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Steve Guttenberg just posted a YouTube video about ASR

solderdude

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You start to wonder which planet Steve comes from ..
 

Xulonn

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Only paid subscribers could read the reviews??... and blind testing only?? It appears that Guttenberg believes - and fears - that true blind testing "causes" things to sound the same. Not a very well thought out scheme, IMHO.

Although I believe that most of us here at ASR would agree with Guttenberg that the real-world mainstream "system" of reviewers, manufacturers and sellers/advertisers facilitates the development and nurturing of biases and prejudices, Guttnberg's proposal is not at all similar to the ASR model of reviewing and testing.

If the background is Guttenberg's listening room, he obviously ignores the single most important variable for audiophile music systems - room acoustics. And of course, like most audiophile mainstream and niche reviewers, Guttenberg blithely ignores the human variables - both physicical and psychological. These factors "color" our perceptions and limit our ability to accurately distinguish real differences in sound over time as short as a few minutes, or even seconds. These factors reduce his credibility in my eyes.

I ignore the world of flowery audio descriptive terminology except to marvel at its creative aspects. I enjoy technology because I enjoy exploring different approaches to solving problems and achieving various goals. I can also accept as sources of challenge and enjoyment - but not as fact - the interest of people in "spiritual" and non-objective subjects. And I believe that purely subjective audiophilia is deeply related to religion and spiritual beliefs in terms of its relationship to human nature and psychology.

After six decades of enjoying music and audio technology, and two decades of off-and-on participation at online audio formus, I find the ASR with it's many intelligent, educated and enthusiastic participants to be the best "model" for audio testing, reviewing and discussion that I have experienced. But I still go to 6Moons, EnjoyTheMusic, Stereophile and other audio websites and enjoy what I see and read - although I have to be careful to not spit out my coffee in a fit of laughter sometimes.

spit.JPG
 

maverickronin

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He didn't mention it specifically. ASR is just similar in that some people loan gear or donate money for reviews.

What the video really outlines though is an audio equipment focused version of Consumer Reports...
 
OP
Jinjuku

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Where did you hear him mention ARS?

He didn't but the underlying message he is signaling lines up, more or less, the objective goal of ASR. Audioholics would also fall into this category if they weren't advertiser funded.

Here are the main points where ASR lines up:

1. No advetisors
2. Members help fund the site
3. Objective measurements that in a way are blind because they are happening separately from others efforts. Even those that are measuring at other sites. Only when notes are compared do we see repeatable results that offer significance.

Honestly I shouldn't have to be pointing any of this out as it seems everyone else here 'gets it'.
 
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rebbiputzmaker

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He didn't but the underlying message he is signaling lines up, more or less, the objective goal of ASR. Audioholics would also fall into this category if the weren't advertiser funded.
Amir would need to start charging $100 per member to fund equipment purchases instead of using his own $$. Not totally a new idea though, as the original Absolute Sound and Stereophile were free of advertising.
 

TBone

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But I still go to 6Moons ..."

6Balloons & Positive Feedbunk, IMO, easily the #1 & #2 places to visit .... if one wishes to read the very-best in Eggspert bs reviews.
 
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Jinjuku

Jinjuku

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Amir would need to start charging $100 per member to fund equipment purchases instead of using his own $$. Not totally a new idea though, as the original Absolute Sound and Stereophile were free of advertising.

Stereophile has been accepting advertisers for a long time now. Same for TAS. Try again.
 

SIY

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Yeah, Stereophile went through a progression. Initially, ad free for many years. Eventually, they took dealer ads. Then finally manufacturer ads.

I have less experience with Absolute Sound (whenever I would pick it up, I put it down quickly, it was so dreadfully bad) so don't know their progression.
 
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Jinjuku

Jinjuku

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Orginal! Were Free.

Maybe you are Too young to be aware of that.

Steve is talking about what could be a current approach. I don't think it does much good to talk about publications that haven't touched that type of model in 20 years.

But you seem to be an outlier of the current market place and I understand not everyone I come into contact is going to be rational.
 

DonH56

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The argument of the link between advertisers and reviewers has been with us for decades. I think it is less an issue than most folk believe, though there are reviewers that make you go "hmmm..." By and large I think reviewers simply review what they want to review, within reason, and are less inclined to review stuff they think might not be worth the effort. Certainly they are human and have their preferences, but I doubt the advertising department gets into it, at least for the major magazines.

TAS used to be more technical but I have not picked one up for 10+ years now except to briefly leaf through it in a store. Stereophile at least has JA to do measurements and a wide range of reviewers so I can find some I like (Kal, of course, is one).
 

Ron Texas

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Steve Guttenberg needs a haircut. Yeah, KR is one of the few reviewers who makes any sense. The entire audiophile scene is a mess where any idiot with a soldering iron can put together a $30,000 amp in their garage with a fancy extruded aluminum front panel. Anyone around here remember the 47 labs Gain Card amp? $150 in parts (retail) and sold for $3k.
 
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andreasmaaan

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Steve is talking about what could be a current approach. I don't think it does much good to talk about publications that haven't touched that type of model in 20 years.

But you seem to be an outlier of the current market place and I understand not everyone I come into contact is going to be rational.

You two are at cross-purposes. @rebbiputzmaker wasn't talking about the current marketplace, they were talking about the previous business models of these magazines. Nobody is disagreeing with you about the current marketplace.

Personally I found the fact (new to me) that these magazines previously functioned without advertising to be quite interesting as context to the current state of play.

IIRC though, Stereophile only began including objective measurements after they moved from a subscription model to an advertiser-funded model. Does anyone know if I'm correct on that?
 
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Jinjuku

Jinjuku

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You two are at cross-purposes. @rebbiputzmaker wasn't talking about the current marketplace, they were talking about the previous business models of these magazines.

And what good does that do? We might as well speak about Tucker and his automobile if it's coming to that.
 

andreasmaaan

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And what good does that do? We might as well speak about Tucker and his automobile if it's coming to that.

You're welcome to take an ahistorical approach to the audio review industry if you like. I find that the history provides worthwhile context for understanding the present state of affairs in a way that "Tucker and his automobile" does not (the reference is entirely lost on me FWIW).
 

rebbiputzmaker

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You're welcome to take an ahistorical approach to the audio review industry if you like. I find that the history provides worthwhile context for understanding the present state of affairs in a way that "Tucker and his automobile" does not (the reference is entirely lost on me FWIW).

Don't even try to make sense of it. Lol

If people are interested in having a discussion they would. As far as the early Absolute Sound and Stereophile, they were better than current IMO but still, I read them mostly for entertainment. I always found the British magazines of the era and the Japanese magazine MJ more informative.
 
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Grave

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I do not see anything about ASR.

This man is an ignoramus though. He is not trustworthy because he seems to know literally nothing true about audio.
 
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