SMSL SU-9 Balanced DAC Review

[Hemi-Demon]

Hi new on here and looking for some advice. Just got a SMSL SU9 it's currently feeding a Pi4 into and the DAC feeds s Schiit Magni 3 Heresy obviously single ended.

I am finding the sound quality of the DAC extremely bass bloated, vocals are distant in the mix overall t's really not very neutral at all, it also seems to be distorting a little too in the low frequencies. I have not had any issues with previous DAC Ifi Nano iDSD BL feeding the same amp.

I am using the SU9 in fixed mode and I have tried lowering it by not using fixed but it still sounds off. Comparing it with the Ifi Nano iDSD BL it's replacing this device really sounds dreadful. Is there something I need to do or is this unit likely faulty? I tried changing the sound colour and to my ears I can hear no difference between any of the modes.I read the are subtle but surely I should detect some change? This makes me think this unit is not right it's not getting my toes tapping any more.

The ifi products are pretty warm (ie high distortion by design), some people just prefer inaccuracy. No attack, this is a fun hobby. The one you have is pretty low down on their product list, and yes I have owned and used both. I mean its probably a less engineered device than even the zen dac. Some LOVE that Zen dac device (check all the awards it has won), even though it measures poorly.

The Su9 is pretty exact, meaning you "should" be hearing exactly what the recording should be, and mainly the amplifier is the determining factor on what you personally do no enjoy. Also the SU9 rca outputs are higher voltage that the ifi you are using, so that also may be impacting what you are hearing. What amp are you using, what is musical preference, are you using the drivers, mac or windows and of course how are you going back in forth between dacs?

If you enjoy the ifi sound, I would recommend the micro IDSD black, or better yet the latest signature limited edition version they just released, its a far better overall device, and you get an capable portable amp.

It is pretty impossible for the nano to perform "better" than the SU9, I mean look at the data. Not everyone enjoys accurate audio playback, and that is fine. Do hope you stick around ASR, and this first post isn't another hit job, that keep popping up, every week.

 

[Veri]

The ifi products are pretty warm (ie high distortion by design), some people just prefer inaccuracy. No attack, this is a fun hobby. The one you have is pretty low down on their product list, and yes I have owned and used both. I mean its probably a less engineered device than even the zen dac. Some LOVE that Zen dac device (check all the awards it has won), even though it measures poorly.

The Su9 is pretty exact, meaning you "should" be hearing exactly what the recording should be, and mainly the amplifier is the determining factor on what you personally do no enjoy. Also the SU9 rca outputs are higher voltage that the ifi you are using, so that also may be impacting what you are hearing. What amp are you using, what is musical preference, are you using the drivers, mac or windows and of course how are you going back in forth between dacs?

If you enjoy the ifi sound, I would recommend the micro IDSD black, or better yet the latest signature limited edition version they just released, its a far better overall device, and you get an capable portable amp.

It is pretty impossible for the nano to perform "better" than the SU9, I mean look at the data. Not everyone enjoys accurate audio playback, and that is fine. Do hope you stick around ASR, and this first post isn't another hit job, that keep popping up, every week.

There is zero indication a "warm" DAC is one that is "high distortion by design". I would personally expect one that rolls off the high-end by at least some dB... also don't see you talking about any proper A-B method whatsoever, what comparison did you do here, exactly? Just sighted, highly opiniated comments?

 

[Googolbyte]

I BELIEVE I have solved the issue to which I referred earlier: the dysfunction of the SU-9 manifested by the unit not being able to communicate with its own remote, rendering it useless. It seems this is a heat-related issue. I had it mounted on top of a pre-amp that produced moderate heat. Combined with its own heat, the unit becomes less and less functional the longer the heat is allowed to accumulate. It does not effect the DAC itself in terms of it being able to play on the input to which it is currently set, but it does effect the ability of the unit to respond to its remote, which is the only way to power it on or off, as well as to perform input changes, or subtle filter changes. When the SU-9 starts to get hot, the remote becomes partially dysfunctional: you have to press a given key on multiple occasions to effect the desired result. When the unit becomes REALLY hot (almost too hot to touch), then the dysfunction is complete. No changes to its current state are possible.
So, be careful where this is physically housed in your system! I am short on space, but now have it where it is not in contact with anything else and the problem is seemingly fixed.

