x gain (+20dB).
When driving it from non E.U. phones 6x gain (+15dB)
When driving it from 2V out DACs then 3x gain (+10dB) is enough.
Output resistance is of little consequence but should keep it below 100 ohm. Some (AV) receivers and integrated amps with headphone out can be between 100 and 500 ohm out.

When you only want to reach comfortable loud levels 2V out is enough (15 mW in 300 ohm)

The driver will be able to handle occasional short peaks (in music) reaching 2W in 300 ohm but the danger lies in an accidental full power (when not on the head) for more than several seconds. This could only happen when the gain is higher than the numbers posted above.

I was waiting for you to answer

Thanks. Great post.

 

[Jiraya369]

When driving it from (E.U.) phones an amplifier needs to have 12x gain (+20dB).
When driving it from non E.U. phones 6x gain (+15dB)
When driving it from 2V out DACs then 3x gain (+10dB) is enough

what do you mean by these? why is there additional decibels for different devices?

Some devices pull in less power or do they use more power for the same amount of volume?

 

[solderdude]

what do you mean by these? why is there additional decibels for different devices?

Some devices pull in less power or do they use more power for the same amount of volume?

It has to do with the max. output voltage (not power) the sources can supply when using the amp directly from a phone for instance.

When you want to amplify a 0.5V signal (E.U. phone or phono pre-amp or older cassette player) to 6V you need 12x gain (what one considers a high-gain setting)
When you have a non-EU phone or some dongle that maxes out at 1V you need 6x gain (which is what would be called mid-gain).
When you have a DAC with 2V or 3V out you only need 2-3x gain.

 

[whataboutmusic]

or one could get the topping dx5 ii which has similar power and also has eq

I do not have any experience with topping products

I always felt safe with RME and they are supported with a certified dealer in my country so it was a no brainer for me

 

[Jiraya369]

I do not have any experience with topping products

I always felt safe with RME and they are supported with a certified dealer in my country so it was a no brainer for me

if you dont have any experience then dang bro

 

[whataboutmusic]

if you dont have any experience then dang bro

ok bro

 

[jwn821]

I'm leaning towards a Qudelix 5k until there is a convincing desktop replacement.

 

[solderdude]

Not recommended for HD800(S) with its 50mW output rating (2.5mm TRRS out) when you plan to EQ the bass to Harman levels and occasionally want to turn the volume up on your favorite songs.
You will need to buy a special cable for it as well which are expensive.

 

[jwn821]

Not recommended for HD800(S) with its 50mW output rating (2.5mm TRRS out) when you plan to EQ the bass to Harman levels and occasionally want to turn the volume up on your favorite songs.
You will need to buy a special cable for it as well which are expensive.

What do you recommend then?

 

[solderdude]

It depends on what you are looking for.
If you want to play loud.
Do you plan to EQ ? (is obligatory for me).
What budget ?
Desktop or portable ?
What music source(s) ?

 

[jwn821]

It depends on what you are looking for.
If you want to play loud.
Do you plan to EQ ? (is obligatory for me).
What budget ?
Desktop or portable ?
What music source(s) ?

I don't need to play it loud.
90% classical music, don't need much bass.
I will probably not try EQ right away. It seems like a useful feature.
Perhaps up to 300-400 Euros.
No preference for desktop or portable. It is for home listening.
Bluetooth preferable but if no BT support, a streamer is a cheap addon.

Thank your for your help.

 

[solderdude]

FiiO K11 (does not have BT) but do not go for the R2R version.
with BT... Topping DX3 PRO + will be fine.
Or ... as has been suggested wait for DX1-II (no BT though)

Easy to get with warranty etc. in Europe.

portable (on balanced out so would need to buy a 4.4mm cable too) FiiO QX13 or BTR17 should be enough.

 

[jwn821]

FiiO K11 (does not have BT) but do not go for the R2R version.
with BT... Topping DX3 PRO + will be fine.
Or ... as has been suggested wait for DX1-II (no BT though)

Easy to get with warranty etc. in Europe.

portable (on balanced out so would need to buy a 4.4mm cable too) FiiO QX13 or BTR17 should be enough.

Of those, only the QX13 and BTR17 have EQ.

K11 doesn't have BT and DX3 doesn't have balanced out.

Seems that there is no has-it-all solution. Decision, decisions, decisions...

 

[Steven Holt]

I'm not going to argue with what @staticV3 recommends, but I will offer an alternative : Buy the Topping D10 Balanced DAC and the Topping A90 Headphone Amp, you just might never leave yr desktop again!