So I ended up purchasing a Cambridge Audio Azur 550A integrated amp off of the classifieds.

[NewbieAudiophileExpert]

So i managed to find a pretty well maintained Cambridge Audio Azur 550a on the local classifieds - previous owner has maintained it fairly well and also included the remote which is in great condition.

First thing that i notice is that this thing has all of the bells and whistles that I need and it does not have what i don't need (phono stage, DAC, etc), not that I would mind it having this, it's just that most entry level amps are not going to be that good in that department anyway.

The 60 watts per channel is a lot different to the regular class-D amps that people suggest these days, I don't even need to turn it up past 25% to have the room shaking, etc - it feels to me that the power output of these 'big amps' is still a bit better than the chi-fi stuff.

Both direct mode and the bass and treble mode are great features to have, also.

The way that I see it is that this amp will perform pretty much the same as any other, 'more recent' integrated amp that would cost 3-4 times as much brand new! So quite happy with the purchase.

 

[BDWoody]

So quite happy with the purchase.

Nice!

 

[steve59]

congrats, may I ask what speakers you're driving them with.

 

[Loathecliff]

previous owner has maintained it fairly well

What maintenance is required?!

 

[Beave]

So i managed to find a pretty well maintained Cambridge Audio Azur 550a on the local classifieds - previous owner has maintained it fairly well and also included the remote which is in great condition.

First thing that i notice is that this thing has all of the bells and whistles that I need and it does not have what i don't need (phono stage, DAC, etc), not that I would mind it having this, it's just that most entry level amps are not going to be that good in that department anyway.

The 60 watts per channel is a lot different to the regular class-D amps that people suggest these days, I don't even need to turn it up past 25% to have the room shaking, etc - it feels to me that the power output of these 'big amps' is still a bit better than the chi-fi stuff.

Both direct mode and the bass and treble mode are great features to have, also.

The way that I see it is that this amp will perform pretty much the same as any other, 'more recent' integrated amp that would cost 3-4 times as much brand new! So quite happy with the purchase.

You can't compare power of this (class a/b) amp with power of a class D amp based on the volume knob. Turning it up past "25%" - what does that mean?

 

[mugbot]

The 60 watts per channel is a lot different to the regular class-D amps that people suggest these days.

In what way? Plenty of Class-D amps out there that provide 60W.

 

[JSmith]

The 60 watts per channel is a lot different to the regular class-D amps that people suggest these days

... dem dirty Class D watts ay.


JSmith

 

[Doodski]

The 60 watts per channel is a lot different to the regular class-D amps that people suggest these days, I don't even need to turn it up past 25% to have the room shaking, etc - it feels to me that the power output of these 'big amps' is still a bit better than the chi-fi stuff.

We are not supposed to use the term, "Chi-Fi." Some peeps use it as a racist derogatory term.

 

[Loathecliff]

'Cambridge Audio' - Street cred. gold is that badge. Add 'Designed in' & the rest (of the marketing) was almost too easy.

 

[NewbieAudiophileExpert]

congrats, may I ask what speakers you're driving them with.

Wharfedale Crystal 4.3s - they are a 3 way speaker design. They are my 'first set' of 'real speakers' that have some sort of 'audiophileness' added to them.. I like them for sure, but the audiophile in me is looking to expand LOL

What maintenance is required?!

Looks almost new and remote is not lost 10-12 years after purchase.

You can't compare power of this (class a/b) amp with power of a class D amp based on the volume knob. Turning it up past "25%" - what does that mean?

It just feels that this has sooo much more oomph than a fosi audio bt20a-s for example

In what way? Plenty of Class-D amps out there that provide 60W.

I know since i own a Fosi BT20A-S.

We are not supposed to use the term, "Chi-Fi." Some peeps use it as a racist derogatory term.

How is that derogatory and racist to the nation of China? The quality of 'made in China' goods has been in question for a long time, although its MUCH better now days.

'Cambridge Audio' - Street cred. gold is that badge. Add 'Designed in' & the rest (of the marketing) was almost too easy.

I thought that this brand was quite reputable though? Would it not compare well to say a Yamaha A-S301? Even the remote on this thing feels premium with the aluminium top.

 

[DSJR]

Apologies for diving in here...

Once again, the 'law' on the volume control favours all or nothing in the first half of the rotation with little change above (I'd expect) and this seems standard now even with digital sources being mostly used. It's basically a 'tap' to match the levels coming in to the volume needs of the amp and the listener.

