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Stereo receivers, amps, and preamps with XO that include high-pass filter for the main speakers?

KEW

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Those with more experience than I, please check my logic
For anyone using a sub, I consider this a very important feature. If someone is setting up (for example) a bedroom system using KEF LS50 L&R with a sub, the benefit of being able to unload the bass from them is substantial (especially if you cross at 100 or higher to avoid the distortion at 80Hz).
I think it could be argued that the sound quality using an SMSL AD18 (see edit below) might be a better than that of the Yamaha WXA-50 in a situation like this because audible benefit of a HPF on the LS50s is greater than the audible benefit from the Yamaha's superior Sinad scores. IOW, having 5" drivers attempting low frequencies is the more audible offense.
I am no expert ... is this interpretation reasonable?
I am wondering what other options there are for bass management. Please list any units you are aware of that have a HPF for the mains! Please don't list AVR's because I think we can assume any modern AVR has good bass management!

These are the few I know of, and I hope my memory is correct on the details:
SMSL AD-18 (IIRC it is fixed at 100Hz)
Klipsch Powergate (IIRC, it is fixed at 80Hz)

Emotiva USP (discontinued) (variable crossover point)
Outlaw RR2160 (variable)
Yamaha R-N803 (variable - stereo unit with AVR style YPAO system)

Thanks!

Edit: Sorry, I was badly mistaken on the two with strike through. On the Klipsch Powergate, I was confused with the plate amp on the Klipsch R-26PF which has proper bass management.
On the AD-18, I was just confused (or smoking crack, or something)!:facepalm:
 
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Trouble Maker

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The NAD C338 has sub out, I believe with fixed either 100hz or 80hz LPF. I'm unsure if it high pass filters the mains. I've not used it like that, just running it to towers sans sub.

Unfortunately it's in storage back home so I can't check it. I also can't find any sold info online, for example the manual is really lacking here.

I love the built in wifi and streaming. It lives in standby and I can just turn it on with my phone by the NAD remote app, then stream 'directly' from Spotify.
 
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EEG

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Onkyo TX-8270 and TX 8390-Network stereo receivers.
HK 990-integrated amplifier. The last great Harman product.
Denon DRA-800H and Marantz NR 1200- Network stereo receivers. Very similar models.
Marantz PM 7000N -Network stereo receiver.
Outlaw RR2150 - stereo receiver
 
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Doodski

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HK 990-integrated amplifier.
DrooL! Some hot screenshots of it's internals on the web. I've used the Citation Series a lot but I've never seen a HK designed and built like this one.
HK Integrated.jpg
 
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EEG

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Unfortunately the built quality was not as high as the looks and the design. They(HK) had to make a high end product at 2000$. Which was almost an imposibile task at the time. That's why there were a lot of defective units with all kinds of embarrasing problems. The volume rotary encoder e.g. A friend of mine who ownes the beast changed 3 in 5 years.
 
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Doodski

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Unfortunately the built quality was not as high as the looks and the design. They(HK) had to make a high end product at 2000$. Which was almost an imposibile task at the time. That's why there were a lot of defective units with all kinds of embarrasing problems. The volume rotary encoder e.g. A friend of mine who ownes the beast changed 3 in 5 years.
I've changed a few caps in HK stuff but overall for the price it seemed OK.
 
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EEG

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I still own a HK 3490. Moded by a brilliant electronics engineer in the preamp section.
 
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EEG

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Arcam FMJ SR250 stereo receiver. Another "monster". Dirac Live calibration can manage speakers high pass filtering.
 
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K

KEW

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Onkyo TX-8270 and TX 8390-Network stereo receivers.
I forgot about the Onkyos! I know at least one of those was also produced under the Integra badge, Anyone remember the model number?
 

Kvalsvoll

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I have customers using Devialet (confirmed works well), and now also Anthem.

