Sub choice - SVS SB-1000 vs. Klipsch RP-1000SW

[mikolajek]

Since it's USB, it's not balanced SU-X has 4 outputs, but sadly only 2 balanced.

The room is about 20 square meters, it's my office / library.

I do have the microphone from my DENON AMP used for home cinema, would it do?

 

[delta76]

Since it's USB, it's not balanced SU-X has 4 outputs, but sadly only 2 balanced.

The room is about 20 square meters, it's my office / library.

I do have the microphone from my DENON AMP used for home cinema, would it do?

USB is for digital so it is not balanced/unbalanced. Balanced/Unbalanced only applies to analog signal (XLR vs RCA etc.)

 

[mikolajek]

USB is for digital so it is not balanced/unbalanced. Balanced/Unbalanced only applies to analog signal (XLR vs RCA etc.)

True, I used a shorthand

 

[delta76]

Thanks, all! Just a question - since SU-X is a 2-channel DAC, would it actually make sense to get a sub for it? Sure, it can be connected via RCA, and it will work (tested it with my home theatre Canton sub), but it's surely not a dedicated 2.1 device.

As said I use JRiver Media Center, as with this tool I'd need to use the classic 2.0 config, and not 2.1. I can switch to 2.1 while playing (and the effect is great), but on next track it will get reset to 2.0 .

I'm not particularly inclined to update the DAC + AMP, as they are meant for stereo only, just wanted to make the low tones a bit noisier for the neighbours

I think SB-1000 has speaker input which works exactly in this case, the sub probably has a setting for crossover (so you can set it to only "care" about <100Hz signal ). I don't own one so I'm not quite sure, so it should work like that

 

[mikolajek]

I think SB-1000 has speaker input which works exactly in this case, the sub probably has a setting for crossover (so you can set it to only "care" about <100Hz signal ). I don't own one so I'm not quite sure, so it should work like that

That's correct, I've actually set it for the moment at 120 Hz, but still testing. SB-100 has valoume / phase / cut-off knobs. No gain control, though.

 

[mikolajek]

While I'm not particularly into it, I could consider DAC replacement, but I haven't really looked into feasbile ones. I suppose a 2-channel model with additional seb output, like WiiM Amp Pro, would do here, right? Any better choices?

Eversolo PLAY looks cool, but I know nothing on it.

 

[delta76]

While I'm not particularly into it, I could consider DAC replacement, but I haven't really looked into feasbile ones. I suppose a 2-channel model with additional seb output, like WiiM Amp Pro, would do here, right? Any better choices?

Eversolo PLAY looks cool, but I know nothing on it.

no you don't need WiiM Amp pro given you already have 3e for amp. You can, in theory, sell your SU-X and 3e and get WiiM Ultra Amp, so you can stream music directly to it. It also have room correction which can be a significant improvement (don't know how well it works, but I assume at least "not bad")

 

[ZolaIII]

Since it's USB, it's not balanced SU-X has 4 outputs, but sadly only 2 balanced.

The room is about 20 square meters, it's my office / library.

I do have the microphone from my DENON AMP used for home cinema, would it do?

I don't believe it will. Small capsule condenser measurement microphone preferably USB (with interface and pasive LRX will work as it has ADC and amp for it) more preferably UMIK-1 for it's REW calibration integration so that it can be used and as accurate SPL meter otherwise you will nead and one of self stand SPL meters and still accurate one.
It's never meant to run both outputs at a same time (SU-X). Two close enclosure balanced cheap 10" sub's would be ideal with 4 chenel audio interface.
SB-1000 has built in (80 Hz) high pass in pass trough RCA mode but I wouldn't use it if I don't must and even so only for first time. Otherwise it's typical home unbalanced (150~250 mV) input one.
So you might go unbalanced from SU to sub and from sub to amplifier but it ain't gonna be great.

 

[mikolajek]

Just BTW - in this thread I was advised I can connect both AMP and sub to SU-X DAC. Was it a crappy advice?

 

[ZolaIII]

Just BTW - in this thread I was advised I can connect both AMP and sub to SU-X DAC. Was it a crappy advice?

It's not supposed to be driven like that.
Look for good subwoofer integration you need full area PEQ integration at least and you have that at source but it needs to be to separate chenel/chenels to sub/sub's. JRiver and REW have a little different supported Q max but not really important.

 

[mikolajek]

Argh... Sorry to be pain, but how about getting a crossover box to split the signal between speakers and sub? Would it make sense?
Possibly something like mentioned in this post.

Not sure if that would be money-wise, but hopefully there are some budget solutions for this purpose.

 

[Waxx]

On small subs, svs is hard to beat. But small subs are always a compromise you make. They rely on massive eq and amp power and so create more distortion for the same volume as big subs. But if small is mandatory, get the svs's.

Kiplisch is very overrated and overpriced in general, and for their subs it's not different than for their speakers. It's not total crap altough, but no match for the SVS on sound.

