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strange SMSL M500 high 3rd harmonic

DrCWO

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@DrCWO, SINAD @1kHz has little meaning wrt perceived sound quality, and that's already a gross exaggeration ;-) It's decent enough in both units and it is really the least thing I'd worry about.

You could also use two ADI-2 DAC models and keep the DAI feed from the DIGIface (AES3, SPDIF coaxial and optical). The jitter reduction of the RME's is absolutely stellar with the latest firmware update.

I saw there is a ADI-2 Pro FS out in the market. RME claims same specs as ADI-2 DAC FS. It has an six/eight channel option un the USB side so I can take headphone 3/4 out for my Woofers and the XLR out 1/2 for my Horns. I will order one of those end of month and see how nice it runs with Roon. I will run room correction and XO (as I now do with my Audiovolver) in Roon so I will have a perfect system with an ADI-2 Pro FS and my Roon core. if I like to make more experiments I still can attach an additional DAC for listening comparisons.
This seems to be a very good solution for me. I did not like the option with the RME Digiface so much because of possible Toslink jitter. ADI-2 pro FS seems to be perfect in this respect and if I like to add an additional DAC I can connect via AES which is better than Toslink!

Thank's for your hints and your support :):)
 

Lupin

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mycose

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Hello everyone! SU-9 owner here. I did read quite a bit of this thread, but I'm left wondering, does this problem cause any percetible impact in the sound? I know that measurement-wise these DACs are a complete failure, but if someone were to do an A/B test with a faulty and a non-faulty unit, would be there any discernible difference? Does this issue also mean that a cheap Apple dongle has arguably better quality than this DAC because of all the SINAD/THD+N measurements?

Just like someone mentioned earlier, some people were recommending this DAC (and the M500) not so long ago, praising its "clean" sound. I'm asking this because I don't want to feel like a retard for spending >$400 on something that could cost less than half the money and still deliver the same quality.
 

gvl

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I planned to buy two M500 Units but after reading this thread I guess I better will not do it.
Do you have a good idea what else could be recommended for a 2x2 system?
It can be two different DACs one for my horns (from 120Hz, x-Sabre Pro?) and an other for the woofers (below 120Hz)
I need DACs with a toslink input with really low jitter response because I have to drive them by a RME Digiface in combination with Roon.
Input would be appreciated.
Thanks DrCWO

Okto Research DAC8?
 

Lupin

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Hello everyone! SU-9 owner here. I did read quite a bit of this thread, but I'm left wondering, does this problem cause any percetible impact in the sound? I know that measurement-wise these DACs are a complete failure, but if someone were to do an A/B test with a faulty and a non-faulty unit, would be there any discernible difference?

This issue would've come to light much, much sooner of it was audible. Anyone who owns the M500/SU-9 and never get in contact with ASR will be just as happy with the unit as that have been last year and they still will be next year.
 
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nhatlam96

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The whole problem of ASR followers in a nutshell ;)
yup. I couldnt detect any difference between smsl su-9 + sp200 vs smsl m500 || smsl m500 vs topping dx3 pro v2. anything above 90 dB should be golden.
 

mycose

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yup. I couldnt detect any difference between smsl su-9 + sp200 vs smsl m500 || smsl m500 vs topping dx3 pro v2. anything above 90 dB should be golden.

Woah. Do you mean that all of us are ranting over something that is probably 99.99% inaudible? The rant is more than justified, but I'm just wondering if the sound of this DAC, even with the 3rd harmonic issue is any different than that of any other DAC without the issue.
 
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nhatlam96

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Woah. Do you mean that all of us are ranting over something that is probably 99.99% inaudible? The rant is more than justified, but I'm just wondering if the sound of this DAC, even with the 3rd harmonic issue is any different than that of any other DAC without the issue.
"Woah" (lol). You took my answer out of context. It was about Rme Adi vs Dx7 pro. Now chill your horses.
 

JSmith

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does this problem cause any percetible impact in the sound?
will be just as happy with the unit as that have been last year and they still will be next year.
Please read the thread, this is irrelevant and not the point of the discussion, stay on topic.



