SMSL D200 DAC Review

[Bubblefish]

Also visit the gain staging of your system. There is too much gain available if max attenuation is still higher than a desired volume.
The issue may be in your amplifier. It is unusual that a pair of speakers (90dB efficient) and an amplifier (maybe 23dB voltage gain) is too loud for some listening with -60dB dropped in the dac. It should be a whisper.
I have extremely high efficiency speakers and have never needed to pad down a dac that much. But have used mid 40’s. That was with an amplifier with normal voltage gain.
I now use the dac chips to control volume. And an amplifier with zero voltage gain. This way dac is padded down -10 to -20dB depending on target volume and level of the track.
Using the D200 at even -40dB is hurting the overall sonics. The signal is being boosted to a high level somewhere and then reduced a 100 times to get a desired output level.

Thank you also for this tip: I checked the gain and reduced it from maximum to about 19 dB. At the lowest volume level still audible to me (D200 with −59.5 dB), only very quiet music is now heard—just loud enough that the subsequent muting is unnoticeable.

In the coming weeks I’ll be switching to two Fosi Audio V3 Mono amplifiers, which I plan to connect to the DAC via XLR. As far as I know, in this configuration the power amplifiers are fixed at 20 dB gain. I hope that will work out…

Thanks, Bubblefish

 

[Roland68]

It took a while, but I was finally able to follow the recommendation after purchasing a new coaxial cable.

Thank you for the tip: I can hardly believe that resetting a brand-new D200 to factory settings and using a coaxial cable solved the issue, but I followed the suggested steps. After the reset and a flawless USB test with my FiiO M21, I connected the WiiM via both coaxial and optical cables and was able to identify the faulty optical cable in a direct comparison.

The speakers were already correctly wired to the amplifier.

Thanks, Bubblefish

That’s good to hear.
You don’t need to worry about the device, either; I’ve often found that a device simply needed a hard reset or a restore to factory settings.
Cables can be a different issue—especially if there are hidden defects in the welds or solder joints, or if the internal strands are broken.

 

[audioje]

So this is a "hidden gem" dac. Quite interesting. Some smsl 200 lines are quite impressive.

 

[NoPojamas]

I just ordered the D200 for its Bluetooth capabilities as i stream FLAC from my phone.
Critical listening will be over USB.
I use USB Audio Player app with the ToneBooster PEQ add-on. I run all PEQ settings either 0 dB or subtractive and im curious if that would help avoid intersample overs or should I also use the USB Audio Digital Volume to shave off an additional 1.5 dB?
Any rough idea how many bits this would use of any?

 

[NoPojamas]

€ 1.799,95

That's a massive jump in price over D200!
They're testing the Watt'ers ey?

 

[NoPojamas]

That video says nothing else than "stay away from SMSL, buy Topping". No details provided of how the test was run, filters used for the comparison, for instance. This is the standard BS. Not worth commenting more.
The D200 is transparent, provided you stay away from the "NO FILTER", and has a best in class volume control.
Use the Sharp Filter, and if you don’t like the sound, send it back to the supplier, if they are open to that, claiming you have a defective item.

Why do I want to use Sharp Filter if my old ears can't hear above 12-14K?
The Sharp Filter produces a Subtle HF Stridency i do not percieve when switching to Slow Roll-Off Filter...

I seem to prefer Slow Roll-Off with Sound Color #4 (32× OS with No HPC)

 

[starence]

This is my first day with the D200, liking it a lot so far, I really wish they hadn't put the XLR jacks upside down though.

Which "sound color" is technically the the best, High OSR+HPC On?

 

[NoPojamas]

This is my first day with the D200, liking it a lot so far, I really wish they hadn't put the XLR jacks upside down though.

Which "sound color" is technically the the best, High OSR+HPC On?

Whatever sounds best to you is what's best for you. Many Measurements of Properly Designed DACs seem to be beyond the threshold of hearing so other than level matching to ensure equal volume when comparing...many Measurements seem somewhat arbitrary imo other than to confirm transparency?
How many can hear clearly to 20K even with headphones?

The only thing I notice is a subtle stridency in HF when using a Sharp Roll-Off Filter.
I listen thru speakers, at 2.5M, in a moderately acoustically treated room so i don't notice the micro details you get when listening via Cans.

 

[NoPojamas]

Ive tried Sound Color #3 and the transients seem marginally sharper vs #4 but its a balancing act between Micro and Macro dynamics? The biggest difference I think I hear is that burnish heard with horns where the #3 lacks the velvety body heard with #4.
I prefer coherence of Macro vs detail of Micro...
If you are listening to trio or quartets where you don't find as much frequency overlap i favor the Macro. If you're listening to music where several instruments are overlapping frequency range i can understand the benefit of higher micro dynamic retrieval.

Pelt me with Rotten Fruit and Veg all you want!

 

[VientoB]

Why do I want to use Sharp Filter if my old ears can't hear above 12-14K?
The Sharp Filter produces a Subtle HF Stridency i do not percieve when switching to Slow Roll-Off Filter...

I seem to prefer Slow Roll-Off with Sound Color #4 (32× OS with No HPC)

Probably you brain playing tricks on you.