 

[ZolaIII]

Argh... Sorry to be pain, but how about getting a crossover box to split the signal between speakers and sub? Would it make sense?
Possibly something like mentioned in this post.

Not sure if that would be money-wise, but hopefully there are some budget solutions for this purpose.

It's multichannel ADC/DSP/DAC I mentioned MiniDSP's and you probably will have hard time getting one anywhere out of US or at least with healthy price increases and only some products in EU. Even with really good ones as Flex series it's still better to skip ADC (even it's a good one it's still under DACs capabilities and ads a bit of latency compared to digital inputs). Best budget solution with laptop is multichannel USB interface and you probably will pay a little more for balanced input sub. JRiver is light years ahead of DSP in Minis or better say laptop CPU. Unlocks all effects you can (and can't) image. UMIK-1 ain't easy to get either but more menagable then other MiniDSP things.

 

[Steven Holt]

I'm surprised yr even considering the Klipsch. When it comes to subwoofers, two rule the roost : SVS and REL. Of course those online retailers would like Klipsch, they have a higher profit margin. Buy the SVS.

 

[mikolajek]

So I checked the support sites of several DAC manufacturers and I found three cases:
- they won't say anything on simultaneous use of XLR and RCA (approx. 40% )
- they confirm it's not a problem to have them both connected as long as both connections are active (the target gear is on) (approx. 50%)
- they say XLR and RCA should't be used at the same time (approx. 10%)

Not sure if I can take it for any general response (esp. SMSL has no directions on this in their support section), but it seems the majority finds no issue with it. Just saying...

 

[Cogito]

I'm surprised yr even considering the Klipsch. When it comes to subwoofers, two rule the roost : SVS and REL. Of course those online retailers would like Klipsch, they have a higher profit margin. Buy the SVS.

Hsu Research, RSL and Monoprice's Monolith line are great options.

 

[airs]

I'm running two RP10's (front corners) with two HSU ULS15 Mk2 (rear corners). Calibrated with Dirac ART on a Denon x4800, Revel F208 mains, Buckeye NCx500 amp. Got the RP10's for $385 each last summer and I've been thrilled with the result.

Cons imo are:

1.) finish/veneer is cheap looking
2.) factor/footprint - they're an odd size but I made them work in my room

 

[Pecrobet]

I’ve been more than happy with my Klipsch SPL-100 (10 inch, ported).
Nary a glitch over 6 years of ownership, I use it in a 2.1 setup with a pair of KEF R5.
At the end of the day, a sub is a sub. As long as it has enough output, and the options you need to integrate it into your system, imho, there’s no need to spend more than you need to.

Modern day subwoofers are completely different than those built in the 90's. Companies did not focus on building sound stage changing subs. The sub building method was very simplistic. Place large woofer with powerful amp into correct size box.

Times have changed. Entering the 21st century, audio engineers understood the importance of adding sub/s to sound systems. They started building extraordinary subs that changed the music listening experience.

For example, REL Acoustics offers a wide range of subs modestly priced that sound absolutely amazing. I am not saying to go out and buy a REL sub. However, you should consider visiting a local REL dealer and have a listening session. I strongly believe you will find out why quality sub/s play a significant role in hifidelity sound systems.

 

[Waxx]

Modern day subwoofers are completely different than those built in the 90's. Companies did not focus on building sound stage changing subs. The sub building method was very simplistic. Place large woofer with powerful amp into correct size box.

Times have changed. Entering the 21st century, audio engineers understood the importance of adding sub/s to sound systems. They started building extraordinary subs that changed the music listening experience.

For example, REL Acoustics offers a wide range of subs modestly priced that sound absolutely amazing. I am not saying to go out and buy a REL sub. However, you should consider visiting a local REL dealer and have a listening session. I strongly believe you will find out why quality sub/s play a significant role in hifidelity sound systems.

sorry, but that is marketing talk, not reality. The only thing that changed is that drivers, amps and dsp became better and that room correction can fix a lot of issues with standing waves and cancellations due to the room. None of those are implemented in REL subs and other fancy audiophile brand subs that focus on "soundstage".

The good innovative hifi subs look for low distortion (due to better drivers and amps), better integration with the main system (trough dsp) and sometimes even cardioid dispertion (to avoid room interaction. But the basic layout of a subwoofer did not change that much since the 90's for hifi. For PA it did, but not for hifi. In PA land cardioid subs are good to reduce noise complaints, so often used, and there amp power is not cheap, so they try to get the max out of the availeble power with the type of cabinets used. But those factors are not vallid for hifi.

 

[Pecrobet]

I understand your reluctance and reasoning. There is a lot of snake oil products in audio industry. I am speaking from real experience. That is why I recommend you have a listening session to see if you can hear the difference. Again, if you are satisfied with your current setup, then do not make changes.

As for REL, that was just one example. There are numerous manufacturers building unbelievable products. As time goes on, advancements in technology and evolve. Just like any other product, business adapt and make great strides.