Speakers are causing headache in small room - 11*11 feet

[kirankasa]

Of course, I lose a lot of sounds (and director's intent), but I'm actually preferring this mono setup now

In that case a sound bar would be better i think. I was using soundar before moving to this setup, i will try different placement, acoustic panels or worst case will just go with 2.0.

 

[Lux_ury]

"Glass on both sides"...........
Throw a duvet cover over both the glass areas and come back.

 

[Deleted member 49933]

In that case a sound bar would be better i think. I was using soundar before moving to this setup, i will try different placement, acoustic panels or worst case will just go with 2.0.

I used to get ear fatigue even when downmixing, so in my case that was not the solution.

 

[antcollinet]

My experience is that 3 front speakers are simply too many in a small room and cause abnormal summing of correlated sounds and phase, even at 20dB below reference (~65dB).

Meanwhile I'm cracking on with 9 speakers plus sub, in a similar sized room, and it sounds great. I certainly could not bear to watch a movie with centre only.

I'd rather gouge out my own ears with a rusty spoon.

 

[rcstevensonaz]

I have the same room as you, but also with descending ceiling, so total volume is even less.
My experience is that 3 front speakers are simply too many in a small room and cause abnormal summing of correlated sounds and phase, even at 20dB below reference (~65dB).
So, I experimented by playing only the center channel, with everything else disconnected, and ear fatigue never set in even at reference level (~85dB).
Of course, I lose a lot of sounds (and director's intent), but I'm actually preferring this mono setup now, because there's a lot less music during action scenes or sound positioning, which always took me out of the movie.
Actually, I find The Matrix lobby scene more realistic in mono, since there's no music at all in the centre channel, and I can actually hear things that I could not in surround.

Why not the more typical phantom center configuration, using Left and Right fronts only?

 

[Deleted member 49933]

In that case a sound bar would be better i think. I was using soundar before moving to this setup, i will try different placement, acoustic panels or worst case will just go with 2.0.

Where do you live?
If you can find them available for your country, you could try the Magnat THX Ultra system, as a an alternative.

 

[OldHvyMec]

the sealed room being bad is just nonsense.

Please don't show your ignorance. Anyone that has EVER worked for a living around excessive noise knows boundaries and IB rooms are
the first thing to address if at all possible. You open the structure to let the SOUND PRESSURE escape. When working in a confined space
the safety official has to sign off on the situation being SAFE for work. Air quality, sound pressure, exit strategy, fire safety and a dozen other
factors. If you think a small sealed room isn't bad for your hearing go see any ENT industrial-qualified doctor and ask for yourself. As a retired
master mechanic the one thing more precious than anything else is your hearing. To make a GOOD living your ears have to be exceptional.

I was given an excellent bill of health when I retire with the exception of my back. 45+ years and I was just used to troubleshoot some very difficult
machinery on a tunnel project. There is a reason for fatigue. Sound pressure and HEAT is the culprit 80% of the time. It also causes critical thinking to laps
due to the distraction. I can see from your reply, that you definitely need to turn the music down and open the room a bit.

Never thought about that, isn't all HT rooms typically be sealed rooms?

NONE of the people I run with seal the room unless it's late-night listening at low volume.

It has nothing to do with, house curves, or anything but PRESSURE. If you notice yourself falling asleep in your listening room there is a
reason for that. If you find yourself getting up every 15 minutes and squirming around there is a reason for that. Pay attention to your actions.
The first rule of all work is to get comfortable, the second issue is to STAY comfortable.

I've never found a difference weather it's work or play.

11X11 and IB would likely sound ok but within 30 minutes you're out of there.

Am I describing what is happening?

As I mentioned the ONE thing that can increase your tolerance to pressure is an OB designed sub. It's one of the few designs GR has that
work exceptionally well.

If your running full range speakers in that size room your going to have all the sub/bass you need. The only problem is if you're trying for
a flat FR. I've NEVER had to use DSP because I tune the room first. I use Helmholtz adjustable resonators for 150hz and below and passive
materials to mitigate the rest. You can treat the room all you want but as I said pressure is pressure.

BTW I have a MX122 it has DSP. LOL I'll stick with room treatment and a PEQ

Hope you find a solution you like.

Regards

 

[Ktacos]

Please don't show your ignorance. Anyone that has EVER worked for a living around excessive noise knows boundaries and IB rooms are
the first thing to address if at all possible. You open the structure to let the SOUND PRESSURE escape. When working in a confined space
the safety official has to sign off on the situation being SAFE for work. Air quality, sound pressure, exit strategy, fire safety and a dozen other
factors. If you think a small sealed room isn't bad for your hearing go see any ENT industrial-qualified doctor and ask for yourself. As a retired
master mechanic the one thing more precious than anything else is your hearing. To make a GOOD living your ears have to be exceptional.

