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Sound United U 30 Update (Denon X3800H / X4800H / A1H, Marantz Cinema 50 / 40 / AV 10)

DutchJay

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I'm trying to think of a use case whereby someone could take advantage of the "limited refund" and I'm hard pressed to think of more than...maybe, one. You buy the license while your AVP/AVR is still sitting in the box and then decide - for whatever reasons - you're returning the AVP/AVR and as such, no longer need the Dirac Live license. As long as you are within 30 days of that decision, then and only then can you request/receive a full refund.

So yea....limited is an understatement. Useless return period would be more accurate.

Thankfully, I'm loving Dirac and don't have to thread that needle above trying to get a refund.
Did it make a big difference for you?
 

multisport4me

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Did it make a big difference for you?

I do think it is a big difference, yes. I love Dirac. I used it with the HTP-1 and DLBC multi so I developed a preference for it after years of using Audyssey, their $800 "Pro" version and it got very long in the tooth and I believe Dirac just plain leapfrogged them. It's cool that Audyssey is trying to catch up and I have that available to me for Speaker Preset 1. But I'm all in on Dirac. Just a vastly better tool to get really consistently good results. Audyssey requires a lot of work in my room.
 

DutchJay

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I also read somewhere that you had 30 days trial and I even voiced it out but looks like that is not the case according to Dirac EULA:

3. Refunds. To be eligible for a limited refund, you (i) must have acquired a license to the Software from Dirac or from an authorized distributor; and (ii) must not have used the Software; (iii) must provide proof of payment for the Software; within thirty (30) calendar days of your receipt of the Software. ACQUISITIONS OF LICENSES TO SOFTWARE ARE NON-REFUNDABLE FOLLOWING THE EXPIRATION OF THE 30-DAY PERIOD AND IN THE EVENT THAT THE SOFTWARE HAS BEEN USED. SHIPPING CHARGES AND CREDIT CARD FEES ARE NON-REFUNDABLE.
Just got a reply from dirac customer service. Told them that in the Netherlands we are entitles by law to get a refund If you order something online and are not happy with it. They confirmed me that they offer a 30 days trial and will refund you if you are unhappy regardless of the reason. Super nice and smart. They will convince all that are on the fence to try it!
 

enricoclaudio

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Well, I guess that works for The Netherlands and maybe other EU countries but pretty sure they won't honor that here in the USA and in many other countries.
 

slacki

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i also asked them a few questions a couple of month ago and never got an answer. thats also one thing that really holds me back from purchasing anything from them.
 

HarmonicTHD

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Here it is:

Speakers is Revel M106.

View attachment 272401
Thanks for doing this. Always appreciate facts.

However, I fail to see where Dirac objectively delivers the better result (not arguing about preferences). Seems like it unnaturally boost highs completely eliminating the natural roll off between 0.5 and 1dB / Oct one would expect from an anechoically flat speaker in a reflective room. Secondly the bass boost is also above the upper end of the Harman curve (plus 8 to 10dB) vs Dirac more towards 15dB give or take.

Again not arguing or challenging your personal preferences, more a comment towards the quite subjective debate Dirac vs Audyssey and therefore I really appreciate you providing some facts for a change.
 

JAJDACT

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Thanks for doing this. Always appreciate facts.

However, I fail to see where Dirac objectively delivers the better result (not arguing about preferences). Seems like it unnaturally boost highs completely eliminating the natural roll off between 0.5 and 1dB / Oct one would expect from an anechoically flat speaker in a reflective room. Secondly the bass boost is also above the upper end of the Harman curve (plus 8 to 10dB).

Again not arguing or challenging your personal preferences.
It would be nice to see the speaker's response before room correction and maybe a little less smoothing on his REW graph to really see what's happening.
 

Dj7675

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@enricoclaudio thanks for showing the post correction. The difference in frequency response was my experience as well. Full range correction was always better with Dirac than Audyssey. I believe part of the reason is Dirac post measurement response are always very close to the target curve. That is not my experience with Audyssey. I never new if it was mic related or what the reason was but that was my experience as well. I still prefer correction up to around 500hz with DLBC and a few PEQ filters above 500hz when needed. It still sounds a little better than full range correction to me.
 

JAJDACT

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@enricoclaudio thanks for showing the post correction. The difference in frequency response was my experience as well. Full range correction was always better with Dirac than Audyssey. I believe part of the reason is Dirac post measurement response are always very close to the target curve. That is not my experience with Audyssey. I never new if it was mic related or what the reason was but that was my experience as well. I still prefer correction up to around 500hz with DLBC and a few PEQ filters above 500hz when needed. It still sounds a little better than full range correction to me.
That's been my experience as well. I only use Audyssey under 500hz unless I am manually doing it through Multi EQ-X. The default curves Audyssey tries to implement aren't great,and it does a poor job overall on full range for me. I have had good success with Multi EQ-X although it's time consuming to get it right sometimes.
 

DutchJay

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Hi all, I have a crossover question. I ran dirac live this morning and it did nothing to my crossovers. Normally it should set them based on the measurements right? Lime audyssey does?
 

abdo123

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Hi all, I have a crossover question. I ran dirac live this morning and it did nothing to my crossovers. Normally it should set them based on the measurements right? Lime audyssey does?
That’s Dirac Live Bass management.

I’m afraid you have to either set your crossovers manually or have Auddesy handle the crossovers.
 

peng

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And than use REW to see what crossover is best?
Yes, but run Audyssey first as it (Denon) will set the crossover. Then run REW to find what gives the smoothest response, as Denon typically set the crossover below 80 Hz, yet REW will show you 80 and 90 Hz (for full range speakers) are often the best whereas 60 Hz or below likely result in worse suck outs in the 20 to 90 Hz range.
 

DutchJay

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Just wanted to update with my opinion after testing with Dirac today. For me in my room it is a significant improvement. I could get similar full sound and bass out of dirac (used audyssey plus app before, with dirac I bumped the bass for Front left and right plus subwoofer) but the main difference for me are the details. The sound is more focused. So if you for instance listen to piano music, each key stroke is more on point, detailed and fuller. Same for guitar, just better on point and focused notes. Next to this things like the rain drops in the Amaze dolby demo, you van really hear individual drops with dirac.

It's not night and day as I obviously hear the notes and rain with Audyssey, but just not as detailed and focused. So for me a significant improvement, really happy with it!
 

HarmonicTHD

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Just wanted to update with my opinion after testing with Dirac today. For me in my room it is a significant improvement. I could get similar full sound and bass out of dirac (used audyssey plus app before, with dirac I bumped the bass for Front left and right plus subwoofer) but the main difference for me are the details. The sound is more focused. So if you for instance listen to piano music, each key stroke is more on point, detailed and fuller. Same for guitar, just better on point and focused notes. Next to this things like the rain drops in the Amaze dolby demo, you van really hear individual drops with dirac.

It's not night and day as I obviously hear the notes and rain with Audyssey, but just not as detailed and focused. So for me a significant improvement, really happy with it!
Could we have some facts too please? The above results were awful. Wondered if yours are better.
 
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This for me is where "subjective" wins over "objective". If too me it sounds better, I'm going with it. Even if the facts don't agree. I've been in several home theaters where the bass is just overwhelming and covers over everything else. But that's how they like it.
 
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