Some Dishonest Chinese Manufacturers Are Counterfeiting High-End Headphones. A Story About Fake Headphones.

[Mnyb]

Copy or counterfeit is not the same thing.

Copying expired previously patented or previously protected stuff is normal . Example Ortofon once held a patent fro the moving cool pickup ( in some form ) .

Counterfeit is stealing someone elses ”thunder ” , making your product appear as something its not and give it an immaterial brand apeal stolen from someone else .

If something is named Seinheiser i have expectations and may put an immaterial possibly a Veblen gods value on the product and are prepared to pay more . That’s what rhe counterfeiters are stealing

 

[Roland68]

And counterfeiting has nothing to do with politics?
Tell that to the OP. Tell him counterfeiting doesn't belong in science forum, bad for image.

Counterfeiting products has always been a criminal activity, also known as product piracy. It's never had anything to do with politics, but exclusively with criminals.
In fact, counterfeiting has been studied scientifically for centuries.
All I see from you on this topic are meaningless statements that have nothing to do with this topic, but always bring political terms into play. Either this is purely trollish behavior, or you have absolutely no knowledge of this topic, including its global implications.

In case you're not aware, counterfeit products are produced solely for one reason: to make money through criminal means and deception.

 

[dlaloum]

Counterfeiting products has always been a criminal activity, also known as product piracy. It's never had anything to do with politics, but exclusively with criminals.
In fact, counterfeiting has been studied scientifically for centuries.
All I see from you on this topic are meaningless statements that have nothing to do with this topic, but always bring political terms into play. Either this is purely trollish behavior, or you have absolutely no knowledge of this topic, including its global implications.

In case you're not aware, counterfeit products are produced solely for one reason: to make money through criminal means and deception.

So let's be careful about our terms.

We are talking about counterfeiting - passing something off as something else - in other words, fraud.

As opposed to copying - which may be almost identical, but gets a conditional pass, as long as it does not pretend to be something it is not.

So a copy of Beyer DT880 headphones from the 1980's, but branded otherwise, would be perfectly OK.
The same copy, branded Beyer, would not - it would in fact be fraud.

The fundamental wrongdoing is the fraud, not the copying per se.

 

[Adis]

Counterfeiting products has always been a criminal activity, also known as product piracy. It's never had anything to do with politics, but exclusively with criminals.
In fact, counterfeiting has been studied scientifically for centuries.
All I see from you on this topic are meaningless statements that have nothing to do with this topic, but always bring political terms into play. Either this is purely trollish behavior, or you have absolutely no knowledge of this topic, including its global implications.

In case you're not aware, counterfeit products are produced solely for one reason: to make money through criminal means and deception.

You don't seem to get the point: if you don't want your laws broken, make them unbreakable. Fake laws are easily broken. Because fake.
And stop whining like a little girl...

Copy or counterfeit is not the same thing.

Copying expired previously patented or previously protected stuff is normal . Example Ortofon once held a patent fro the moving cool pickup ( in some form ) .

Counterfeit is stealing someone elses ”thunder ” , making your product appear as something its not and give it an immaterial brand apeal stolen from someone else .

If something is named Seinheiser i have expectations and may put an immaterial possibly a Veblen gods value on the product and are prepared to pay more . That’s what rhe counterfeiters are stealing

Dude, I'd counterfeit an atomic bomb if I could. God too. If one god is good, two are twice as good. Double the pleasure.
What's wrong with that?

 

[Mnyb]

Counterfeiting products has always been a criminal activity, also known as product piracy. It's never had anything to do with politics, but exclusively with criminals.
In fact, counterfeiting has been studied scientifically for centuries.
All I see from you on this topic are meaningless statements that have nothing to do with this topic, but always bring political terms into play. Either this is purely trollish behavior, or you have absolutely no knowledge of this topic, including its global implications.

