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Steve Guttenberg says this R2R DAC sounds like Vinyl

SIY said:
BTW, a well-designed and properly adjusted push-pull tube amp will have very low 2nd and will be dominated by 3rd harmonic. Symmetry guarantees this.
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That is why single ended tube amps rule!!!

sorry, couldn't resist.
 
invaderzim said:
That is why single ended tube amps rule!!!

sorry, couldn't resist.
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They don't do well in that respect, either. Yes, far more 2nd than a good push pull tube amp, but enormous amounts of higher order odd harmonics, not to mention wretched intermodulation results.

Here's what $350,000 will buy you. At 1 watt. 1 watt.

WAVacFIG08.jpg


Of course, $10,000 is a step down but at least you might get 24 watts.

Cary805FIG09.jpg
 
Arnandsway said:
You know, I'm beginning to wonder how second-harmonic distortion actually sounds like. I want to test myself if I can be the ultimate tube-audiphile guy and loving it dearly.
Anyone knows a plugin that only adds second harmonic distortion?
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Audacity has one built in under Effects. You can select different profiles or just even or odd. Set it in percent. It isn't a perfect emulation though as it distorts that percent at all levels while an actual amp usually will have distortion levels that vary with signal level. Still useful to see what 3% 2nd harmonic distortion sounds like. Or 12% for that matter.
 
SIY said:
They don't do well in that respect, either. Yes, far more 2nd than a good push pull tube amp, but enormous amounts of higher order odd harmonics, not to mention wretched intermodulation results.

Here's what $350,000 will buy you. At 1 watt. 1 watt.

View attachment 28267

Of course, $10,000 is a step down but at least you might get 24 watts.

View attachment 28268
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ouch, $700 or so in parts got me:
temp.jpg

well, that's from blueglow electronics video on it but it is the same schematic build.

Sure, 90 for a noise floor isn't great but I enjoy it and for building point to point tube amps are way more fun than circuit boards.
and that glow!
custom-amp2.jpg
 

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Blumlein 88 said:
Audacity has one built in under Effects. You can select different profiles or just even or odd. Set it in percent. It isn't a perfect emulation though as it distorts that percent at all levels while an actual amp usually will have distortion levels that vary with signal level. Still useful to see what 3% 2nd harmonic distortion sounds like. Or 12% for that matter.
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Thank you. I think it would be informative to find this out Indeed :)
 
invaderzim said:
Making an argument or a review about a piece of audio equipment is pretty much like giving a sales pitch.

Science based people typically aren't good salespeople. Sales is largely about selling a feeling or an emotion; unfortunately, facts don't transfer to that very well. Even though one can include facts in a sales pitch they are just there to add to and reinforce the emotions generated by the rest of the process.

When I was in sales I could sell the crud out of the products I liked because I was enthusiastic about them and truly believed in them. The customers could tell that and that made them enthusiastic about the product. A really good salesperson (or reviewer) can come across that way about every product they sell (or review).

Some science people can get passionate about things enough to pass that on to the person they are talking to but not very many.

And in the end, how do you argue with "I don't care what the numbers say, I like this better."?
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You're quite right that it's about salesmanship and enthusiasm. I do think that it's possible to be enthusiastic from an objectivist standpoint as well. Just look at the enthusiasm this site has generated for the JDS Atom and Khadas Tone Board.

The real problem is that those who are convinced that they are objectively right too often feel that this is enough and that they shouldn't have to sell it.
 
Bix26 said:
There is actual science and evidence to support tubes as having a more pleasing sound.

https://www.kenrockwell.com/audio/why-tubes-sound-better.htm
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There is only one piece of science in the entire article, and it completely undermines the author's argument! Kudos to him for actually mentioning it though I guess...

Zog said:
I did not read the statement "Second-harmonic distortion is exactly the same note, an octave above. Ditto for higher-order even harmonics; they are also the same note more octaves above. " as including 600Hz. He did not say "... the same note multiples of 100Hz above." An octave above 400 is 800. We all know that and there is a limit to how technical / detailed an author should go before he loses his audience.
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I actually don't understand the argument you're making here. Could you please explain.

