Stereophile doubles down on the snake oil!

[MattHooper]

I think it’s very few members here who put up a fuss and the way you’re talking about. (unfortunately they can be fairly vocal and persistent.)

It bugs me when criticism of vinyl fails the “walk into a room” test. Say what you like about the objective inferiority of vinyl and the superiority of SOTA digital, but don’t tell me that if you walk into a room where a quiet pressing of a beautifully mastered LP is playing on an excellent system, you’re hearing some crippled thing that’s not hi-fi because there’s a noise floor and an occasional tick or pop, and because digital admittedly measures better.

Yes, my source components are in a separate room for my listening room. When I’m demoing my system for guests, musicians, or audiophiles, unless I tell them the source, they usually don’t know whether they are listening to digital or a record. Commonly they assume that a record they just listened to was a CD or streaming.

 

[mhardy6647]

Whereas I just kinda sorta stay outta the fray...

https://flic.kr/p/2ogrRrJ

https://flic.kr/p/mjejUV

I will also take this opportunity to note that I have steadfastly not posted any images of the rest of the LPs which are consigned to the (thankfully fairly dry) basement. If you think the two shelf units shown above are ill-organized... well... draw your own conclusions.

 

[HalSF]

Yes, my source components are in a separate room for my listening room. When I’m demoing my system for guests, musicians, or audiophiles, unless I tell them the source, they usually don’t know whether they are listening to digital or a record. Commonly they assume that a record they just listened to was a CD or streaming.

That's brilliant! And helps put the undeniable ways that digital wins and vinyl loses in perspective. I love both and find the formats complementary.

 

[kyuu]

That's brilliant! And helps put the undeniable ways that digital wins and vinyl loses in perspective. I love both and find the formats complementary.

Thing that makes me consider the most is that if the differences between vinyl and Red Book are that difficult to hear, then why are audiophiles always so preoccupied so many other things that are certainly even harder to perceive?

 

[Palmer]

The Absolute Sound is , cough, gaining ground - on Stereophile...

 

[mhardy6647]

Ulfberht sure sounds like a Schitty EDIT Schiit-y name...

 

[Palmer]

Ulfberht sure sounds like a Schitty name...

Uhn-thill ya hear them... Or it will be confirmed, who am I kidding...

 

[Sal1950]

But vinyl playback is not snake oil.

Hi Rick, Sorry but you must be corrected on this point.
The myth of vinyl playback as presented in the high-end media is most definitely snake-oil.
Just as folks are told about all the glorious sound quality improvements that are at the end of a expensive cable and cord path,
the exact same is their portrayal of vinyl. Despite what you can read day after day, a 5 and 6 figure vinyl rig can never equal the
path of a $25 used CD player with a equally high quality mastered CD.
Now none of that is a platform for the bashing of the enjoyment of playing with it or any other obsolete tech, it's just the reality of
the facts. Joe Sixpack deserves to be told the truth and not have the smoke forever blown up his rear for the financial gain of a few.
Page after page of written flowery imaginary prose does not a SOTA High Fidelity Home Music Reproduction system make.
To portray Vinyl as anything more is simply Snake-Oil

 

[IPunchCholla]

Thing that makes me consider the most is that if the differences between vinyl and Red Book are that difficult to hear, then why are audiophiles always so preoccupied so many other things that are certainly even harder to perceive?

Basically they are the food critique from Ratatouille. They think hyper criticism of reproduction makes them truer music fans. Which maybe it does. In a sad joyless way.

 

[MattHooper]

That's brilliant! And helps put the undeniable ways that digital wins and vinyl loses in perspective. I love both and find the formats complementary.

I often done this deliberately. Unless I’ve told them that I’m going to be playing a record I often hide the “needle drop” of the needle going down at first, by having the volume down and then quickly turning it back up for the song to begin. You generally can’t hear any record noise when the music is actually playing, so it really comes down to what the music sounds like. I find it’s just as easy to blow the minds of guests - sonically speaking - with a good vinyl record as with a digital source.

By far the components that influence the sound quality they are going to hear are my speakers and the room set up. That is generally what they are responding to - and there’s just gobs of spaciousness and detail and imaging and impact from vinyl for them to respond to as with digital. The choice of formats falls well below the choice of loudspeakers and room/set up IMO in terms of determining sonic quality.

 

[teched58]

Is there anybody on this thread that's interesting in talking about STEREOPHILE?

And the fact that they have DISABLED COMMENTS ON THEIR ARTICLES, apparently as of June 6, 2025 (D-Day?)

