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Stick With G9 Or Move On?

concorde1

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I have a Panasonic G9 and 3 Panasonic-Leica lenses: 12-60, 50-200 and 45mm Macro.

I enjoy using it and I have been quite impressed with the images, although there is a bit of noise at about ISO 1600 and above. I'm aware of the limitations of M4/3.

I just found out about DXOMark. The sibling camera of G9, the GH5, has a sensor that does not do exceptionally well. Similarly all the Panasonic-Leica lenses that have been tested don't do very well.

It makes me wonder if I could have done better for the price.

I see, for example, the Sony A7 III sensor does a lot better, although the Sony 100-400 lens doesn't do a lot better than the Panasonic-Leica lenses, and I would need a telephoto zoom such as the 200-600 (not tested). Plus, the A7 III is a lot more expensive, let alone the A7 IV.

I'm a photography hobbyist. I could sell everything to get something for about the same price if it's worth it. I would be buying second hand if I did so. I have been thinking about going APS-C or full frame but I'm not 100% sure.

Any thoughts?
 

JJB70

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I just went through the whole thing of selecting a new camera and initially the Olympus and Panasonic M4/3 cameras and lenses were my preferred choice. I don't think there's anything wrong with the M4/3 sensor and the lightweight and compact size of bodies and lenses is hugely appealing. As is the relative affordable of good lenses. I think cameras are a bit like audio gear in that it is easy to get sucked into focusing on metrics, test scores etc and go down the constant upgrade path when what really matters is usable performance and what is audible or visible. Professional photographers or enthusiasts may disagree but sensors in DSLR and mirrorless cameras are so good that they are not going to be an issue for most. I did end up going FF but it wasn't a sensor decision, I just liked the tactile feel of the A7c and it felt right in my hands, combined with a good selection of relatively affordable lenses. The last bit was no better than the M4/3 option, but Sony FF E mount lenses seem to have a lot more options than the Canon R or Nikon Z alternatives including plenty of good third party options. My advice is if you are content with the G9 keep it, it's a superbly built camera and the lenses are excellent.
 

JeffS7444

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I have a Panasonic G9 and 3 Panasonic-Leica lenses: 12-60, 50-200 and 45mm Macro.

I enjoy using it and I have been quite impressed with the images, although there is a bit of noise at about ISO 1600 and above. I'm aware of the limitations of M4/3.
...
wonder if I could have done better for the price.
I've owned M43 and Sony E-mount systems since the first generations of both, and I still use both.

I have the highest regard for Sony's A7/A9/Alpha series of cameras, and G- and G Master lenses. But be aware that size and weight difference between M43 and FF lenses can be substantial, with Sony's SEL100400GM zoom weighing about 2x as your current 50-200, and your 45 mm macro to Sony's SEL90M28G (awesome piece of glass btw) is 2x+ weight difference. SEL90M28G is not something that I would carry around on an everyday basis due to it's bulk and heft. With FF cameras, I need to exercise some restraint when choosing my lenses, because goodness knows that it's really easy to wind up with an overweight camera bag.

With M43, I can go a little bit crazier with lenses, and size and weight are still manageable: 17/1.2 and 25/1.2 Zuiko Pro lenses for example: Killer performance but size and weight are still reasonable IMO.
 

JJB70

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A camera I really loved when I checked it out was the Fujifilm X-Pro3, it is beautifully built and feels like a well made 35mm mechanical camera (which I mean as a compliment). It's reasonably compact and has access to a huge range of excellent lenses. If priced the same I would have bought it in preference to the A7c, but the Sony was already well above what I had initially thought about and just the body of the X-Pro3 was more than the Sony with the basic kit zoom. You have to draw a line somewhere as it's too easy to get carried away.
 

Old Listener

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I have a Panasonic G9 and 3 Panasonic-Leica lenses: 12-60, 50-200 and 45mm Macro.

I enjoy using it and I have been quite impressed with the images, although there is a bit of noise at about ISO 1600 and above. I'm aware of the limitations of M4/3.