The following even order harmonics are not "the same note more octaves above":
  • 6th
  • 10th
  • 12th
  • 14th
  • 18th
  • 20th
  • 22nd
  • 24th
  • 26th
  • etc.........
 
I enjoy catching up with Steve Guttenberg at RMAF. I used to point a few things he was wrong about every year. This year I can only do a few highlights. Andy Quint (TAS) is always after me for disrespecting audio salesman. Steve G is the poster boy for why I don't.
 
amirm said:
"give me a nice VU meter and I will be miles ahead in happiness than any tube.
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During my recent search for a good used, medium powered Class AB amplifier, I came across this nice-looking 2012 French-made BC Acoustique 80wpc power amplifier. It has VU meters and balanced inputs - but none were available on the USA or Canada used audio sites, so I bought a 1990's Classe Model Seventy with better specs - but no VU meters - instead.

(I even found a gif image showing the meter lighting options.)
BC Acoustique EX-522.gif
 
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An octave is a doubling (power of two) or 2^N whereas even-order harmonics are multiples of 2 or 2*N.

Octave = 1 (fundamental), 2, 4, 8,16, ... harmonics
Even-order = 1 (fundamental), 2, 4, 6, 8, 10, 12, 14, 16, ... harmonics

All octaves are even harmonics but not all even harmonics are octaves.

HTH - Don
 
But tubes have a pretty glow, and keep your house warm. Of course in hotter than hell Houston I don't need a house warmer.
 
Arnandsway said:
You know, I'm beginning to wonder how second-harmonic distortion actually sounds like. I want to test myself if I can be the ultimate tube-audiphile guy and loving it dearly.
Anyone knows a plugin that only adds second harmonic distortion?
Click to expand...

Actually, I own a few mic preamps, including a Focusrite Liquid 4Pre.
This has 4 (linear, high quality, low THD+N) mic preamps, with 'digital convolution' and other analog tricks, to simulate preamps used in some legendary studios.
One of the tricks is an "harmonics" knob, that adds either even or odd harmonics.
It also includes several tube pre-amps emulation.
That, for sure, exists also as plugins.

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/focusrite-liquid-4-pre

By the way, a distortion pedal for guitar is doing something similar.

Maybe that's all we need: a preamp profiler, inserted in the digital chain, like the Kemper the guitarists are using
They now use it together with a "transparent" (=good) class D amp, to mimic all goodies-oldies at will...
https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/Kemper_Profiling_Amplifier_Review
 
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DonH56 said:
An octave is a doubling (power of two) or 2^N whereas even-order harmonics are multiples of 2 or 2*N.

Octave = 1 (fundamental), 2, 4, 8,16, ... harmonics
Even-order = 1 (fundamental), 2, 4, 6, 8, 10, 12, 14, 16, ... harmonics

All octaves are even harmonics but not all even harmonics are octaves.

HTH - Don
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And the 14th harmonic is "out of tune" and thus isn't particularly musical (in the context of equal temperament).
 
pwjazz said:
The real problem is that those who are convinced that they are objectively right too often feel that this is enough and that they shouldn't have to sell it.
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And these are generally the type of people that emotion based marketing isn't very effective at swaying anyway.
 
Re. The Rockwell article. Notice he invokes the "wife noticed" factor. I've seen this a lot. Somehow the same people who deride you for not having finely tuned enough audio senses to tell the difference between gigabuck cables will turn around and say "my wife noticed the difference" as if that is a slam dunk test relative to the overwhelmingly male hobbyists. I think the unstated (and not fully acknowledged) idea is "my wife wasn't primed by the huge price and the impressive chassis", which is an admission of something.
 
ahofer said:
Re. The Rockwell article. Notice he invokes the "wife noticed" factor. I've seen this a lot. Somehow the same people who deride you for not having finely tuned enough audio senses to tell the difference between gigabuck cables will turn around and say "my wife noticed the difference" as if that is a slam dunk test relative to the overwhelmingly male hobbyists.
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That's a good point! Should use that as counter next time I hear this wife thing. :)
 
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