Stereophile doubles down on the snake oil!

[mhardy6647]

At its simplest, it comprises a pair of insulated wires a few meters long of moderate—say, half an ohm—loop resistance

Half an ohm? Are they using sewing thread?

hmm...
Semiconductor cables.
The Next Big Thing.

 

[mhardy6647]

A tachyon, as I understand it, is a postulated and controversial faster-than-light particle that (not surprisingly) had yet to be observed.

[emphasis added]

I mean... sort of by definition.

 

[chelgrian]

"The seemingly high cost of good cable is an inevitable consequence of often-arduous prototyping followed by a costly manufacturing run."

Ah, no. When we had our retail operations, cable companies would constantly visit us. Their first sentence on why we should carry their line? "We give you 65% margin!" I have had detailed discussions with cable companies at audio shows with my "dealer hat" on, discussing bling factors of cables and what sells and what doesn't on that front. Folks are so naive here....

For example the UK Nordost distributor is:

Renaissance Audio

High-end audio specialist Renaissance brings award-winning brands MOON, VPI Industries, Nordost and Audiovector to the UK Hi-Fi market. Supporting the UK’s best hi-fi shops with supply of music streamers, amplifiers, all-in-one music systems, turntables, premium Hi-Fi audio cables and system optimis

www.renaissanceaudio.co.uk

You can find their latest accounts at:

https://s3.eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/document-api-images-live.ch.gov.uk/docs/YJIOpTg5W9exrMINY7_YdGYbSnOX1JPRb4oAmqYQCJM/application-pdf?X-Amz-Algorithm=AWS4-HMAC-SHA256&X-Amz-Credential=ASIAWRGBDBV3O27VELAX%2F20250521%2Feu-west-2%2Fs3%2Faws4_request&X-Amz-Date=20250521T220214Z&X-Amz-Expires=60&X-Amz-Security-Token=IQoJb3JpZ2luX2VjEAkaCWV1LXdlc3QtMiJHMEUCIQCb12CiiUlNBy6MBEFvrIHoLsMDbqhTnXJTsSkx9yrgDgIgMnQzhPeWHkF%2BlViyFYduaj5droTcGpf5rLioJkzG9pcqxAUIwv%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2FARAFGgw0NDkyMjkwMzI4MjIiDOEXc4Yhe5moM7mltyqYBa%2F2bh3UIH1zeMyFh9IVT%2B8lgeeS6zQ4%2BiZwBm7LU0kQwZJd8KjIksGnUwyqO1a2vqjlnsSNwlukN2VY5c7dCeYwTqmmj%2B2o3UGqc6yyrIMP8VfznWDvYX%2BcwBTqqmBk5hhSjEOM6kP34PXu%2BAlC1X85Brqz%2BeS9l2mzXncHosR%2B1HvLo1vVpXGpw7tW3FkzLprtfCORcELRj%2FJi8AWjMDm5Yfck0%2F5wRq9ALFkiOoqqDSFSkOSFUu6my3PzLPlhhQmTeNpp6MXZtRMnBGKbCJjlW9E4M5w%2FIA5%2BsJ7qAur%2Fsd%2BsXnELkuq8LNTBLmrPUHFIXm3pSSUTPVfkwV9uufnIKLVPp3l0SPtrvJniqg9YmtnBwu9tPjwlcLG77yLsoKH0IiljOdQRnFWzO%2Fd6R6uk3AU2zXLn4aFD16TTl0lxHHRSU8AiPY6k%2BAz3EXRNmIvJDrKQaHqmPuSIMGmaGfZnBk%2B0%2FwwKOsXedZQ6EmroNclEsgEvhRLffBZw9%2Fxz%2Fl9bm%2F94V27ion5Ejpm5qFMQMu7TJU6SKxRVPtEyBpM8IBi8a9JGbD03H4NMxg8UckFMou8wvwt3yseYa9S8R6XvcQHCD32Dd%2FTeF5jfMEMWJkyXeEr6rzVdDST%2FeQWeaEOepcXdBCmOTaaExM9HFTO6wpy3DtmJY7Rm88NBPGOla4mr6L7bg9BduRexPLhATXjc6o3zlLo9CW1OzdPfhSQ0H1d0G6965MU1RolvLTzLYwiTF%2BiEXw1m1YzYf2uOJcYA1gBhBgmWmupK5W1y1piv1XcrlZ6sMDoyTuieYbcQ7aBeem%2B4DicoYw1jU2bwPGCQeuXaQ%2F%2BiSMcsh8laxgaDp83DfQ2tXyLhCBXfzesSRDJQJ6CBNIUwxfu3wQY6sQFMajKMEjLrydHYf755aW%2Bg4ViABvPUQO8KjmkKOV3G7xQKH4IgrkywzPV%2Fn284T5y6JYEjJf0RoT3p%2F%2F33j6x4T96k0Lxu0uxrhexR7hpI71b1l7dhkZIMK4W4rLNugjFNmr4UzLRqkPj9RpoEzzyONcYlWgRYhd22QYUb0ZIUwqkvxhHW3HXdJhyOV5xjJG9%2Fn5Mx3cSlpi4RwPGlrVvHay5whYutfe8g8ROJ6Rnr9u4%3D&X-Amz-SignedHeaders=host&response-content-disposition=inline%3Bfilename%3D%22SC221764_aa_2025-01-30.pdf%22&X-Amz-Signature=44ea493faa2f642778db1d341e775536976f6221770b3830fe7868e7edfdf244

