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Steve Guttenberg: I am an Audiophile

amirm

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This was posted elsewhere and I thought it is a very worthwhile video by reviewer Steve Guttenberg. It talks about how he is an audiophile and not just a "music lover." Too often I see this snobbish attitude from some audiophiles who despite obsessing about gear all the time, spending tens of not hundreds of thousands of dollars on audio hardware, they claim they are a music lover. No, you are an audiophile. :)


He also talks about some killer bargains in audio at the end. And rightfully points out that the low-end of the market now provides excellent performance.

It also shows a down to earth person which I very much like.

It is not a long video so I encourage everyone to watch it.
 

edd9000

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I have always enjoyed The Audiophiliac on CNET, often covers entry level products.
 

Fitzcaraldo215

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Sorry, never a Guttenberg fan. I have read him in Stereophile for years, and I get zip in terms of insights or brilliance, or anything. Thank god he has mostly disappeared from those pages. I think he was JA's successor/answer to the awful Corey Greenberg, but just not as much of a "shock/jock" wannabe as Corey attempted. Steve is a nice guy, an audiophile, well spoken, a decent writer, etc. I just do not think he has anything useful or meaningful to say, Wurlitzer and all. And, aside from working for the Chesky Brothers for awhile, what exactly does he bring in the way of meaningful experience?

I hate to say it but if Steve told me something sounded good, I would shrug my shoulders and treat that as just totally irrelevant. However, I do agree with the point that a lot of cheap stuff is very good these days. I have known that for some time, and I did not need Steve to bless the idea, which is far from original to him.
 

NorthSky

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I wonder where it was taped, that video? You can hear the background noises, cars horning.
Did you see a Cat Stevens album?
 

RayDunzl

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RayDunzl

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Sal1950

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Interesting video and I believe you can take away a few things with different viewpoints. He almost admits the fact that although not many will admit it, but to be a true audiophile you have to be a major gear head in some form. Most everyone handwaves over this, "oh no, it's not about the gear/toys aspect, I'm a music lover, the gear is only a necessary evil". Yea right.
BS, we all love the new toy factor, the learning about the tech, etc, etc; we just happen to also love music and it gives us a lifetime excuse to buy and play with new stuff.. LOL.
A bit over the top there, but the reality is somewhere in the middle no matter how music lover elitist we try to portray ourselves.

At the end he discusses the aspect of "enjoying the product, not the bass, treble, etc; but how a component makes him feel is the most important thing". From this I have to take away a very veiled admission that it's not mainly about the true sound of a product, but how all those hidden subjective factors like price, looks, the design engineers story, marking spin, his relationship to those in the business, on and on;. How those things over many years of involvement in the industry can come together and bias what the reviewer/listener is hearing.
 

Blumlein 88

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Not a Steve fan, but have nothing against him. This is one of his better things actually.

We see this in most hobbies which have mostly men involved.

The biggest pro audio forum is appropriately named, Gearslutz. Unlike many audiophile forums, the real pros spend lots of time saying that yes the good gear is a little better, but what is needed for great recordings is great musicians, great spaces and someone with the knowledge to record it well. Little is gained with extreme gear fetishes. (but damn some of that gear sure is slutty, and I mean that as a drooling complement). Also, trying and choosing microphones is dammed addicting (say I having purchased another pair this week and now looking to sell three more to fund that purchase).

One might think of all hobbies in the world bicycling would have a lesser gear fetish. Instead just the reverse. There are people who act as if any bike component more than two years old should be trashed as it surely is not with the times. We are talking about along with strato jets, and steel wheel on steel rail trains the most efficient form of transportation possible. There has been no possible improvement in efficiency of even 5% for more than a century. Also unlike other hobbies you can't spend big bucks and get a bigger motor. You are the motor and always the limitation. Yet fit and feel and attachment are more rampant than nearly anything. Try discussing the choices between steel, carbon, titanium, and aluminium frames with these people. Even worse try frame geometry. I mean how many ways can you put two triangles together. Common slang about bikes is "it is not about the bike". Yet everyone knows, other than real competitors, it is all about the bike. One fellow wrote an honest book describing the rabid extreme variety titled, "It is ALL about the bike". He simply detailed his personal upgrade path.

That is why I feel modern digital audio gear has spawned more subjectivity than ever before. Real potential improvement is less than 5%, probably more like 1% and maybe like .1% other than cost and features. In some fields when this point is reached you might find a final stage where the product becomes a commodity appliance. Yet stereos aren't like washers, and fridges, and houses, and how cars have become. Neither are bikes or mikes. None of these are something like a basic essential for modern life. So getting crazy, creative, and subjective is a form of expression of taste or social standing of what is a luxury in the first place.
 

watchnerd

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What was his point about the Wurlitzer?