JSmith
 

Lupin

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The discussion already died more then 30 pages ago since then it's just people posting whining and complaining posts about "fraud" and "taking legal action".

Like it or not but the whole ASR crowd is nothing more than a drop of water in the ocean of global SMSL sales. There are many thousands of customers who never even heard of ASR and bought those units. In the ASR community this issue is a huge thing on a global scale however this issue is just not that big at all.

So it is relevant if the issue is audible or not. If it was audible the issue would reach far beyond the reach of the tiny community of ASR. The issue would no longer be just a drop of water in the ocean of global sales. The greatly multiplied number of people reporting the issue would force the hand of SMSL to handle it differently.

Yes the issue is real. Yes SMSL should take action and yes SMSL should help owners of the affected units to get them fixed or replaced.
But posting 30+ pages on a tiny forum somewhere on the internet is not going to help to achieve that.

People should invest the time and energy they do now posting complaint posts over and over again into contacting their reseller and/or SMSL instead to get things sorted for them.

Give it time and there will be another 30+ pages added to this thread with posts that scream "fraud" and demanding SMSL to respond in this thread.... How is that adding anything to the discussion?
 

jani80k

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Where can we report the issue? I checked on their website. It seems that they can only be contaced via social media. So I sent them a message on facebook. No reply after 4 days.
 

Lupin

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Where can we report the issue? I checked on their website. It seems that they can only be contaced via social media. So I sent them a message on facebook. No reply after 4 days.
I think one will have a much higher chance of getting it sorted if one contacts the reseller and not SMSL directly.
 

Dingenus

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Where did you bought? I did at Amazon. And on the mails you send via Amazon they react.
 

Destination: Moon

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The discussion already died more then 30 pages ago since then it's just people posting whining and complaining posts about "fraud" and "taking legal action".

Like it or not but the whole ASR crowd is nothing more than a drop of water in the ocean of global SMSL sales. There are many thousands of customers who never even heard of ASR and bought those units. In the ASR community this issue is a huge thing on a global scale however this issue is just not that big at all.

So it is relevant if the issue is audible or not. If it was audible the issue would reach far beyond the reach of the tiny community of ASR. The issue would no longer be just a drop of water in the ocean of global sales. The greatly multiplied number of people reporting the issue would force the hand of SMSL to handle it differently.

Yes the issue is real. Yes SMSL should take action and yes SMSL should help owners of the affected units to get them fixed or replaced.
But posting 30+ pages on a tiny forum somewhere on the internet is not going to help to achieve that.

People should invest the time and energy they do now posting complaint posts over and over again into contacting their reseller and/or SMSL instead to get things sorted for them.

Give it time and there will be another 30+ pages added to this thread with posts that scream "fraud" and demanding SMSL to respond in this thread.... How is that adding anything to the discussion?

Somehow this thread reminds me of Groucho Marx. He regularly complained bitterly, about how his cigars would never deliver the "30 minutes in Havana" their ads promised.... The best he could do was 20 minutes
 
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Blew

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not sure where you are located or your local laws but in Australia the retailer is 100% responsible for returns. Under consumer law they can not pass the buck to the manufacturer.

Have you returned one yet? I am reading through this thread trying to understand if this issue is something that will impact my listening. So far I'd describe it as a "minor" issue. Under Australian consumer law it says:

If the problem with a product or service is minor, you must accept a free repair if the business offers you one.

If the business fails to give you a free repair within a reasonable time or cannot fix your problem, you can:
  • get it done elsewhere and pass on the costs to the business
  • ask for a replacement
  • ask for a refund
  • recover compensation for the drop in value below the price paid.
So I'd guess that if the retailer refuses to fund a replacement or repair then we could request a full refund under Australian consumer law.

https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees/repair-replace-refund

I'm still not sure if it's worth it, since it doesn't seem to be something that is actually audible?
 

Jimbob54

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Shouldn‘t the question be: is the M500 worth the money you paid for it?
No, not at all. Its a £150 device claiming but not delivering the performance of a £400 device. As we all know, diminishing returns sets in early for electronics. Function wise this is a decent device but it performs worse than a £100 dac. I'll allow £50 for the headamp.
 
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