I just found out about DXOMark. The sibling camera of G9, the GH5, has a sensor that does not do exceptionally well. Similarly all the Panasonic-Leica lenses that have been tested don't do very well.

It makes me wonder if I could have done better for the price.

I see, for example, the Sony A7 III sensor does a lot better, although the Sony 100-400 lens doesn't do a lot better than the Panasonic-Leica lenses, and I would need a telephoto zoom such as the 200-600 (not tested). Plus, the A7 III is a lot more expensive, let alone the A7 IV.

I'm a photography hobbyist. I could sell everything to get something for about the same price if it's worth it. I would be buying second hand if I did so. I have been thinking about going APS-C or full frame but I'm not 100% sure.

Any thoughts?
You have said nothing about the kind of photos that really matter to you and how a camera and lenses with better specs would make those photos better. You didn't say anything about your use for photos (prints, display on the web or there uses) or about your workflow (using OOC Jpegs or processing raw files for example). How about video? Is that important to you? These things should the basis for choosing a new system.

My wife and I have used Panasonic m43 cameras since spring 2014. For the wildflower and wildlife photography that matter to us, the mirrorless Panasonics were a night and day improvement over the Nikon DSLRs we had been using. Focus peaking, image magnification in the viewfinder and the LCD screen, blown highlight detection and a fully articulated LCD screen greatly increased the numbers of keepers we got in wildflower photography. When we go on multi-day trips and see flowers we may never see again, you want to to capture what we saw with a photo that does justice to the original subject. For us, cameras are a tool and not a toy. Modern cameras almost all have adequate specs for most uses. Here are some photos taken with m43 cameras in a dim redwood forest with high isos

Fetid adders toungue - Forest of Nicene Marks - 2/6/2016

For wildlife photography, the m43 lenses we use (Panasonic 100-300 and Panasonic 100-400 zooms) are much lighter and cheaper than their equivalents for APS-C or full frame systems. We you are handholding your wildlife camera for hours at a time, weight matters a lot. A photo taken with the 100-300 lens on a tour boat. The very light weight of the lens was a life saver for me.


white bellied sea eagle flying


Even the cheapest m43 kit lenses can produce very pleasing photos when used within their limits. Here are some photos taken on a neighborhood walk with the Panasonic 12-60 and 45-200mm kit lenses that came with a Panasonic G85 camera.

photos with Panasonic 12-60 and 45-200 lenses

Modern mirrorless cameras are basically a battery, a sensor and a computer. The big advances have been in software driven functions.
Our Panasonics have gotten better and better from the G6 through the G7 and G85 to the superb G9. Modern cameras have tons of features. Most won't matter to you but some might make a real difference to you.

I've shared the considerations that matter to us in choosing a camera system. I'd suggest that you go through a similar process to identify what's important to you before you take the plunge.

Nikon, Canon and Sony have been putting their efforts into full frame sensor cameras and doing little to improve their APS-C products. If you really want to go with a APS-C based system, Fuji is a smarter choice for APS-C.

If I wanted to move to move to a full frame sensor system, I'd buy a Panasonic S series camera. I'd have all the benefits of the Panasonic engineering that I find superior for my uses and better specs. The real world benefits don't justify the costs to me at present.
 

LTig

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I have a Panasonic G9 and 3 Panasonic-Leica lenses: 12-60, 50-200 and 45mm Macro.

I enjoy using it and I have been quite impressed with the images, although there is a bit of noise at about ISO 1600 and above. I'm aware of the limitations of M4/3.

I just found out about DXOMark. The sibling camera of G9, the GH5, has a sensor that does not do exceptionally well. Similarly all the Panasonic-Leica lenses that have been tested don't do very well.

It makes me wonder if I could have done better for the price.

I see, for example, the Sony A7 III sensor does a lot better, although the Sony 100-400 lens doesn't do a lot better than the Panasonic-Leica lenses, and I would need a telephoto zoom such as the 200-600 (not tested). Plus, the A7 III is a lot more expensive, let alone the A7 IV.

I'm a photography hobbyist. I could sell everything to get something for about the same price if it's worth it. I would be buying second hand if I did so. I have been thinking about going APS-C or full frame but I'm not 100% sure.