I, too, have nostalgic childhood memories of what my parents listened to (in that case, 1970's Sanyo rack system with with a big graphic equalizer and big wooden boxes). Lots of people do, I'm sure.

He keeps coming back to how it makes you feel. Well, okay, Steve, but that doesn't mean it's high fidelity.
 

watchnerd

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That is why I feel modern digital audio gear has spawned more subjectivity than ever before. Real potential improvement is less than 5%, probably more like 1% and maybe like .1% other than cost and features. In some fields when this point is reached you might find a final stage where the product becomes a commodity appliance. Yet stereos aren't like washers, and fridges, and houses, and how cars have become. Neither are bikes or mikes. None of these are something like a basic essential for modern life. So getting crazy, creative, and subjective is a form of expression of taste or social standing of what is a luxury in the first place.

Eh, I dunno....we represent an isolated super-niche. For the millions who have bought Sonos, Amazon Echos, and will buy the new Apple speaker, they really are becoming like commodity appliances that you buy mostly for the features, not as some kind of Veblen good.

My Michell Gyrodec turntable was a status symbol back when Steve Jobs owned one in the 1980s. Nobody who visits me even knows what it is, let alone is impressed by it. Same with my Martin Logan speakers. Although they all think both look cool.
 

Frank Dernie

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I enjoyed the video. I like the gear, as an engineer, and usually only audition stuff which appeals to me in an engineering sense but not only the engineering appertaining to sound quality but quality of manufacture, ergonomics and styling too.

I bought an ex-demo Goldmund Reference turntable with T3f arm when they stopped making them because that was the one product which IMO best optimised all the essentials of record player design I had discovered whilst working at Garrard in the mid 1970s.
I bought a Devialet amp about 6 years ago because of the engineering, simplicity and its rotary volume control on the remote (I absolutely detest up/down buttons).

In terms of SQ I spent a lot of time when I first built this room 20 years ago positioning the speakers to minimise their excitation of the main modes (before I went into motor racing full time I did noise and vibration trouble shooting, which almost always involved solving resonance problems by changing mode shape or trying to move the excitation nearer an antinode). This resulted in a very non wife friendly room but relatively even FR without resorting to room correction. I suppose if it was now I would have spent less time on positioning and more on correction!

OTOH it really is the music not the sound for me, and though I love good quality sound and have spent a big proportion of my income on getting it I would rather listen to Mahler on my old Walkman cassette player than Bruce Springsteen on the best hifi in the world.

I also like cameras. Here I am a total gear slut. I have loads of kit and have collected for decades but whilst I have taken some nice pictures I am not much of a photographer and am very likely to miss any photo opportunity even if I remember my camera...
 
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amirm

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I think the nut of this for me is that an audiophile almost always pays attention to fidelity of music he is hearing in addition to the music itself. A pure music lover doesn't. Even though I very much enjoy good music on even the most basic playback device, analysis of sound happens intuitively as a concurrent affair. I think this is the point that Steve was making in the video. That there is secondary enjoyment in achieving what we think hi-fi is.
 

watchnerd

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I think the nut of this for me is that an audiophile almost always pays attention to fidelity of music he is hearing in addition to the music itself. A pure music lover doesn't. Even though I very much enjoy good music on even the most basic playback device, analysis of sound happens intuitively as a concurrent affair. I think this is the point that Steve was making in the video. That there is secondary enjoyment in achieving what we think hi-fi is.

I agree with you directionally, but might take it a step further:

Audiophiles value recording quality higher than performance quality.

Take "Jazz at the Pawnshop", for instance, which was in heavy rotation as an audiophile demo album for a few decades (it seems less in favor now). According to Wikipedia:

"The album is widely regarded by audiophiles as the best jazz recording of the 20th Century."

I own a copy. The recording quality is amazing. However, the performance is....okay. It's pleasant enough, but rarely do I get a craving to the album for its emotional conveyance.

I would level the same charge at many Reference Recording albums. Great recordings, run-of-the-mill performances.
 

Thomas savage

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I agree with you directionally, but might take it a step further:

Audiophiles value recording quality higher than performance quality.

Take "Jazz at the Pawnshop", for instance, which was in heavy rotation as an audiophile demo album for a few decades (it seems less in favor now). According to Wikipedia:

"The album is widely regarded by audiophiles as the best jazz recording of the 20th Century."

I own a copy. The recording quality is amazing. However, the performance is....okay. It's pleasant enough, but rarely do I get a craving to the album for its emotional conveyance.

I would level the same charge at many Reference Recording albums. Great recordings, run-of-the-mill performances.
Yes ironic, audiophilia becomes anti music..
 

Thomas savage

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To that point, when listening to "Jazz at the Pawnshop" at shows, I've heard demo audiences comment on how "realistic" things other than the music sounded -- glasses clinking, people in the audience coughing -- as the mark of a high end system.
Yes, its at these times I start to think we have gone about as far as we should as a species...
 
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