 

[RandomEar]

Ive tried Sound Color #3 and the transients seem marginally sharper vs #4 but its a balancing act between Micro and Macro dynamics? The biggest difference I think I hear is that burnish heard with horns where the #3 lacks the velvety body heard with #4.
I prefer coherence of Macro vs detail of Micro...
If you are listening to trio or quartets where you don't find as much frequency overlap i favor the Macro. If you're listening to music where several instruments are overlapping frequency range i can understand the benefit of higher micro dynamic retrieval.

Pelt me with Rotten Fruit and Veg all you want!

The sound color options are probably the same as these here. You can see that the highest distortion peaks are around - 60 dB. Humans typically fail to identify distortion in regular music below -40 dB. Since you don't describe any blinding for your tests, the by far most likely answer is that the result is 100% placebo / sighted bias.

I would encourage you to try the Klippel test and see if you can detect distortion at the levels necessary to differentiate any "sound color" option.

And since you mention "old ears" in a previous post: Typical slow roll-off filters have a reduced treble response over about 15 kHz with CD quality material (44.1 kHz). The difference between slow and fast roll-off filters is therefore extremely unlikely to be audible to you if you are older than about 45.

Most audible differences people think they hear disappear in a controlled blind test. Reality can be very boring.

 

[NoPojamas]

The sound color options are probably the same as these here. You can see that the highest distortion peaks are around - 60 dB. Humans typically fail to identify distortion in regular music below -40 dB. Since you don't describe any blinding for your tests, the by far most likely answer is that the result is 100% placebo / sighted bias.

I would encourage you to try the Klippel test and see if you can detect distortion at the levels necessary to differentiate any "sound color" option.

And since you mention "old ears" in a previous post: Typical slow roll-off filters have a reduced treble response over about 15 kHz with CD quality material (44.1 kHz). The difference between slow and fast roll-off filters is therefore extremely unlikely to be audible to you if you are older than about 45.

Most audible differences people think they hear disappear in a controlled blind test. Reality can be very boring.

I was going back and forth between 3 and 4
and 3 seems to provide subtle improvement in leading edge of transients...better Micro?
I still prefer 4, especially the way it presents Cello, Sax, and Vibes...all seem more natural sounding... bowing string noise, burnish of overtones, muted attack sustain release of vibes.
Barrel-Proof Wheated Bourbon definitely biases ones perception!
Could I differentiate blind...probably not

For those experienced with measuring and testing methods I ask if there is any agreement correlating perception with measurement?
Fast vs Slow Filters should be fairly noticeable re: frequency drop to someone with good ears?
Can Pre-Ringing be "Heard" and confirmed via ABX?
Filters that move Pre-Ringing to Post Impulse could create a sonic smearing?

would be interesting to feed a well measured NOS DAC a variety of HQPlayer Filters and Blind Test such

 

[NoPojamas]

Probably you brain playing tricks on you.

Pulling the Wool Over my own Eyes!!!
Give Me Slack

 

[RandomEar]

I was going back and forth between 3 and 4
and 3 seems to provide subtle improvement in leading edge of transients...better Micro?
I still prefer 4, especially the way it presents Cello, Sax, and Vibes...all seem more natural sounding... bowing string noise, burnish of overtones, muted attack sustain release of vibes.
Barrel-Proof Wheated Bourbon definitely biases ones perception!
Could I differentiate blind...probably not

That's the point: If there is no difference in a blind test, it suggests that the signal itself isn't actually audibly different. The perception of a difference then must come from something other than sound...

For those experienced with measuring and testing methods I ask if there is any agreement correlating perception with measurement?

It depends: For some metrics there is a strong correlaction up to the threshold of audbility. For others like phase, measurements show precise differences but our ears are not very sensitive to the property so the correlation will be weaker. In general, you can measure everything you can hear, but not the other way around. Measurements can detect things which are orders of magnitude too small to be audible, so past a certain threshold, our ears are just not the deciding factor anymore.

Fast vs Slow Filters should be fairly noticeable re: frequency drop to someone with good ears?

As I said: For young-ish people with CD-quality material. If you can't hear 15 kHz tones, why would it matter if the filter reduces the amplitude by 0.5 dB at 16 kHz?

Can Pre-Ringing be "Heard" and confirmed via ABX?
Filters that move Pre-Ringing to Post Impulse could create a sonic smearing?

would be interesting to feed a well measured NOS DAC a variety of HQPlayer Filters and Blind Test such

"I can hear them church bells pre-ringing!" - A (mostly) time domain investigation into DAC-like reconstruction filters

INTRO I've recently encountered a couple of posts about pre-ringing in linear phase reconstruction filters in DACs. Most claim the usual: How they can definitely hear the difference between filters, how that evil pre-ringing makes linear phase much worse and so on. Impressions from...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[starence]

Tried to switch on my D200 today, and nothing happened, it's just dead. Tested the outlet, unplugged everything but the power cord and tried again, still nothing. Bummer.

 

[Roland68]

Tried to switch on my D200 today, and nothing happened, it's just dead. Tested the outlet, unplugged everything but the power cord and tried again, still nothing. Bummer.

Two questions: Have you tried a different power cable yet? Is the switch on the back near the power plug turned on?

 

[starence]

Two questions: Have you tried a different power cable yet? Is the switch on the back near the power plug turned on?

Yes and yes, but the screen doesn't even flicker, it's just dead. Luckily it's not too late to return it.

 

[Roland68]

Yes and yes, but the screen doesn't even flicker, it's just dead. Luckily it's not too late to return it.

If you can return it, that would be the easiest thing to do.