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Starting a headphone company in Switzerland?

cyph3r

Member
Joined
Oct 17, 2020
Messages
7
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8
Location
Switzerland
I just got laid off.

Which is never great but this time I feel it could be an opportunity. I work(ed) in pharma for almost two decades now and I feel like I have seen it all.

Besides science, I love music and I made my own in-ears in the past and sold them to friends and family.

So why not doing something different this time than chasing the next job? I am thinking about developing headphone and in-ears, maybe even TWS systems. I may not have all the skills and expertise to do this. So I am looking for local partners: audio/ electronic engineers, people with skill and entrepreneurial spirit.

PM me if you are interested.
 
Condolences on the layoff. Been there. If you have savings it can be a good opportunity to start something.

My previous job was head of product (and marketing) at a consumer audio startup that sold portable speakers, headphones and IEMs. I'm just going to throw a cliche at you because based on my direct experience working in consumer audio, it's true: "Starting an audio business is a good way to make a small fortune - by starting with a large one".

Before you start, YOU MUST do the most rigorous financial modeling you can figure out how to do. You are proposing to enter into direct competition with e.g. Moondrop or Truthear who have multiple advantages simply by virtue of being part of the Chinese manufacturing ecosystem. They will not leave you enough margin to wipe your nose with unless you are extremely careful with your unit economics and overhead.

You want to develop headphones because it interests you - I understand this 100%. Unfortunately product development is a relatively small part of the job. The bulk of the work comes from finding a way to sell a sufficient quantity of those headphones to stay afloat. Don't get into this unless you're also prepared to do a lot of sales, negotiation, paperwork, compliance, project management, etc. Running a business is mostly "business".

Even with people on our team with individual decades of experience in consumer electronics, it was a struggle. I won't tell you it can't be done - we were actually doing reasonably well on the product / marketing / manufacturing side, but a series of questionable trademark lawsuits did us in anyway. It also took us years (backed by investors who were contacts of our CEO) before we got to a point where the company was financially viable (if you ignored the legal bills.)

Anyway, if you are determined to go ahead, I would be happy to introduce you to our old sourcing manager, she was an absolute miracle worker.

Alternatively, If you intend to go more of a boutique route and sell at very high prices, I won't try to talk you out of that, but my indirect impression is the high end of the market is ruled by relationships with dealers and subjectivist reviewers, which probably presents its own challenges.
 
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It seems like very few headphones that are "Harmon compliant" so there may be some opportunity there. And if you send a pair to Amir and get a good review here that could kick-off your marketing.
 
Condolences on the layoff. Been there. If you have savings it can be a good opportunity to start something.

My previous job was head of product (and marketing) at a consumer audio startup that sold portable speakers, headphones and IEMs. I'm just going to throw a cliche at you because based on my direct experience working in consumer audio, it's true: "Starting an audio business is a good way to make a small fortune - by starting with a large one".

Before you start, YOU MUST do the most rigorous financial modeling you can figure out how to do. You are proposing to enter into direct competition with e.g. Moondrop or Truthear who have multiple advantages simply by virtue of being part of the Chinese manufacturing ecosystem. They will not leave you enough margin to wipe your nose with unless you are extremely careful with your unit economics and overhead.

You want to develop headphones because it interests you - I understand this 100%. Unfortunately product development is a relatively small part of the job. The bulk of the work comes from finding a way to sell a sufficient quantity of those headphones to stay afloat. Don't get into this unless you're also prepared to do a lot of sales, negotiation, paperwork, compliance, project management, etc. Running a business is mostly "business".

Even with people on our team with individual decades of experience in consumer electronics, it was a struggle. I won't tell you it can't be done - we were actually doing reasonably well on the product / marketing / manufacturing side, but a series of questionable trademark lawsuits did us in anyway. It also took us years (backed by investors who were contacts of our CEO) before we got to a point where the company was financially viable (if you ignored the legal bills.)

