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Streamer vs Computer

Verig

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I solve problems for work. Coaching service assurance and operator RAN support. Last thing I want to see when I intend to relax and listen to music is some computer beeping. Might as well dust my cd's and lp's instead.
I find Node (well, Bluesound in general as my NAD M10 is part "Node", I sold my N130) to be excellent price/features/support combination.
Nothing personal here Joachim, although I'm replying to you, just a point of view. :)
 

JoachimStrobel

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That is fine, if that money is not cut away from potential more needing things then go with it
 

sebpoterie

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would a song streaming from Tidal sound any better or worse coming off of a Bluesound Node vs a Lumin U2?

YES. Node2i V1 digital output (coax) was my worst experience so far.
Plugged into a Benchmark dac, it sounds flat, lacking on every level.
A logitech Transporter (bnc/coax) sounds much (much) better with the same dac
I sold it, my friends too.
I do not know why its digital output is so bad and if we can generalize...

SO,

- why do some transports sound better than others ?
- can we expect a mac (usb out) plugged into a good dac to sound as good as a dedicated streamer plugged into the same good dac ?

I do not find the answers but my experience with Node2 makes me doubt what I thought was obvious.

NB : Sorry for my english as good as the "bitperfect" from Node.
 

Panicking ant

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Can anyone help me over quality of digital audio stream? I understand that better sound quality is obtained by bypassing an onboard computer dac and connecting a good quality standalone dac. Recently I fed the digital output from my ageing Samsung Note 3 into irdac, rhead amp, Grado phones. Track from Tidal (hifi). The sound was thick and dull - not hifi at all. I substituted my iphone for the laptop. Same dac, same amp, same heaphones. The sound was superb. Not a subtle difference, it was huge. Are not all digital audio streams equal?
 

Purité Audio

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I use a silent PC as both the streamer and server in my main rack. It is running Roon which means I can use any other Roon client/app to control what gets played. I often use my laptop to remotely access it. Other times I use a tablet or my phone to control it.

The main advantage of this approach (using a computer) is that it is an open platform so you are not stuck with support from a single hardware company. And you can install other things on it (in my case Dirac Room EQ).

The disadvantage is constant OS updates and random things that can go wrong with a much more complex device like a computer. You are one OS upgrade away from the thing just not working all of a sudden.
Much the same here, I like Roon, ripped stuff is on the dedicated, silent computer, control with an I pad very straightforward Roon has been extremely solid, multi room , EQ etc.
Having said that I have been experimenting with a ‘streamer’ , again using Roon, just whatever works for you.
Keith
 

fatoldgit

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YES. Node2i V1 digital output (coax) was my worst experience so far.
Plugged into a Benchmark dac, it sounds flat, lacking on every level.
A logitech Transporter (bnc/coax) sounds much (much) better with the same dac
I sold it, my friends too.
I do not know why its digital output is so bad and if we can generalize...

SO,

- why do some transports sound better than others ?
- can we expect a mac (usb out) plugged into a good dac to sound as good as a dedicated streamer plugged into the same good dac ?

I do not find the answers but my experience with Node2 makes me doubt what I thought was obvious.

NB : Sorry for my english as good as the "bitperfect" from Node.

One cool thing (among many) about the Transporter (I have three!!!, an original and two "non-knobs") is that it doesnt upsample or otherwise mess with the digital output. Play a 44.1/16 file, the digital out is 44.1/16... play 96/24 file the digital out is 96/24.

Thus you can be sure that whatever downstream DAC you use, the sound is attributable to the DAC and not a combo of DAC and Streamer.

I dont know how unique this (not shagging the digital stream) is with streamers used purely as a transport (digital out only) but I think it is rare and is one of the major features I like of the Transporter.

Using its analogue outs probably makes it not competitive today but as a digital only device, it still has a lot to offer.