How is your SU-9 getting hot? Did you crank up the sample/bit rate to maximum and leave it on all day? I've been using exclusive mode on Windows 10 with Tidal and I haven't needed to get it up there. My default bit/sample rates are 32-bits@96000khz, but most of the time tracks are playing at 44100hz.

 

[Hemi-Demon]

There is zero indication a "warm" DAC is one that is "high distortion by design". I would personally expect one that rolls off the high-end by at least some dB... also don't see you talking about any proper A-B method whatsoever, what comparison did you do here, exactly? Just sighted, highly opiniated comments?

I think you meant to quote the other guy, not me

 

[Veri]

I think you meant to quote the other guy, not me

The ifi products are pretty warm (ie high distortion by design), some people just prefer inaccuracy.

Isn't that what you said? I'm just confused why people think iFi == warm. I don't see the relation, they use older DACs but they should be good enough to not make such seemingly obvious differences.

 

[CrystalGipsy]

Not sure measurements are everything considering the most popular DACs are not SMSL or Topping but ones that allegedly measure not as good. Musicality is what's important in any piece of audio equipment not how it measures and is in ears of the listene. My post was to ask why is it not sounding very good and lacking musicality as it was not very neutral when it's touted as such. I have the RME ADI 2 as my main headrig and that definitely is so I know neutral when I hear it.

But I found out what was the issue on my own. It was the headphone pads for this system. I had rolled to non stock pads when using the same headphones with my DAP as they worked better but forgot I had done that. Seems these pads cause too much roll off higher up in the range with this setup. Changed back to the stock pads and now it sounds a lot better and more balanced. Now I can give it a good test.

 

[CrystalGipsy]

Isn't that what you said? I'm just confused why people think iFi == warm. I don't see the relation, they use older DACs but they should be good enough to not make such seemingly obvious differences.

I can't say I found the Ifi overly warm at all in my usage.

 

[4udio]

Hello everyone. I'm new on this forum.
I'm just wandering, is there option to auto turn off display after some time?
I don't really like having always on display. That is the reason I love my black Topping D50s + P50 combo - it becomes stealthy when screen is off so I don't think or look at it during listening sessions.

 

[CrystalGipsy]

Hello everyone. I'm new on this forum.
I'm just wandering, is there option to auto turn off display after some time?
I don't really like having always on display. That is the reason I love my black Topping D50s + P50 combo - it becomes stealthy when screen is off so I don't think or look at it during listening sessions.

I would like the same but there appears to be no way of doing it whilst its on.

 

[nj75f]

Everyone who dislikes that for topping d90, smsl m400 or su-9, the screen can't be turned off manually, or automatically after some seconds, should write an e-mail to the support asap.
Ask the support to forward it to the employee in charge. Ask for confirmation, because the usually respond with a 08/15 message, not really reading your e-mail, lol.
The more the better, or else they just ignore it.

Question:
Is the SU-9 really using Asio in exlusive mode? It seems like not.
I've installed the drivers correctly and configured the windows 10 os settings.
These are the options shown in the music player.

If I start a browser video with sound and use wasapi exlcusive event/push for smsl usb dac, the warning is shown that "other audio souces won't be able to use the device".
I press play and other audio sources (browser video) is muted automatically and correctly. Only able to proceed if stoping the audio and refresh the browser page.

Interestingly, if choosing ASIO usb dac, the same message is shown, but when playing music, other audio sources are still playing (browser video, video player etc.).
Strange.

 

[Atanasi]

Interestingly, if choosing ASIO usb dac, the same message is shown, but when playing music, other audio sources are still playing (browser video, video player etc.).
Strange.