A room with speakers isn't an industrial machine shop lol.

I've worked in sealed rooms on audio for a long time, I visit and ENT every year and according to their tests, my hearing is exceptional. How come my hearing isn't ruined? Please explain.

Hey op, how's your sleep been?

 

[Ktacos]

It has nothing to do with, house curves, or anything but PRESSURE. If you notice yourself falling asleep in your listening room there is a
reason for that. If you find yourself getting up every 15 minutes and squirming around there is a reason for that.

I've run into this, it's either my sleep is bad and my brain is just exhausted, and/or I have a bad chair or back and neck issues.

 

[OldHvyMec]

I've worked in sealed rooms on audio for a long time,

So where you work, your age, the amount of exposure, the duration of exposure, and genetics have anything to do with it?
So you think noise exposure where the OP actually said " If I open the room it's better." had nothing to do with it?

I don't think I was too far off? What do you think?

Do you think he hurt his neck or back or has a bad chair? Some people never sit down for the whole day AT WORK! I laid on my back
for hours at a time doing crank bearings or installing transmissions in semi's or doing clutch jobs. Other times I spent weeks on end welding
inside of tanks, silos, or around piping having to mirror weld.

In drilling we weren't lifting resisters and soldering guns we were lifting 25,000lbs of steel (in a day) by hand. 300 pieces of drill steal at 100-175lbs
a pop. I seldom didn't have something smashed or broken BUT my hearing was fine because of protection.

Have you ever worked around real noise? Some people cannot get used to changes in cabin pressure. Some early in life, some late in life like
my SIL who started as a flight attendant with Pan Am and never stopped for over 50 years. When she finally developed a sensitivity to altitude
pressure changes, she would develop horrific headaches that actually grounded her into training for the last few years of her career.

In bass competitions that I've helped people build a com car or van, not everyone is dumb enough to walk around without protection. The drags
water or asphalt in the pits, it's LOUD with open pipes. Parts of that crowd leave behind discomfort just like excessive SPLs at concerts.

I think the evidence is pretty clear for the OP

This is a hobby for fun, I just bring a little different perspective to what sound and noise can do to different people and ruin a good night of listening.

Regards

 

[Ktacos]

Cool story

 

[Pareto Pragmatic]

I have issues with treble and headaches, so consider that.

DAC filters that are very extended will immediately cause me to feel pressure in my head. So I have to be very careful with 15k+ levels. In the 4k-10k region, if too high, that leads to listening fatigue for me, but the very high stuff that I definitely can't hear... but I can definitely feel.

It looks like the Center is the worst offender in this area. So as a check, were it me, I would roll off the treble at 3-4k or so and see what that does. How much? Start with a lot, like 5db, see if that helps. Then bring it back up as much as you can, if it turns out this was a high frequency issue.

Since the center is more boosted than the LR, you might have an issue with reflections from the wall behind you playing a role in what is going on.

Good luck!

 

[Eckerslad]

I find a dip around 3kHz of 3 or 4 dBs removes fatigue in my system, which has a directivity error here - worth an experiment with DSP perhaps. Or try absorbing your first reflections - stacked couch cushions or similar will give you an idea whether it works without committing any money.

 

[raindance]

I find a dip around 3kHz of 3 or 4 dBs removes fatigue in my system, which has a directivity error here - worth an experiment with DSP perhaps. Or try absorbing your first reflections - stacked couch cushions or similar will give you an idea whether it works without committing any money.

Audyssey should do this with it's default settings...

 

[Deleted member 49933]

In that case a sound bar would be better i think. I was using soundar before moving to this setup, i will try different placement, acoustic panels or worst case will just go with 2.0.

One other thing: your speakers are ported, right?
Bass Reflex is another thing that gave me ear fatigue, so I went with a sealed design.

BTW, Bass Reflex is not even Hi-Fi, IMO.

 

[ozzy9832001]

To me, it looks like your low mids are a bit too bright and your bass peak around 50hz could definitely cause some headache issues especially if your listening to something with a lot of kick drum action.

 

[raindance]

One other thing: your speakers are ported, right?
Bass Reflex is another thing that gave me ear fatigue, so I went with a sealed design.

BTW, Bass Reflex is not even Hi-Fi, IMO.

Nonsense.

 

[PuX]

I thought excessive high frequencies can cause one to get tired but I may be wrong

 

[Deleted member 49933]

Nonsense.

Absolutely!
We are not supposed to hear sound from the back of the drivers and the cabinet resonance, which are also out of phase re. to the front of the speaker.
Bass Reflex is a cheap way to get bass extension that belongs exclusively to car audio subwoofers, not Hi-Fi.