You also need delay on the main speakers, for proper integration. This means the amplifier must use digital processing. Some 2-channel amplifiers use analog filters, and in those there is no way to get proper time alignment.

Some newer active loudspeaker systems has all the required processing built-in, you only need a line out your preamp/amplifier. Such system consist of satellite main speakers and a separate bass section, it is no longer called a "sub", we call it bass-system. Integration is perfect both in time and frequency domain. This is the future.
 

Chrispy

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Onkyo TX-8270 and TX 8390-Network stereo receivers.
HK 990-integrated amplifier. The last great Harman product.
Denon DRA-800H and Marantz NR 1200- Network stereo receivers. Very similar models.
Marantz PM 7000N -Network stereo receiver.
Outlaw RR2150 - stereo receiver

Marantz PM 7000N as a receiver caught my eye (that's usually the integrated amp designation plus an unfamiliar model) and don't see that it has a high pass filter for the speakers, just a low pass filter.
 
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Chrispy

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Onkyo TX-8270 and TX 8390-Network stereo receivers.
HK 990-integrated amplifier. The last great Harman product.
Denon DRA-800H and Marantz NR 1200- Network stereo receivers. Very similar models.
Marantz PM 7000N -Network stereo receiver.
Outlaw RR2150 - stereo receiver

Also looking at the Denon and Marantz, see only a LPF for the Marantz mentioned, nothing for the Denon......
 
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waynel

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Doodski

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Not a good solution as this creates a slow 1st order filter with difficult to determine corner frequency.
It's good for cheap effective for the price car audio stuff.
 
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win

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Those with more experience than I, please check my logic
For anyone using a sub, I consider this a very important feature. If someone is setting up (for example) a bedroom system using KEF LS50 L&R with a sub, the benefit of being able to unload the bass from them is substantial (especially if you cross at 100 or higher to avoid the distortion at 80Hz).
I think it could be argued that the sound quality using an SMSL AD18 might be a better than that of the Yamaha WXA-50 in a situation like this because audible benefit of a HPF on the LS50s is greater than the audible benefit from the Yamaha's superior Sinad scores. IOW, having 5" drivers attempting low frequencies is the more audible offense.
I am no expert ... is this interpretation reasonable?
I am wondering what other options there are for bass management. Please list any units you are aware of that have a HPF for the mains! Please don't list AVR's because I think we can assume any modern AVR has good bass management!

These are the few I know of, and I hope my memory is correct on the details:
SMSL AD-18 (IIRC it is fixed at 100Hz)
Klipsch Powergate (IIRC, it is fixed at 80Hz)
Emotiva USP (discontinued) (variable crossover point)
Outlaw RR2160 (variable)
Yamaha R-N803 (variable - stereo unit with AVR style YPAO system)

Thanks!

From my personal experience, I got better response from using two mono subs, individually eq'ing each one. The hpf on my bookshelfs is close to their natural roll off; I only used it to smooth out their interaction with the subs but kept it as low hz as possible. That way the mains still give you the benefit of stereo bass, but you let your subs fill in all the problematic frequencies in your room.

I would make sure you compare the results of killing your stereo bass with such a high crossover frequency when the speakers are rated for lower.
 
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Trouble Maker

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Another idea I had in this area that I think greatly opens up possible receivers/integrateds and ups the capability quite a bit is getting something with a tape/EQ loop and hanging a 4 channel miniDSP* (2x4, 2x4HD, DDRC-24).

Or you just go 'full out' and go Pre-amp>miniDSP*>amp, or SHD*>amp
But then you have a few boxes and you might be trying to avoid this.
So for example those miniDSP (2>4 channel) boxes are probably small enough to tuck behind your receiver.

*Insert whatever DSP box you would like here.

You might be able to get a better, better price/performance ratio by not requiring the BM be in the receiver/integrated and just move it out into a DSP box that can do a better job at it. You also get room correction and maybe integrated bass management, assuming any of these have Dirac Live BM yet.
 
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