In case you're not aware, counterfeit products are produced solely for one reason: to make money through criminal means and deception.

yes its not only the product , they are sure not following any other laws if engaged in this activity like environmental laws or worker safety or tax laws or .. etc .
You shall simply not engage in business of any kind with criminals or buy any kind of product or service from them ,the world would be a better place if people understood such simple things .

Your not finding a "smart deal" your just making the world a worse place . Almost all money criminals have comes from people just giving it to them , it usually illegal products ( drugs ) but it can be anything . How many conversations have not started with "i know a guy" . Just no

 

[Roland68]

yes its not only the product , they are sure not following any other laws if engaged in this activity like environmental laws or worker safety or tax laws or .. etc .
You shall simply not engage in business of any kind with criminals or buy any kind of product or service from them ,the world would be a better place if people understood such simple things .

Your not finding a "smart deal" your just making the world a worse place . Almost all money criminals have comes from people just giving it to them , it usually illegal products ( drugs ) but it can be anything . How many conversations have not started with "i know a guy" . Just no

This is another point that many people, probably including @Adis, don't see, or don't want to see, because by purchasing such products, they are also supporting these things.
Unfortunately, children and women are also used in the production of counterfeit products under poor and health-threatening conditions. In addition, several hundred thousand to millions of young women and children are trafficked worldwide every year, ending up not only in forced prostitution but also in such illegal productions.

 

[EJ3]

We don't care about their costs, we care about ours.

Who is we?
Have you ever run a business?
Apparently you don't buy for quality.
Which is sort of the point of this site: figuring out which items meet or exceed audio specs.
Of course that doesn't take into account other quality's such as durability, longevity & many others.
All of it costs something.
And the cost of counterfeiters is to further consumerism & waste with cheap junk for the landfill.
While also giving the real manufacturers a bad reputation as some think that the junk product actually came from the real manufacturer.
I'm not talking just Audio but parts to things that are needed for you to stay alive, equipment that breaks because of non-spec materials being used, etc.
Your viewpoint is BIZARRE, at the least.
Don't cry like a baby when you get the junk that you pay junk prices for.
You may not get the quality that you pay for when you pay more, but you will not get the quality that you did not pay for by buying cheap junk.

 

[Petrushka]

In the fashion industry (handbags, for certain), the knockoffs are identical to the badged products.

The name tags are added by the seller, but that’s the only difference.

 

[Adis]

Who is we?
Have you ever run a business?
Apparently you don't buy for quality.
Which is sort of the point of this site: figuring out which items meet or exceed audio specs.
Of course that doesn't take into account other quality's such as durability, longevity & many others.
All of it costs something.
And the cost of counterfeiters is to further consumerism & waste with cheap junk for the landfill.
While also giving the real manufacturers a bad reputation as some think that the junk product actually came from the real manufacturer.
I'm not talking just Audio but parts to things that are needed for you to stay alive, equipment that breaks because of non-spec materials being used, etc.
Your viewpoint is BIZARRE, at the least.
Don't cry like a baby when you get the junk that you pay junk prices for.
You may not get the quality that you pay for when you pay more, but you will not get the quality that you did not pay for by buying cheap junk.

Look, there are people, stupid enough, who think they're buying quality along with the name. I have nothing against them paying for their stupidity (there's also a logical fallacy called ad verecundiam, but I don't want to get into that here).
And we is me, only in the plural. You know the plural? Well, that plural.

 

[Mnyb]

In the fashion industry (handbags, for certain), the knockoffs are identical to the badged products.

The name tags are added by the seller, but that’s the only difference.

The distribution channel could be very different the Camorra has a strong presence in the "outlet shop bussines" in every part smuggling in the products and distribution .
And in many cases the actual manufacturing if not smuggled in , so many fakes are manufactured for the fake market not just siphoned off the normal production line ( defects and rejects sold on the side )

If one fits in "haute couture " as an overweigth middle aged person ( like me ) , you can bet 100% that's its a fake as some fashion brands are elitists and don't want ugly people to wear their stuff ?