Sorry for granny sucking eggs, but the volume control is ABSOLUTELY NO indication of power. Input's at a lower level as old tuners and tape decks have, and the control will be turned up much higher for the same perceived 'volume.' There's a definite psychoacoustics thing going on here which makes many of us think there's more power because the control is only a little way up to get blasting sound levels.

Anyway, Cambridge amps have traditionally been pretty good over the years, at least since the mid 80's I think (the old very slim 1970's models looked great but weren't always good under the striking styling and old electrolytic caps from that era as used in UK made gear - even Quad - will be knackered by now) and a very decent safe choice if you're not sure what to get Enjoy...

 

[Beave]

Wharfedale Crystal 4.3s - they are a 3 way speaker design. They are my 'first set' of 'real speakers' that have some sort of 'audiophileness' added to them.. I like them for sure, but the audiophile in me is looking to expand LOL

Looks almost new and remote is not lost 10-12 years after purchase.

It just feels that this has sooo much more oomph than a fosi audio bt20a-s for example

I know since i own a Fosi BT20A-S.

How is that derogatory and racist to the nation of China? The quality of 'made in China' goods has been in question for a long time, although its MUCH better now days.

I thought that this brand was quite reputable though? Would it not compare well to say a Yamaha A-S301? Even the remote on this thing feels premium with the aluminium top.

The Cambridge Audio amp is also made in China.

It might "feel" like it has more oomph simply because it gets loud before the volume knob even gets to 11 o'clock. That has little/nothing to do with actual power capabilities. It's like making a car with a 100hp 4-cylinder feel "fast" by having the gas pedal designed so that the engine is full throttle with just a tiny bit of pressure on the pedal.

It would compare about the same as the Yamaha A-S301, meaning they're both fine, nothing special, but one does have a heavier remote control than the other - if you're impressed by those kinds of things.

 

[BDWoody]

How is that derogatory and racist to the nation of China? The quality of 'made in China' goods has been in question for a long time, although its MUCH better now days.

Our host implemented this some time ago. If you have issues with it, you can follow up with one of us via PM.

Let's Avoid the Term Chi-Fi

I often see the use of the term "Chi Fi" to describe audio products from China. I see the intention and don't think anyone is trying to be racist and what have you. Still, I like us to show the highest respect to products from around the world. As avid readers of this forum know...

audiosciencereview.com

 

[NewbieAudiophileExpert]

Apologies for diving in here...

Once again, the 'law' on the volume control favours all or nothing in the first half of the rotation with little change above (I'd expect) and this seems standard now even with digital sources being mostly used. It's basically a 'tap' to match the levels coming in to the volume needs of the amp and the listener.

Sorry for granny sucking eggs, but the volume control is ABSOLUTELY NO indication of power. Input's at a lower level as old tuners and tape decks have, and the control will be turned up much higher for the same perceived 'volume.' There's a definite psychoacoustics thing going on here which makes many of us think there's more power because the control is only a little way up to get blasting sound levels.

Anyway, Cambridge amps have traditionally been pretty good over the years, at least since the mid 80's I think (the old very slim 1970's models looked great but weren't always good under the striking styling and old electrolytic caps from that era as used in UK made gear - even Quad - will be knackered by now) and a very decent safe choice if you're not sure what to get Enjoy...

Hmm good point, I'll take that into consideration going forward.

The Cambridge Audio amp is also made in China.

It might "feel" like it has more oomph simply because it gets loud before the volume knob even gets to 11 o'clock. That has little/nothing to do with actual power capabilities. It's like making a car with a 100hp 4-cylinder feel "fast" by having the gas pedal designed so that the engine is full throttle with just a tiny bit of pressure on the pedal.

It would compare about the same as the Yamaha A-S301, meaning they're both fine, nothing special, but one does have a heavier remote control than the other - if you're impressed by those kinds of things.\

So too are apple mobile phones, which in my experience are of the highest quality.

That's just the thing, I don't plan on turning it up very loud anyway - still though i feel as if the toroidal transformer and class A/B is a bit better than the SSMPS supplied with the Fosi BT20A-S for example.

Also, it does feel better to hold a sturdier remote IMO - compared to an all plastic one...

That's great then, since i was considering buying that Yamaha, but i paid a fraction of the price.

Our host implemented this some time ago. If you have issues with it, you can follow up with one of us via PM.

Let's Avoid the Term Chi-Fi

I often see the use of the term "Chi Fi" to describe audio products from China. I see the intention and don't think anyone is trying to be racist and what have you. Still, I like us to show the highest respect to products from around the world. As avid readers of this forum know...

audiosciencereview.com

Yeah that's fine and i have no aversion to not using that term - pretty sure i saw it on here or any other forum that is based around home theatre and hifi. Still don't understand how this is derogatory, since it's merely describing the nation in which it's designed and made. I my self own a topping D10S and FiiO Btr5 which i love.