ASIO doesn't guarantee exclusivity, in fact, many drivers explicitly support multiple clients.

 

[nj75f]

So is this Asio mode is not exclusive, meaning talking directly to the audio device driver, bypassing the windows audio engine?
If it supports multiple clients at he same time, it isn't exclusive, or can these contraries exist?

Microsofts own wasapi is doing it as it seems.

Edit: I misunderstood you?

Some ASIO implementations do support multiple clients.
This means you can play more than one stream at the time.

Link Okay so, exclusive simultaneously with multiple clients, asio/asio or asio/windows.
Okay, wow, so it works. Nice feature
Thanks!

 

[Atanasi]

Link Okay so, exclusive simultaneously with multiple clients, asio/asio or asio/windows.
Okay, wow, so it works. Nice feature
Thanks!

Yes, exclusivity refers primarily to a single client playing.

Thesycon is the common driver provider for products that have XMOS chips.
I found this response about their driver behavior:

The concept of our driver is that ASIO always is preferred over Windows sound devices. That means if an applications plays sound through Windows sound devices and ASIO is started with a different sample rate than this application is interrupted because ASIO can change the sample rate. If ASIO is started with the same sample rate than the audio data of the application and ASIO is mixed.
WASAPI exclusive mode is a mechanism of Windows. In shared mode multiple applications can play at the same time and Windows mixes this signals. In exclusive only one application uses the sound device and takes control over the sample rate. No other application can use the sound device during this time. But this is independent from ASIO. ASIO is still preferred over Windows sound devices used in exclusive mode. This is because the driver can't detect if the Windows sound device is used in exclusive mode or not.

https://www.matrix-digi.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=28

 

[misterdog]

My M400 came with a Thesycon ASIO driver.

https://www.thesycon.de/eng/usb_audiodriver.shtml

 

[CrystalGipsy]

So now after solving my headphone issue I have had some time to judge this better with a number of different styles and have to say its very nice indeed. It has more detail overall than the Ifi and bass extension and control seems firmer and less flabby. It's almost getting to sound as good as the RME on its own but it just lacks a little finesse and is a perhaps bit bolder and rougher. Look forward to more time with it.

 

[nj75f]

@Atanasi
Dou you know if the multi client asio thing is also dependent of the music player?

I used AIMP and the asio multi client exclusivity worked.
Now I'm testing JRiver, selected "USB DAC (ASIO)" as the device and everything outside of the music player software is automatically muted.
I have to restart streams/videos when playing in the browser too, to be able to hear a tone again.
Strange.

AIMP definitely showed the "exclusive" thing warning. With my old sound card, which wasn't able to do multi client asio, everything else was muted too when using asio.

 

[Atanasi]

Dou you know if the multi client asio thing is also dependent of the music player?

It shouldn't. Your problem sounds like a driver issue. Note that ordinary Windows apps cannot play at the same time as ASIO if sample rates are different.
Maybe differing sample rates disconnect Windows audio, and you have to restart apps to reinitialize it.

 

[CrystalGipsy]

Anyone know how to contact SMSL support? Want email to request they add a display off option. Can't find anyway to contact them other than Facebook or Twitter neither of which I use.

 

[somebodyelse]

Anyone know how to contact SMSL support? Want email to request they add a display off option. Can't find anyway to contact them other than Facebook or Twitter neither of which I use.

@SMSL-Mandy perhaps?

 

[nj75f]

It shouldn't. Your problem sounds like a driver issue. Note that ordinary Windows apps cannot play at the same time as ASIO if sample rates are different.
Maybe differing sample rates disconnect Windows audio, and you have to restart apps to reinitialize it.

I'm confused a bit.
It worked with AIMP, while the sample rate of the browser video was different than the sample rate of my music playing in AIMP.

With driver issue, you mean the driver of the music player? I watched in the Jriver folder and see that Jriver has it own asio driver dll called "JRiverASIODriver64.dll".
Might that be the reason?