 

[Roland68]

You don't seem to get the point: if you don't want your laws broken, make them unbreakable. Fake laws are easily broken. Because fake.
And stop whining like a little girl...


Dude, I'd counterfeit an atomic bomb if I could. God too. If one god is good, two are twice as good. Double the pleasure.
What's wrong with that?

Look, there are people, stupid enough, who think they're buying quality along with the name. I have nothing against them paying for their stupidity (there's also a logical fallacy called ad verecundiam, but I don't want to get into that here).
And we is me, only in the plural. You know the plural? Well, that plural.

It's really clear that you have absolutely no knowledge or experience with such topics.
It makes no sense to discuss such things with someone at that level and with such statements.

 

[Adis]

It's really clear that you have absolutely no knowledge or experience with such topics.
It makes no sense to discuss such things with someone at that level and with such statements.

Is counterfeiting one of them?
You have no clue, you wouldn't know a counterfeiter even if you were corresponding with him on a scientific forum...

 

[Kremmen]

Are you partners with them? There's no "your costs", "my costs", only "our costs"?
Sounds socialist to me.

It certainly does.

 

[Kremmen]

Buyers don't care about how something works, designers do. Businessmen do, engineers do. Buyers don't. Buyers only buy stuff they can't get for free.

I often care about how something works. Knowledge of such matters allows me to gain pleasure from such understanding. It enriches my life. I am also able to sometimes optimise a product that I understand, or repair it. Each to their own of course.

 

[Robin L]

Meanwhile, you can get these really fine 7Hz x Crinacle Zero:2 IEM Chinese IEMs for $25, shipped from China, tax included:

I broke a pair by foolishly inserting them into some very wet ears right after a shower. My replacements arrived yesterday sounding identical to the original pair before they were damaged.

As far as I'm concerned, Grado is dishonest for selling shrieking head-clamps and selling them as "High Fidelity" (I'm speaking of the SR 60 and 80, don't have experience of the more expensive models).

The point I'm attempting to make is that headphones, in general, are all over the place anyway. Plenty of headphones I have heard that are highly regarded in audiophile and pro audio circles simply do not deliver the goods. And some of the best are remarkably cheap.

 

[Adis]

It certainly does.

Pssst, don't blow my cover, comrade.

 

[Sebby]

In the fashion industry (handbags, for certain), the knockoffs are identical to the badged products.

The name tags are added by the seller, but that’s the only difference.

Not even close. Only an idiot wouldn't notice the difference.
Talk about what you know...

 

[Ifrit]

to make money through criminal means and deception.

Practically a definition for politics.

 

[TubeFan#1]

I have a pair of legit Abyss 1266, paired with a DIY amplifier and resistor network (as you know, they’re almost impossible to drive to their full potential). Recently, I had the chance to compare the clones with the real ones. I’m ashamed to say this, but the clones are on the same level as the originals, their timbre is even a bit more accurate. The Abyss tends to get slightly lost when many strings are playing at once. Other than that, the bass, detail, transients; everything I love about the Abyss was there. A friend has wanted to buy my Abyss for a while, and I always said no, but I accepted his offer a few days ago, and the clone is already on its way. It feels crazy to hold on to a $7k pair when I can replace it with one that costs 800 bucks.
I sold my calderas for the exact same reason, chinese clones are taking over the industry. Spending more than one grand in a pair of headphones is starting to sound like crazy talk.

 

[TubeFan#1]

Look, there are people, stupid enough, who think they're buying quality along with the name. I have nothing against them paying for their stupidity (there's also a logical fallacy called ad verecundiam, but I don't want to get into that here).
And we is me, only in the plural. You know the plural? Well, that plural.

I would’ve disagreed with you some time ago. But after hearing the clones and even worse, finding out that the drivers used by ZMF and Abyss are made in China. I feel ridiculous, even scammed, for having paid the full price.