strange SMSL M500 high 3rd harmonic

[Massimo]

su-9 has an exposed header that directly connects to the dac micro. so does the sabaj d5. m500 does not.

Where is the exposed header on the SU-9 located?

 

[chefffe]

The SU9 has on the bottom a little connector slot. Hope this is the one ...
If Wolf needs to wait for Hardware recieving, this might be a bigger effort and not do-able for everyone
I also dont think that any user will get a "package" from SMSL for upgrading, or am I wrong?

 

[JSmith]

I also dont think that any user will get a "package" from SMSL for upgrading, or am I wrong?

There have been firmware updates for previous models including the M500... although a few users bricked theirs;

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/smsl-m500-owners-thread.9547/page-6

https://todayamerican.medium.com/how-to-upgrade-the-firmware-on-your-smsl-m500-mqa-dac-63fba12c6ace

Unsure if this method will apply in this case.



JSmith

 

[mkawa]

that was just upgrades to the XMOS micro firmware

 

[Jimbob54]

that was just upgrades to the XMOS micro firmware

Thats what I thought too. I didnt think SMSL ever remote upgraded any M500 firmware

 

[nhs]

I think it doesn't make sense by now to speculate what and how to update the FW before Prof.Wolf gives us a review to this upgrading package.

 

[ewok71]

Hi all, been lurking forums for a while, finally created account to actually ask questions!

I ordered m500 on amazon.ca (aoshida store) literally 1 day before I saw this 3rd harmonic issue thread. Very close to cancelling order but took so long thinking about it, reading this thread trying to understand things and researching other gear (dx7 pro etc..) that the unit arrived already!

Anyway, got this message from amazon.ca:

Thank you for shopping with us. Amazon seller Aoshida HiFi-CA has encountered an unexpected problem with completing your order
Hi,
Thanks for your purchase of S.M.S.L M500. Hope you like the product. : )
The product you will receive is tested by the manufacturer and there is no quality problem. Please feel free to use it.
If there are any problems in the use of the device, please don't return it first. Please give us a chance to help you solve the product problem. We are happy to assist.
Thanks & Regards,
Catherine

I'm thinking this might be a totally normal message they always send, however when I opened the box no power cord inside! This makes me think they did actually manually check the unit before shipping it and someone forgot to put power cord back in? I assume it shipped from China and it got to Canada in 8 days, so I guess very unlikely they would have understood this 3rd harmonic issue and fixed or flashed hardware in that timescale?

I'm very much a layman in terms of electrical engineering/audio and don't have equipment/knowledge to test my m500. Playing on a Drop/Hifiman HE5xx HP volume (18-24 volume range) sounds fine to my 50 years old untrained audiophile ears. I agree with others, however, that I would still like to know that my device isn't defective!

 

[AdamG]

Hi all, been lurking forums for a while, finally created account to actually ask questions!

I ordered m500 on amazon.ca (aoshida store) literally 1 day before I saw this 3rd harmonic issue thread. Very close to cancelling order but took so long thinking about it, reading this thread trying to understand things and researching other gear (dx7 pro etc..) that the unit arrived already!

Anyway, got this message from amazon.ca:

Thank you for shopping with us. Amazon seller Aoshida HiFi-CA has encountered an unexpected problem with completing your order
Hi,
Thanks for your purchase of S.M.S.L M500. Hope you like the product. : )
The product you will receive is tested by the manufacturer and there is no quality problem. Please feel free to use it.
If there are any problems in the use of the device, please don't return it first. Please give us a chance to help you solve the product problem. We are happy to assist.
Thanks & Regards,
Catherine

I'm thinking this might be a totally normal message they always send, however when I opened the box no power cord inside! This makes me think they did actually manually check the unit before shipping it and someone forgot to put power cord back in? I assume it shipped from China and it got to Canada in 8 days, so I guess very unlikely they would have understood this 3rd harmonic issue and fixed or flashed hardware in that timescale?

I'm very much a layman in terms of electrical engineering/audio and don't have equipment/knowledge to test my m500. Playing on a Drop/Hifiman HE5xx HP volume (18-24 volume range) sounds fine to my 50 years old untrained audiophile ears. I agree with others, however, that I would still like to know that my device isn't defective!

Welcome Aboard @ewok71.

