Jimi Floyd
Senior Member
When cars had CD players there were very few cars in China.
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SMSL PL200T Review (CD Transport)
- Thread starter NTTY
- Start date
Roland68
Major Contributor
You do realize that China, Africa, and India are the three largest importing countries for global electronic waste, right? It's no coincidence that China has been investing heavily in Africa's industrial infrastructure for years.
Well, it's not that SMSL engineers will be stripping the cd players.
The scrapyards in those countries work differently compared to USA/EU, they will strip the parts that can be sold on second hand markets, especially for the older car models that do not have new parts anymore. They do not replace cars every 5-10 years so having a 20 years old car is quite common.
And how do you get replacement parts for those cars? On the scrapyards.
Few percent maybe, which is still millions in countries like China and India.
I wouldn't worry, if it was new.
DonDish
Senior Member
Yeah thats a fact. Got a dead one in my car. Serves as a slot holder for my phone
What to make of the drive units in those, or any new player/transport? The word is that there really aren't any more high quality audio drives made. So I am wondering how an older CD player when used as a transport would perform, that has the Philips CD Pro 2 drive unit inside?
Roland68
Major Contributor
The question is, what do you mean by "high-quality"?
If it's about mechanical quality, which has absolutely nothing to do with sound, error-free reading, or CD readability, then there isn't much left, except perhaps VRDS drives. But even they don't offer any advantage, except perhaps a slightly longer lifespan (not the laser).
The older drives you mentioned can't perform any better, since the one tested here, and other inexpensive drives, have already achieved 100%. It doesn't get any better than that.
That doesn't mean that older drives can achieve the same.
If you do buy an older model, make sure that replacement lasers are available. For many high-quality drives/players, replacements are no longer available (e.g., for most Pioneer turntable drives). AliExpress isn't a good source for this, as they often sell used and refurbished lasers.
As far as lifespan is concerned, the mechanical components are usually perfectly adequate. Notebook CD/DVD drives, which are much more delicate and sensitive, often still work perfectly even after 15-20 years.
CD eject mechanisms are usually the first to fail. Multi-disk changers typically fail far earlier than single disk. A unit like this that includes manual CD loading should have a good chance to last longer than most CD drives with any type of eject mechanism.
I'd like to see the review of Pro-ject CD Box RS2 T that has StreamUnlimited (they changed the name recently to SUOS-HiFi) CD-Pro 8 mechanism (which is new and advertised as high-quality). It's expensive though (~2500$/eur), though couple of other players/transports are much more expensive.
Hi,
Ntty, thanks for this profund review.
That CD-Plyers would't fail is defintely wrong. I'm 54 yrs and had 3 of them (well, I had more, but 3 broke). The first two where cheap ones (Yamaha, Phillips) - it alway began with the loading mechanics!!! But the last one was from T+A! First the loading mechanism (after 10 years). After a few more years the motor. Had to replace the whole mechnanic for 500 USD... (300 USD for the working time!) - And now I'm selling it...
After this lesson I don't want a CD-Player with loading mechanics anymore. So I'm very interested in top-loaders.
So, can anybody say something objective to the differences of a Rega Apollo (CDP, top loader) and the above mentioned Pro-Ject CD Box RS2 T or the Shanling EX3 or similar? Rega is at the same price in the used market as the PL200T, the Project 200-300 USD above. I don't want to reopen the discussion what is hearable and what not, but I quite often read the Rega A sounds spacier (better imaging and soundstage). So: I can hear differences between (some!) DACs especially in the soundstage (the chips sounds same, but not their implementations....) - anyone had experiences with one or all of them? Any advices?
Looking for a decent Transport with top loading for my DAC (Auralic Vega S1 and Teac UD701N).
Thanks!
Ntty, thanks for this profund review.
That CD-Plyers would't fail is defintely wrong. I'm 54 yrs and had 3 of them (well, I had more, but 3 broke). The first two where cheap ones (Yamaha, Phillips) - it alway began with the loading mechanics!!! But the last one was from T+A! First the loading mechanism (after 10 years). After a few more years the motor. Had to replace the whole mechnanic for 500 USD... (300 USD for the working time!) - And now I'm selling it...
After this lesson I don't want a CD-Player with loading mechanics anymore. So I'm very interested in top-loaders.