Their balance sheet is tiny considering the MSRP of some of the products they distribute. And the following sentence is telling.

“The directors of the company have elected not to include a copy of the profit and loss account within the financial statements.”

 

[watchnerd]

"How much of your budget should be allocated to a set of cables? Even the least expensive options will perform to some degree. With unlimited resources, you can spend whatever you like, even for small improvements, but 10%–20% of total system cost seems reasonable for a good audio system."

Nah, I'm not blowing four to five figures on cables, Martin.

 

[kyuu]

"How much of your budget should be allocated to a set of cables? Even the least expensive options will perform to some degree. With unlimited resources, you can spend whatever you like, even for small improvements, but 10%–20% of total system cost seems reasonable for a good audio system."

Nah, I'm not blowing four to five figures on cables, Martin.

Even for a cheapsake like me, who spent around $3k for my entire 5.1 system, that'd be $300-600 on cables. Nope, that's still too much.

 

[Ropeburn]

Maybe unfair, but to me it seems Martin Colloms has been muddying the hi-fi waters for long time.

At the end of the article John Atkinson refers to a 1995 article by Malcolm Omar Hawksford entitled, "The Essex Echo 1995: Electrical Signal Propagation & Cable Theory". That article seems to deal with the speed of propagation of signals within cables, arguing that aspects of the cable, e.g. diameter, can adversely affect transmission.

Since I'm no electrical engineer, scientist, or mathematician it's all gobbledygook to me but might be comprehensible to other people. The question is -- allowing for its from validity -- is it relevant to audio signals?

The signal propagation speed in a copper wire is roughly ⅔ lightspeed. Meaning, in a 10m wire we're looking at a travel time of 50 nanoseconds.

 

[raif71]

Not cable but cabal

 

[ivayvr]

Wow. And there went what integrity was left at Stereophile, lame

Luckily, not much damage there!

 

[kemmler3D]

The signal propagation speed in a copper wire is roughly ⅔ lightspeed. Meaning, in a 10m wire we're looking at a travel time of 50 nanoseconds.

To put this in perspective, at that speed, the signal can make a round trip up and down the cable over 200 times during a single sample at 44.1Khz. So like, way faster than audio goes.

 

[thewas]

One day later the same author published this article:

An AudioQuest Cable Loom: Vodka network, Pegasus interconnects, Robin Hood speaker cables, Blizzard power cables

I began the test series I discussed in Colloms on Cables with the first company to respond to our request for review samples: AudioQuest (footnote 1). Their loom comprised a pair of Robin Hood Zero loudspeaker cables; Pegasus I/C interconnects, both unbalanced RCA and balanced XLR; Blizzard AC...

www.stereophile.com

Honi soit qui mal y pense

 

[watchnerd]

Even for a cheapsake like me, who spent around $3k for my entire 5.1 system, that'd be $300-600 on cables. Nope, that's still too much.