Any thoughts?
The Sony A7 has a much larger sensor than the Panasonics (FF vs MFT) and hence less noise. If you definitely need top performance above ISO 1600 you must go FF (I'm looking at a 30x45 cm print of a Nikon D800, 36 MP, taken indoor hand held at ISO 2000 and there is no noise visible).

However - in a print digital noise is much less visible compared to pixel peeping on a computer screen, and even the 16 MP MFT sensors are better than analog film at any ISO setting. Up to ISO 800 I see no problems with pix from my Panasonic GX7 (16 MP) or GX9 (20 MP).
 

JJB70

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The Lumix G9 is a lovely camera to hold in the hand. Very high quality feel and good ergonomics (well I thought so). That may not affect image quality but it may affect the pleasure you get from using your camera. Tactile feel is important to me, it may be silly as it is not a performance thing but I like cameras which feel nice in the hand. One thing that put me off the EOS RP was it felt a bit low rent and the control arrangement wasn't so great (which I found surprising given the reputation of Canon). The EOS R was much nicer though ergonomically still not great IMO.
 

keith_h

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I'm a photography hobbyist. I could sell everything to get something for about the same price if it's worth it. I would be buying second hand if I did so. I have been thinking about going APS-C or full frame but I'm not 100% sure.

Any thoughts?
Is the quality of your images currently unsatisfactory? Does the handling of the camera disagree with you? Is you current post processing tool not making the most of your images perhaps? How are your images consumed?

If for example you are just looking at them on a small screen then they should be more than satisfactory. Maybe there is room to improve your post processing workflow with the existing kit if there is something about your images that you are unhappy with. I would not consider an upgrade based on numbers, but rather the quality of the images the kit produces.

Typically, these cameras are very capable of producing stunning images. Buying a new camera won't necessarily solve other underlying issues or concerns.
 

faheem

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I have a Panasonic G9 and 3 Panasonic-Leica lenses: 12-60, 50-200 and 45mm Macro.

I enjoy using it and I have been quite impressed with the images, although there is a bit of noise at about ISO 1600 and above. I'm aware of the limitations of M4/3.

I just found out about DXOMark. The sibling camera of G9, the GH5, has a sensor that does not do exceptionally well. Similarly all the Panasonic-Leica lenses that have been tested don't do very well.

It makes me wonder if I could have done better for the price.

I see, for example, the Sony A7 III sensor does a lot better, although the Sony 100-400 lens doesn't do a lot better than the Panasonic-Leica lenses, and I would need a telephoto zoom such as the 200-600 (not tested). Plus, the A7 III is a lot more expensive, let alone the A7 IV.

I'm a photography hobbyist. I could sell everything to get something for about the same price if it's worth it. I would be buying second hand if I did so. I have been thinking about going APS-C or full frame but I'm not 100% sure.

Any thoughts?
I own a Sony A1 plus Sony100400 and Olympus E-M1 iii/X and the PL200 2.8.

I’ve also owned Nikon’s D500 and Nikkor 500mm f4.

The PL200 blows the Sony 100400 out of the water in rendering, mfd, feel and handling.

I like it even more than the Nikon 500mm f4.

Mft is underrated.

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staticV3

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Here are some resources for comparing sensor performance that I find more useful than DXO's data:
 

afranta

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I've been up and down the ladder over the last few years--from m43 (Olympus and Panny) to APS-C (several Fujis) to FF (Canon 6D mark ii rather than mirrorless), back to APS-C (Fuji X-T2), and am now thinking about m43 again. I've enjoyed trying out different systems, but I've taken favorite photos with each format, and m43 is more than capable of making great images (as the lovely shots above make clear). If high ISO is important to you, a larger sensor is helpful. It's really about your priorities and what you enjoy. If I go back to m43, it will be for greater depth of field, IBIS, and the aspect ratio.
 

JJB70

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I tend to think that if smartphones with their tiny sensors are capable of such excellent results then there's no need to be particularly concerned about any of the larger formats really. It's probably more important to just feel that connection with a camera you like that makes you want to get out and use it all the time.
 
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