 

[Mart68]

Is there anybody on this thread that's interesting in talking about STEREOPHILE?

And the fact that they have DISABLED COMMENTS ON THEIR ARTICLES, apparently as of June 6, 2025 (D-Day?)

Not really any loss. Those comment sections often got vicious and I'd guess they didn't want the overhead cost of monitoring them.

Added to which no advertiser wants comments under their glowing review that are along the lines of 'What a rip-off!'

 

[Alexander Gödde]

The last Stereophile comment threads where increasingly a few people (including sometimes me) arguing more or less cogently against the audiophile voodoo worldview and one commenter ("glotz") viciously attacking the critics. Amusing to rationalists, maybe, but potentially damaging to the Stereophile brand.

 

[Audiofire]

Always the same with stupid suppression. Silencing dissent. Ignoring the dissenters they can't silence.

 

[Sal1950]

Is there anybody on this thread that's interesting in talking about STEREOPHILE?

And the fact that they have DISABLED COMMENTS ON THEIR ARTICLES, apparently as of June 6, 2025 (D-Day?)

I believe it is a reflection of the growing strength-size of the objective community.
They just can no longer afford to allow free speech on their site.
Soon to come will be the end of the hard magazine publication in favor of a download only one.
The bell tolls for the death of High End Audio Snake-Oil.

 

[HalSF]

Hi Rick, Sorry but you must be corrected on this point.
The myth of vinyl playback as presented in the high-end media is most definitely snake-oil.
Just as folks are told about all the glorious sound quality improvements that are at the end of a expensive cable and cord path,
the exact same is their portrayal of vinyl. Despite what you can read day after day, a 5 and 6 figure vinyl rig can never equal the
path of a $25 used CD player with a equally high quality mastered CD.
Now none of that is a platform for the bashing of the enjoyment of playing with it or any other obsolete tech, it's just the reality of
the facts. Joe Sixpack deserves to be told the truth and not have the smoke forever blown up his rear for the financial gain of a few.
Page after page of written flowery imaginary prose does not a SOTA High Fidelity Home Music Reproduction system make.
To portray Vinyl as anything more is simply Snake-Oil

“Expensive vinyl systems can never equal even a cheap CD system.”

So what? Even a quite inexpensive turntable setup can sound pretty nice. It ain’t no sin if you enjoy different audio formats as long as you’re honest about the audio science. Just like it’s possible to appreciate and praise vinyl honestly without exaggerating its virtues, maybe try advocating for the advantages of digital playback without all the overgeneralizing histrionics about “snake oil.”

 

[Sal1950]

“Expensive vinyl systems can never equal even a cheap CD system.”

So what? Even a quite inexpensive turntable setup can sound pretty nice. It ain’t no sin if you enjoy different audio formats as long as you’re honest about the audio science. Just like it’s possible to appreciate and praise vinyl honestly without exaggerating its virtues, maybe try advocating for the advantages of digital playback without all the overgeneralizing histrionics about “snake oil.”

So what would you rather have me do,
Tell everyone all the BS unloaded daily from the Snake-oil salesman is true?
I'm simply laying out the facts for those unenlightened or interested.
No need to get your panties in a wad if you enjoy it.
Continue on --------------------

 

[egellings]

View attachment 455960
But it sure has a decidedly toroidy toroid.

Those round corners on the case have to be worth something, too.

 

[HalSF]

So what would you rather have me do,
Tell everyone all the BS unloaded daily from the Snake-oil salesman is true?
I'm simply laying out the facts for those unenlightened or interested.
No need to get your panties in a wad if you enjoy it.
Continue on --------------------

I would rather have you step back from format-vs.-format antagonism and express your positive preferences and audio knowledge in a more encouraging, less invidious way. I’m 100% on your side about rejecting high-end audiophile nonsense, by the way — this forum has been a huge help to me in understanding the fundamentals of great sound and avoiding subjective myths and finding great new components that enhance my deep enjoyment of music.

 

[DSJR]

If all you're spending is a few hundred quid/dollrs on a carefully selected new or used vinyl source and you have a collection of LPs and 12" singles as I do, then go for it in my opinion.

If however, you have more money than sense and are attracted to lavish vinyl players costing many thousands, an equally expensive pickup and phono stage, oh, and valves/tubes in the amp (and not necessarily a big Mac either, outside of the US), then I'd question it strongly. Thing is, I think the audiophool part of our audio fraternity, still believes digital, most solid state and chips in particular, are the devil's work and simply cannot recreate a good musical experience to their golden-eared minds - just my vibes right now.