 

[Hemi-Demon]

If SMSL doesn't fix this issue for free, I won't buy another device from them. I own a SU-9, and while I like the device, I do find it subjectively "noisy" and wonder if this is the why. This is my 4th or 5th SMSL device. I am getting tired of these forum researched issues

 

[Massimo]

If SMSL doesn't fix this issue for free, I won't buy another device from them. I own a SU-9, and while I like the device, I do find it subjectively "noisy" and wonder if this is the why. This is my 4th or 5th SMSL device. I am getting tired of these forum researched issues

Unfortunately the alternatives are no better. Topping, Khadas, Soncoz, Matrix, Gustard all have recent products with problems.

 

[JSmith]

Topping, Khadas, Soncoz, Matrix, Gustard all have recent products with problems.

Indeed they do... which is why many of us went with the M500 or SU-9. I read about the thermal issues with the M500 V1 and went for the SU-9.

that was just upgrades to the XMOS micro firmware

Bummer... yeah thought as much after reading your earlier post on this.



JSmith

 

[mkawa]

The SU9 has on the bottom a little connector slot. Hope this is the one ...
If Wolf needs to wait for Hardware recieving, this might be a bigger effort and not do-able for everyone
I also dont think that any user will get a "package" from SMSL for upgrading, or am I wrong?

They did it for the Sabaj d5

 

[restorer-john]

I'm sorry. Any HiFi equipment that needs a firmware update to function according to specifications isn't fit for sale in the first place.

These Chinese companies need to lift their collective game fast if they ever want to be taken remotely seriously. The established players are not immune either, but they have 50+ years of solid runs on the board in most cases.

 

[Tks]

I'm sorry. Any HiFi equipment that needs a firmware update to function according to specifications isn't fit for sale in the first place.

These Chinese companies need to lift their collective game fast if they ever want to be taken remotely seriously. The established players are not immune either, but they have 50+ years of solid runs on the board in most cases.

Whole world has basically adopted this paradigm, so you won't find many to your standards. Both hardware and software is ship first, and fix later. This is a byproduct of a more interconnected world where you don't need technicians coming in with dedicated hardware to interface with a flawed device. If you have a USB connector, you're basically good to go and ship whatever you want as a company in the modern day (unless of course your hardware is also rushed, then you're just borderline criminally negligent).

You should watch out for "established players" as they're currently the ones salivating at the prospect of shipping things without all the classical elbow grease required for a "perfect release" of a product.

 

[JSmith]

The established players are not immune either

Very true, in particular when it comes to fully functioning AVR's.



JSmith

 

[lucadoc]

I tried to completely remove the card from the M500 but there is a flat cable coming from the volume knob that retains it.

Do you know how properly disassemble it?

 

[KSTR]

Early adopters always get bitten.
And, the old saying "hardware goes kaput, software is kaput" is true again.
Any product with a more than ultra-trivial µC/SoC does have bugs. In-house testing will never uncover them all. You need a huge amount of non-affiliated beta-testers (with proper equipment, in this case) to have any chances of catching the more important ones.

And such a strange bug like this is very likely to be missed during testing, in this case I really wouldn't blame SMSL. Even very reputed companies with extensive in-house testing miss "obvious" bugs from time to time... operational blindness at work, and Murphy's Law is reliable ;-)

 

[JSmith]

And such a strange bug like this is very likely to be missed during testing, in this case I really wouldn't blame SMSL

Whilst I agree, nonetheless this is SMSL's responsibility to rectify now that it has been discovered and confirmed.

Once SMSL confirms the updated firmware fixes the problem (after Prof. Wolf tests same) and devise a way to get the updates out, then this will show them as being a responsible company that provides proper aftermarket support. Otherwise, the opposite of course...

So far it seems they've been reasonably responsive behind the scenes, however a public update here and there wouldn't go astray.



JSmith

 

[boXem]

Early adopters always get bitten.
And, the old saying "hardware goes kaput, software is kaput" is true again.
Any product with a more than ultra-trivial µC/SoC does have bugs. In-house testing will never uncover them all. You need a huge amount of non-affiliated beta-testers (with proper equipment, in this case) to have any chances of catching the more important ones.

Planes are unable to fly without software since decades now although Boeing and Airbus do not seem to rely on beta testers. Hopefully.
SW testing is a full time job with it's own methodologies. Unfortunately many companies continue seeing this task as a burden.

 

[KSTR]

Whilst I agree, nonetheless this is SMSL's responsibility to rectify now that it has been discovered and confirmed.

I'm sure they will. Pressure and scrutiny via ASR is gaining impact in the industry ;-)