So, can anybody say something objective to the differences of a Rega Apollo (CDP, top loader) and the above mentioned Pro-Ject CD Box RS2 T or the Shanling EX3 or similar? Rega is at the same price in the used market as the PL200T, the Project 200-300 USD above. I don't want to reopen the discussion what is hearable and what not, but I quite often read the Rega A sounds spacier (better imaging and soundstage). So: I can hear differences between (some!) DACs especially in the soundstage (the chips sounds same, but not their implementations....) - anyone had experiences with one or all of them? Any advices?
Looking for a decent Transport with top loading for my DAC (Auralic Vega S1 and Teac UD701N).
Thanks!
I know that such statements may provoke things like this - thats why I asked for "objective" experiences and advices... Not comments which only shows, well, better to stop here...
And if you quote me, than please correctly: "I often read the REga A sounds...." I didn't make a statement that it in fact is so...
Roland68
Major Contributor
Since you're only looking for a drive, the sound quality of the Rega shouldn't matter.
However, I would advise against the Rega if it uses a clamp-type CD holder. I've already had three units where this clamp broke, and finding replacement parts and installing them is a hassle.
From a purely mechanical standpoint, the drive in the Pro-Ject CD Box RS2 T is probably the highest quality, but that doesn't necessarily mean it will last longer than the PL200T or Shanling EX3.
Since tests and measurements of the other drives are unlikely to be significantly better than the PL200T, the decision ultimately comes down to aesthetics, feel, and your budget. You also shouldn't forget that you can get at least four new PL200T drives for the price of one Pro-Ject CD Box RS2 T.
I dedided on the PL200T . Looked at the Pro-Ject cool thing but way to expensive for what it does, there is an even more expensive Michi ( Rotel ) top loader ?
PL200 T has all three digital outputs spdiff toslink and AES ( and I2S less useful but it’s there ) which I expect any pure transport to have .
Way back even a low rent Cambridge disc-magic came with a complete set of outputs
( old Cambridge was a bit rickety not the nice build they show today ).
The objective advice is that this is about look and feel features and build quality. But it’s hard to judge build quality.
Given a modern well functioning DAC or similar at the receiving end the analog output of the DAC will be identical with any transport .
Maybe @NTTY could find some way of forensically identifying them at the DAC output with some obscure test signal ?
But otherwise I guess that run to run differences when measuring the analog out are of the same magnitude as different transports so you could not pick them apart.
So the other objective advice would be that decent transports are functionaly identical and a solved problem nowadays.
But look for tests and measurements as there are some weird ones that resample outputs or other shenanigans .
So the SMLS PL200T also has this going for it competent third party measurements showing a very good results low clock drift and all .
PL200 T has all three digital outputs spdiff toslink and AES ( and I2S less useful but it’s there ) which I expect any pure transport to have .
Way back even a low rent Cambridge disc-magic came with a complete set of outputs
( old Cambridge was a bit rickety not the nice build they show today ).The objective advice is that this is about look and feel features and build quality. But it’s hard to judge build quality.
Given a modern well functioning DAC or similar at the receiving end the analog output of the DAC will be identical with any transport .
Maybe @NTTY could find some way of forensically identifying them at the DAC output with some obscure test signal ?
But otherwise I guess that run to run differences when measuring the analog out are of the same magnitude as different transports so you could not pick them apart.
So the other objective advice would be that decent transports are functionaly identical and a solved problem nowadays.
But look for tests and measurements as there are some weird ones that resample outputs or other shenanigans .
So the SMLS PL200T also has this going for it competent third party measurements showing a very good results low clock drift and all .
Thanks for your advices so far. The Pro-Ject is very interesting (Audio vs PC-drive), but as you said: too expensive. Does anybody know something of its predecessor the RS - especially the drive-unit? It's a bit cheaper than the PL200T in the used market.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #178
Transports generally output the same digital signal. Only if they use an ASRC would they not. The ASRC can be tricky to identify when looking at the analog output, but opening the device or getting access to the block diagram would let us know. That said, the interpolator of an ASRC has the tendency to be overloaded with intersample overs tests, showing nasty distorsion and noise all over the place.
I recently had the case, seeing that typical distorsion, and additional tests from the digital outputs confirmed the presence of an ASRC.
Can you please list all CD-Transports or small and decent CD-Players you have seen so far without ASRC? And how to recognise ASCR physically after opening? This would be very helpful.
Sorry, my comment was not directed at you, although it may appear as such.
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