Anyway, if you are determined to go ahead, I would be happy to introduce you to our old sourcing manager, she was an absolute miracle worker.

Alternatively, If you intend to go more of a boutique route and sell at very high prices, I won't try to talk you out of that, but my indirect impression is the high end of the market is ruled by relationships with dealers and subjectivist reviewers, which probably presents its own challenges.
Hey Kemmler3D, thanks a lot for condolences! And your valuable and honest insight. I already thought that this is the case, but just doing a few back of the envelope numbers based on existing products. While there is around 10% CAGR in many markets, competition is fierce in the 20 - 500 USD market segment and openly competing with the big sharks will be nearly impossible. the beat's phenomenon wont be repeatable. You need to find a niche and design products towards this.

I am wondering about those trademark issues. Could you PM me on those?
Would be great if you put me contact with your sourcing manager to have a chat.Thanks!
 
While there is around 10% CAGR in many markets, competition is fierce in the 20 - 500 USD market segment and openly competing with the big sharks will be nearly impossible. the beat's phenomenon wont be repeatable. You need to find a niche and design products towards this.
I agree with this, and I would also caution you against taking market-level CAGR numbers as being applicable to your business in particular. Apple, Sony and Bose have been introducing higher and higher-priced versions of existing models for years now, and AFAIK they probably still have very disproportionate market share among those 3. So, you could see growth comparable to that just from line refreshes among the biggest names.

IIRC ~80% of relevant Amazon search traffic was going to those brands plus Beats a few years ago.

What that meant for names other than those 4 was there was actually never any real opportunity to steal that market share. People would show up to Amazon, type in "Bose headphones", buy a pair of Bose headphones, and exit the market for the next 2-5 years. To change that decision-making process, we would have needed to advertise on a level comparable with Bose before they showed up at Amazon or Google to start shopping. Needless to say, their monthly ad budgets would put our annual revenue to shame, so our true actual addressable market was maybe 20% of what you'd think by reading market sizing data from industry groups, or really less, since we only sold online and many headphone sales (in the mainstream) are still in-person at Best Buy, etc.

Despite the massive household penetration of headphones in general, and the massive annual revenue in the segment, I once calculated that on any given day, there were much fewer than 100 people we could actually sell a pair of >$200 over-ear wireless headphones to online in the US. This was years ago, but it's a long way of sharing my opinion that a straight reading of high-level market data tends to lead to massive over-estimates of your own sales.

If you enjoy rude awakenings, there are many in store for you in the exciting world of consumer audio. :D

Finding a niche is a necessity, just be sure it's a good one! :) Competition is more than fierce in this market, I would say. You see the MSRP and compare that to known COGS and logistics costs, and see a difficult fight, perhaps. But IMO surmounting the simple cost advantage is the easy part...

6-7 years ago, if you ran the numbers on what certain Chinese brands must have been spending on ads and shipping (things we paid the same amount for on Amazon) it seemed like it was numerically impossible that they made any margin at all. I am not sure why they did it, but I'm not exaggerating, even if the headphones cost $2 to produce and ship to the US, the margins would have been razor-thin or negative.

Anyway, like I've said, it can be done, but you should do everything you can to avoid going into direct competition with people who own headphone factories and sell directly to consumers. Find some way to sidestep that. Even if it's simply better, differentiated branding, make sure nobody will look at your product and see a more expensive version of your competitors'.

In general if you know (factually, not just personal intuition) why a given group of people will prefer your product over the next best alternative, AND you know how they will find out about your product, AND you know you can reach (more than) enough of those people to stay afloat, you may have a business on your hands. This isn't just in audio, but in general.

Also, this might go without saying, but get honest feedback from people in your target market (true strangers, not friends or even acquaintances) before spending real money on anything. If people aren't excited about your stuff, better to find out while they are still concepts and renderings and you have a chance to change course.

PM headed your way.
 
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