Oh I’ve easily spent that over my life because there always seemed to be some cable I didn’t have.

Now I have a box full.

 

[Short38]

Perhaps the article was humor? When the idea of cable “conditioning” appeared in the article I thought why not open a cable spa

 

[Mart68]

''For this test, I had blinded my invited subject Charlie; he had no clue as to which wire was present in which domain—indeed, of whether I had even made any substitutions at all.''

So how does that work? It's inferred that Charlie's heard the system before at some point in the past. He gets invited over to listen to this Audioquest stuff. So he knows why he's there. He isn't told if the change has already been made or not (it has) and he hears an improvement - based on his memory of what it sounded like from - how long ago?

This isn't blind testing, not by a long chalk. But Colloms just drops it in there as part of the picture he's painting.

 

[Purité Audio]

The articles are disgraceful, Colloms since his own magazine closed has been thrown the odd piece of work . I suppose it’s part of the ‘old boys network’.
10-20% of the systems value unbelievable, really unbelievable.
Keith

 

[Mart68]

10-20% of the systems value unbelievable, really unbelievable.
Keith

He probably thinks that's being conservative. I have seen a UK dealer advertising their top of the line system - the speakers cost £5K, the speaker cables cost £6K. The total - one source - system totalled £40K of which £10K was budgeted to cables and almost £20K on amplification.

The speakers were an unremarkable two and half way (with rinky-dink little drivers), for which there's no published measurements.

And people wonder why they're all going out of business?

 

[Ropeburn]

He probably thinks that's being conservative. I have seen a UK dealer advertising their top of the line system - the speakers cost £5K, the speaker cables cost £6K. The total - one source - system totalled £40K of which £10K was budgeted to cables and almost £20K on amplification.

The speakers were an unremarkable two and half way (with rinky-dink little drivers), for which there's no published measurements.

And people wonder why they're all going out of business?

What a shame. For 40k you could allocate 35k for speakers. Easily. And get something crazy, including two 18" subs or whatever floats your boat. For that kinda money virtually anything is possible, and they put regular 2.5-ways there and call it a day? Seriously?

 

[Mart68]

What a shame. For 40k you could allocate 35k for speakers. Easily. And get something crazy, including two 18" subs or whatever floats your boat. For that kinda money virtually anything is possible, and they put regular 2.5-ways there and call it a day? Seriously?

View attachment 452622

Seriously. Like you say, with that budget you could get something devastatingly good.

My guess is the system is structured so the bulk of the spend is on items that give the dealer the highest margins.

More profit for them in the short term, long term a strategy for disaster - IME.

 

[Purité Audio]

The majority of retailers stock heavily marketed product , actual sound quality is not at the top of the list.
Keith

 

[Short38]

''For this test, I had blinded my invited subject Charlie; he had no clue as to which wire was present in which domain—indeed, of whether I had even made any substitutions at all.''

So how does that work? It's inferred that Charlie's heard the system before at some point in the past. He gets invited over to listen to this Audioquest stuff. So he knows why he's there. He isn't told if the change has already been made or not (it has) and he hears an improvement - based on his memory of what it sounded like from - how long ago?

This isn't blind testing, not by a long chalk. But Colloms just drops it in there as part of the picture he's painting.

Collom’s stated that he “blinded…Charlie” which was perhaps a little extreme.

 

[JSmith]

It’s worth a read just to witness the mental gymnastics at play.

Yep, this part is an example of that;

How much of your budget should be allocated to a set of cables? Even the least expensive options will perform to some degree. With unlimited resources, you can spend whatever you like, even for small improvements, but 10%–20% of total system cost seems reasonable for a good audio system. Sometimes a given spend will have effectively topped out with just the speakers and electronics; subsequent system improvement can only be achieved by additional, perhaps stressful investments in those other bits, passive "components" such as cables and equipment supports, and—where aesthetically acceptable—room acoustic treatment.

Ah, the old saying one needs to spend a certain percentage of total system cost on cables.

Then doubles down, implying cables offer a better path to system improvement than room treatment.


JSmith