 

[bloodshoteyed]

... dem dirty Class D watts ay.

i have to throw a second glove, to the other cheek that is, the truce was way too long, it seems

 

[NewbieAudiophileExpert]

So I've just plugged my Sennheiser 560s and I was astounded to hear how well it can drive these headphones to a high volume with no distortion, instead the headphones started to 'crackle' before any distortion could occur.

So having done some research, there's a strong probability that the headphone jack is powered by a separate preamplifier, and not a simple resistor circuit from the main amp.

Plus, i hear that in general the preamp circuitry in this thing is actually really decent and can be used to drive other amps - puts my Yamaha V6A's headphone port to shame - so there's another + 1.

Funnily enough i looked at Cambridge audio's new lineup and the 'entry level' stuff does not even have a headphone port or a remote (lol).

i have to throw a second glove, to the other cheek that is, the truce was way too long, it seems

I was not questioning 'class D watts', i was questioning the claims behind how many watts some of those class D amps can produce vs how much they claim.

I have a feeling that when a Yamaha or Cambridge audio claims 60 watts per channel (or 'only 60 watts per channel' in many people's eyes), they mean it.

 

[Beave]

...

That's just the thing, I don't plan on turning it up very loud anyway - still though i feel as if the toroidal transformer and class A/B is a bit better than the SSMPS supplied with the Fosi BT20A-S for example.
...

Then the marketing has worked.

Do a controlled test and see whether you still *feel* that way.

 

[LightninBoy]

I was not questioning 'class D watts', i was questioning the claims behind how many watts some of those class D amps can produce vs how much they claim.

I have a feeling that when a Yamaha or Cambridge audio claims 60 watts per channel (or 'only 60 watts per channel' in many people's eyes), they mean it.

First, congrats on the purchase. It always feels good to do the research, pull the trigger on something, and have it meet or exceed expectations.

Regarding class D watts vs class AB watts, a few years ago there was an excellent thread featuring @restorer-john and amir discussing amp testing protocols and how to best rate the power of an amp. I did a quick search and couldn't find it, but maybe someone else can provide a link for you. Its an excellent read.

As a layman, the takeaway I got from the thread is that the standard way of measuring amp wattage is more of a torture test and is only partially relevant to audio as it emphasizes *continuous* output over several minutes. The self reported class D watts are often for short term bursts; the amp would go into thermal protection if the high output was continued. The thread dialog was essentially "the standard measuring protocol is the standard" vs "the standard measuring protocol doesn't accurately depict audio performance".

 

[Loathecliff]

I thought that this brand was quite reputable though?

It certainly isn't disreputable. That would have been a disaster.
Bear in mind that the company became a very different animal from the mid nineties.

 

[NewbieAudiophileExpert]

Then the marketing has worked.

Do a controlled test and see whether you still *feel* that way.

What do you mean by the marketing? I purchased this amp because the person selling it seemed OK and it was well maintained, in my opinion. It was purchased because i wanted a 'proper' integrated amplifier that is class A/B. The toroidal power transformer is a bonus, and is often times used in more precise equipment, such as high fidelity audio amplifiers.

First, congrats on the purchase. It always feels good to do the research, pull the trigger on something, and have it meet or exceed expectations.

Regarding class D watts vs class AB watts, a few years ago there was an excellent thread featuring @restorer-john and amir discussing amp testing protocols and how to best rate the power of an amp. I did a quick search and couldn't find it, but maybe someone else can provide a link for you. Its an excellent read.

As a layman, the takeaway I got from the thread is that the standard way of measuring amp wattage is more of a torture test and is only partially relevant to audio as it emphasizes *continuous* output over several minutes. The self reported class D watts are often for short term bursts; the amp would go into thermal protection if the high output was continued. The thread dialog was essentially "the standard measuring protocol is the standard" vs "the standard measuring protocol doesn't accurately depict audio performance".

Thanks man, indeed it's exciting to make such a purchase.

That does make sense - though the efficiency of class D is much higher than AB, and i do suspect that the claims of fosi's or ayimas 100 watts per channel are exaggerated, at least with the so-so SMPS that come provided with these amps.

I'd say that in the real world it makes no difference in terms of how loud you drive speakers, but the audio quality is the main point of differentiation between these two styles.

It certainly isn't disreputable. That would have been a disaster.
Bear in mind that the company became a very different animal from the mid nineties.

You're saying a lot without really saying anything - perhaps you could provide some context?