Peter
 
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JoachimStrobel

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Can anyone help me over quality of digital audio stream? I understand that better sound quality is obtained by bypassing an onboard computer dac and connecting a good quality standalone dac. Recently I fed the digital output from my ageing Samsung Note 3 into irdac, rhead amp, Grado phones. Track from Tidal (hifi). The sound was thick and dull - not hifi at all. I substituted my iphone for the laptop. Same dac, same amp, same heaphones. The sound was superb. Not a subtle difference, it was huge. Are not all digital audio streams equal?
In the same way as bypassing the computer stuff gives you a cleaner videostream without that snow on the screen. And in Word the text can read much better.
 

ol_mcdonald

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FWIW, I'm 66 and want things simple, I get around, but not into a lot of dinking around with a computer to make things work. I'm currently using a Volumio Rivo streamer that I thought would be a good solution to carrying my laptop back and forth. I was excited to get it, ordered as soon as it became available, as Amir says, an "early adopter" and it bit me this time. I have had glitches with it that persist. The UI will not display on my 73" LG tv, and they have no solution except to say they have experienced issues with LG tv's.

I previously used my Macbook pro and Audirvana with my iPad as remote that worked flawlessly, It was just a hassle every time I wanted to listen to music I had to take my laptop down to my listening room....and then back. My system is installed in a 19" rack and i prefer an installed component, not having to haul something back and forth and thats all I gained from Rivo.

I hate to cry, but I am quite disappointed in Rivo. Stick with your laptop.
 

Barrelhouse Solly

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I'm probably excessively interested in Raspberry Pi audio. There are a bunch of streaming solutions available. Moode Audio and LMS are my favorites. MPD and Mopidy require a bit of command line knowledge and hands on setup but are highly flexible. Moode comes with Camilla DSP. LMS is easiest to set up. There are a large number of DAC HATS available, some of which have been measured here. The Pi 4 can be used with USB output. Actually all Pis can but on earlier models USB and ethernet share a bus. Another option for direct output is HDMI. I have a Pi connected to my AVR this way.

If you use streaming services Moode supports lossless streaming as does Volumio. I prefer Moode because it's totally free and open source. It also provides a huge variety of geeky tweaking. In the last few years Volumio has adopted a freemium model and the free version has been losing features.

The thing I like about the Pi solution is that it's easy to put together something for $100 that's pretty good, especially if you use a transport HAT with optical/coax outs. You can go as low as $15 with a Pi Zero W with HDMI output. Built in analogue audio is not very good. For under $200 you can exceed the limits of human hearing without a problem.

I use my Pis for DLNA/SMB files on a NAS mostly. I don't use any streaming services although I do listen to internet radio. There are a variety of front ends for Pi software. Some have a browser based UI and there are mobile apps as well. There is a Window$ app for LMS. You have to be a bit geeky to use a Pi. There is no appliance solution. Everything available requires some hands on configuration although Moode, Volumio, and LMS don't require doing anything on the command line. MPD requires a lot more work.

The Pi shortage is beginning to ease. Rpilocator, https://rpilocator.com/, provides daily information on availability. It's still harder in the US but if you keep an eye on it you can find Pi 4s at list price. Pi Zeros are becoming common.
 

ahofer

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Dave Bullet

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I run both a Dell Optiplex 3050 SFF PC and Raspberry Pi 3b.

Neither stream from the Cloud, because I don't want to pay for a subscription. I have a large local music collection on SSD.

I've spent quite a bit of time building these - originally using a no longer supported custom Archlinux distribution (Archphile) - now just rolling Archlinux with minimum packages.

I've compiled Music Player Daemon to include some decoders for things like SID music files (Commodore 64) and HTTPS (so I can Webradio from my phone if desired and bluetooth to boom boxes etc...)

I remotely control the servers via MPDroid running on my phone. This frees my phone from serving anything (just a playlist controller). Multiple people can connect and manipulate the playlist / contribute to it in parallel. You could setup a tablet if you want to do the same.

By connecting various devices, I can support Toslink input, USB or HDMI output. Then a dedicated DAC handles the rest (for the Pi I'm using an IQaudio HAT DAC), but can also use a Topping DM7 or an AVR. The Toslink input allows CD playback. I'm using CamillaDSP software as a device router, dynamic (memory based) EQ and active crossover.

I'm very happy with the setup. It was very low cost.
 
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