Studio monitor speakers without hiss?

[AnalogSteph]

There are several sets of variables involved here:

1. As mentioned, ambient noise and people's sensitivity to hiss vary. Listening distance and room acoustics are some other factors playing a role in this.
2. Excessive hiss may be encountered when:
a) there are ground loop issues with the cabling (primarily when speakers have switch-mode power supplies, like the JBLs)
or
b) input sensitivity is set too high in general.

Regarding 2b), note that input sensitivity adjustment facilities on active speakers vary greatly - a few have none at all (but may differ between balanced and unbalanced inputs, like the Focal Shapes), some 12 dB of range (typically between -10 dBV and +4 dBu), others 24 dB, and some can be turned down pretty much all the way to zero. Models with DSP may have switchable ADC full-scale input level (e.g. the JBLs again, about 2 Vrms / +8 dBu vs. +20 dBu) plus digital level control.

BTW, if anyone wants my old Tascam VL-X5s (230 V) as a fixer-upper project, you can have them for whatever postage is from Germany to your place via DHL (preferably within the EU, SEPA bank transfer), assuming their boxes are still in my parents' attic. One had occasional issues with a duff relay on the woofer (a known issue in certain lots), the other emits some buzz that I'll attribute to a bad (or not properly soldered) cap. Always been like that, was a closeout special at Thomann way back when. They require balanced connections, too. But hiss, hiss never was an issue with them - in fact they have less of that than even my current O110s! Be warned that getting into them requires some trickery and brute force, being screwed and glued shut. It's just that they're probably not getting any better in my basement either, and I haven't used them for months now.

 

[Jhify]

It is a little bit of all of that plus perhaps some differences in EMI in the environment. The simple truth is that powered studio monitors have output gain at near full level and you are likely to hear the noise floor of the components. Especially if you are very close to the speakers. If you want to hear nothing then passive speakers are the sure way to go. Then you can set the output level on the amplifier.

That's true. Fortunately I know my power is pretty clean as I have pairs of Focals and Klipsch hooked up to a Marantz pm7003 I use as hifi references in the same room and they've got a pitch black background unless you really stick your ear on the tweeter. But you're right, passive is the way to go to really know what to expect. I especially regretted there was no gain control on the Focals Aphas and Shapes, cause they were really good and all I needed but the amplifiers were at max output all the way. I can't understand this choice from the manufacturer.

 

[Jhify]

Room noise is just one factor, some people just seem to be "noisy" and don't seem to notice certain things. No sense asking if they hear speaker hissing, monitor/power supply/cpu/gpu whine or car interior noise/rattling etc. because they don't care about it. If pressed, they may say that they hear something at very low level, but haven't even noticed it before it was pointed out.

I returned to passive speakers for my computer after trying few active ones.

Yeah well... I'm the another kind then but it's rather expected when you try to hear details in your mix. Or when you play piano and there's a break in the piece and all you can hear is the hiss over the reverd tail.

I just which there was more offering for passive monitors on the market. What did you get for your desk ?

 

[hege]

I even get super annoyed when there's production background hiss when people are talking in movies etc..

edit: lol that thread goes off a bit.. I'm not gonna put toilet paper over my Genelecs.. things like that are purely production issue (mic / noise gate / ADR etc), don't blame speakers for "rising highs" or something

 

[pg_ben]

I have an older pair of Tannoy Reveals and the hiss was very noticeable when working late at night. In case the hiss bothers anyone else as much as it did me I'll mention how I got rid of it. I wired an 'l-pad' right before each tweeter and woofer. You can calculate how much DB reduction you want using this and then buy the two resistors needed. They look like this. If you use the l-pad calculator it reduces the output of the speakers (thereby bringing down the hiss) without altering the frequency balance. I went with 14db reduction and no longer hear hiss. I did some measurements using Room EQ before and after and saw no real changes in either frequency response or in the waterfall graph. The l-pads will bring down the max volume your monitors can output but that was always too high for me anyway.

One note: the l-pad should be a 'fixed' type and not the prebuilt variable types you can find online.

 

[relmu]

I have a pair of KRK rp5 g2s exclusively for listening to music and even putting my ears over the speakers I don't perceive any whistling. They are powered by an original IFI IDSD nano dac from a Lenovo AIO with AMD Ryzen 5 3500.

 

[trl]

I have an older pair of Tannoy Reveals and the hiss was very noticeable when working late at night. In case the hiss bothers anyone else as much as it did me I'll mention how I got rid of it. I wired an 'l-pad' right before each tweeter and woofer. You can calculate how much DB reduction you want using this and then buy the two resistors needed. They look like this. If you use the l-pad calculator it reduces the output of the speakers (thereby bringing down the hiss) without altering the frequency balance. I went with 14db reduction and no longer hear hiss. I did some measurements using Room EQ before and after and saw no real changes in either frequency response or in the waterfall graph. The l-pads will bring down the max volume your monitors can output but that was always too high for me anyway.

One note: the l-pad should be a 'fixed' type and not the prebuilt variable types you can find online.

