SMSL SU-10 DAC Review

[Massimo]

I would much rather companies like SMSL focus on delivering functionality that people have been wanting for years ... like a 12v trigger.

 

[StuartC]

The DAC manufacturers are given/sold a selection of ICs and they make what they can from those. The DAC manufacturers cannot choose a grade of IC and expect it to be there in 6 months for cheap consumption. In other words the manufacturers of DACs and stuff cannot determine the IC makers agenda. Silicon is getting better and better and time marches on...

Oh I understand that completely, and ensuring that your new components perform as well/better than previous ones is a valid task. What I'm pointing out is the fallacy of chasing better performance when it's totally inaudible to the consumer.

We do it in Automotive Engineering. we could make cars that are 10/10 in every respect, but the reality is it's not cost effective, and 99% of the public cannot tell the difference between an 8/10 car and one that's better. So set targets accordingly and down tools when you cross the line. Otherwise you're chasing ever diminishing returns.

 

[Vovgan]

There is a way to measure lower noise levels using a noise amplifier. And then subtracting that from the measured results. I just don't know if it is the right thing to do beyond the point we are now.

IMO we’re already saturated with excellent DACs and combos to choose from; personally I would be happy to close this chapter for a year or so and see more research on AVRs, esp given that there are quite a few announced recently and were still far from finding perfection there…

 

[vco1]

For a $900 product they better have a look at the fonts used. Or at the UI in general.

 

[Doodski]

What I'm pointing out is the fallacy of chasing better performance when it's totally inaudible to the consumer.

Who is going to limit their technology and capability in order to satisfy a judgement call. Is it the IC makers or the DAC makers?

 

[CopperFox]

Has there been a measurement of the effect of noise filters on frequency response on an AK4499 dac? Would be an interesting comparison to the ES9038Pro dacs.

 

[pma]

Yes, breaking borders of inaudibility and prices get higher and higher. I still stick with my old DacMagic+ as it has two switchable coaxial and optical inputs and this is the key to me. The difference in parameters is inaudible. And the unit has been in daily operation for 6 years without any problem. No need to get top chart breaker every year.

 

[Lupin]

SOTA performance of course but..
Compared with their own M500 MKIII for example $900 is quite a big ask for just a DAC.

I like the form factor and new display though.

 

[amirm]

For a $900 product they better have a look at the fonts used. Or at the UI in general.

This is a tradition in HiFi to use the stylized fonts for each logo. That is why PCM looks the way it does on their display.

 

[vco1]

This is a tradition in HiFi to use the stylized fonts for each logo. That is why PCM looks the way it does on their display.

Thanks for the explanation. It was indeed mostly the PCM I referred to. Never considered this to be a logo.
I won't hear that 0.00001% difference in SINAD. But I will see that display each time I look at the device.

 

[martijn86]

Of course no one should worry about fraction of dB SINAD as the measurements are highly variable in that regard.

It means nothing but I'm just interested. Is the score a moment or is it a mean, average or peak of a longer capture? Is that even possible to capture 5 seconds and calculate a mean 123.8dB (+/- .4dB) for example?

 

[HerbertThePervert]

Thanks for the review.

Another DAC that beats the previous ones by a hair... Well... SMSL and Topping seem to know what they are doing, so i am kind of tired of their products (And DACs in general) being reviewed so often...

Gonna have to drop ship some interesting stuff to you soon...

 

[Jimster480]

Honestly now I think they should work on adding new features and stuff that people ask for. Do better Bluetooth management, perfect the DSD / MQA implementations and so on and so forth. I'm sure we could get a thread going (if there isn't already one) that has a list of features people want to add.

 

[DualTriode]

There is a way to measure lower noise levels using a noise amplifier. And then subtracting that from the measured results. I just don't know if it is the right thing to do beyond the point we are now.

Sorry I missed this post. Good enough.

I read the post where you said that analyzer had hit its wall and jumped on that.

Thanks DT

 

[respice finem]

Honestly now I think they should work on adding new features and stuff that people ask for. Do better Bluetooth management, perfect the DSD / MQA implementations and so on and so forth. I'm sure we could get a thread going (if there isn't already one) that has a list of features people want to add.

DSP / crossfeed would be nice to have at this price (and a less basic remote, maybe)

 

[DualTriode]

....but do they really? If everything Amir is measuring is inaudible then attempts to improve beyond that are just unnecessary expenditure in terms of time, finance and resources. It's just vastly diminishing returns now.

I would humbly propose that the number of DACs from the likes of Topping, SMSL etc be drastically reduced to a few a year, with more emphasis on other electronic products such as amplifiers etc. These still have a long way to go to reach the levels of transparency seen in the measurements above. We all know now that these companies are quite literally at the top of their game for DACs, so lets focus on the downstream components which are letting the side down.

inaudible is not important to someone that wants to do one step better. Then someone will step up to measure that.

Once again, see the example of op-amps with inaudible noise and distortion. They do not go unmeasured.

Thanks DT

 

[Dimifoot]

I will agree with has been mentioned above.
These excellent DACs are becoming meaningless inaudibility exercises.

They now have to move forward and add features like subwoofer(s) integration, peq filters, streaming etc

 

[Jimster480]

DSP / crossfeed would be nice to have at this price (and a less basic remote, maybe)

DSP/EQ is a big one

 

[HuubFranssen]

This site is in an embrace with Shenzhen, leading to nothing. When you believe that you cannot hear the small differences this race to the bottom has no value. At the other side of the spectrum: when you’re sure the sound is more important than measurements this has no value too.

Without doubt Shenzhen already has finished another dac with slightly better measurements. I think they even plan this carefully. With a smile on their face.

 

[anphex]

So we're reaching the SINAD squeeze and price competition due to the fact that almost all newer DACs have incredible performance.
I hope to see a DAC that lets you apply EQ, maybe even FIR EQ! Most of them already have a pretty advanced XMOS USB chip so with a few extra steps it shouldn't be that complicated.