So you opened the active speakers and added the attenuator resistors just between the output stage and the speaker drivers?
Couldn't you just lower the gain/amplification from the back of the speakers?

 

[pg_ben]

So you opened the active speakers and added the attenuator resistors just between the output stage and the speaker drivers?
Couldn't you just lower the gain/amplification from the back of the speakers?

After a number of tests I learned that the hiss I was hearing was self noise from the amplifier stage so adding attenuation after the amplifier and just before the actual woofer and tweeter was the only way to lower the noise floor. Afterwards, I simply raised my audio interface's gain a little (still plenty of headroom).

As one of my earlier tests I had tried attenuation at the input stage (a 50db XLR pad) and the hiss remained consistent.

 

[usern]

Couldn't you just lower the gain/amplification from the back of the speakers?

A lot of studio monitor models have input gain adjustment, not output adjustment. Even if you turn the trim all the way down, hiss stays the same. I have experienced that with Presonus and Genelec monitors, with Neumann KH 80 DSP you can control the output and lower the hiss with gain setting on the back of the speaker.

 

[Cbdb2]

I even get super annoyed when there's production background hiss when people are talking in movies etc..

edit: lol that thread goes off a bit.. I'm not gonna put toilet paper over my Genelecs.. things like that are purely production issue (mic / noise gate / ADR etc), don't blame speakers for "rising highs" or something

Recording production dialogue is an art. Your mic can be 10' away from the actor and your 200' from a freeway. Action movies (CGI has changed this) use to get 70% of the production dialogue replaced (ADR) because of noise. Its actually quite impressive how little noise there usually is under the dialogue (in big budget movies) remember that background sound is almost always added ( birds, wind, aircon noise, traffic, even inside ) when theres no music going on.

 

[Alchemist_]

A lot of studio monitor models have input gain adjustment, not output adjustment. Even if you turn the trim all the way down, hiss stays the same. I have experienced that with Presonus and Genelec monitors, with Neumann KH 80 DSP you can control the output and lower the hiss with gain setting on the back of the speaker.

Hi. Hi, please tell me. What kind of Presonus model are we talking about?

 

[Alchemist_]

It seems that Mackie MR (class A/B) do not hiss or hiss less than others. Is it true? maybe someone knows.

I don't remember if I attached a video in this thread. about the hiss. But it is very revealing. It's a pity there are not all models)

 

[pozz]

Hiss List. Ranked by measurements.

 

[usern]

Hi. Hi, please tell me. What kind of Presonus model are we talking about?

I was talking about it here

 

[Alchemist_]

I was talking about it here

R80- they hiss even if the handle is turned to the minimum sound?

 

[usern]

R80- they hiss even if the handle is turned to the minimum sound?

I would say yes, but I only have experience with R65. With R65, there was no difference in hiss how the input gain was set.

 

[Alchemist_]

I would say yes, but I only have experience with R65. With R65, there was no difference in hiss how the input gain was set.

I'm confused. in the message #169. You write that the Presonus R65 volume level on the monitor affects the level of hissing in the message #176 write that it does not affect ? which message is more correct? these also apply. (Genelec 8030 CP Neumann KH 80 DSP)

 

[usern]

Input gain does not change hiss: Genelec 8030, Presonus R65
Can change output level and thus, adjust the hiss: Neumann KH 80 DSP

 

[Alchemist_]

I have an older pair of Tannoy Reveals and the hiss was very noticeable when working late at night. In case the hiss bothers anyone else as much as it did me I'll mention how I got rid of it. I wired an 'l-pad' right before each tweeter and woofer. You can calculate how much DB reduction you want using this and then buy the two resistors needed. They look like this. If you use the l-pad calculator it reduces the output of the speakers (thereby bringing down the hiss) without altering the frequency balance. I went with 14db reduction and no longer hear hiss. I did some measurements using Room EQ before and after and saw no real changes in either frequency response or in the waterfall graph. The l-pads will bring down the max volume your monitors can output but that was always too high for me anyway.
One note: the l-pad should be a 'fixed' type and not the prebuilt variable types you can find online.

Thanks. An interesting solution. I think I will do the same in the future. Tell me please. Is there 1 resistor or 2 in front of each speaker?
that is, there are 2 or 4 resistors in one monitor? And I correctly translated the phrase about the type of resistor "fixed type" is it a "constant resistance" resistor?

 

[pg_ben]

Thanks. An interesting solution. I think I will do the same in the future. Tell me please. Is there 1 resistor or 2 in front of each speaker?
that is, there are 2 or 4 resistors in one monitor? And I correctly translated the phrase about the type of resistor "fixed type" is it a "constant resistance" resistor?

It is important to have 4 resistors per monitor (2 per woofer, 2 per tweeter). If you google 'l-pad calculator' there are a number than show the rather simple schematic required. Basically one resister is attached along the positive wire (in series) and one is attached across both positive and negative wires (parallel). You need 2 resistors per tweeter and woofer using the correct values from the l-pad calculator -- using a single resistor would throw the frequency balance of the monitor off. I used 10W ceramic fixed resistors which I'm told is appropriate (try not to get less wattage than that if possible.)