Single full range drivers

[MaxBuck]

This was the best full-range speaker I ever heard :

Von Schweikert UniField 3

Albert Von Schweikert called it a "dynamic-driver augmented one-way system utilizing a full-range driver for ‘image lock’ supported by a subwoofer and ribbon super tweeter." The majority of the frequency range was covered by the 5" Fostex full-range driver. Crossover frequencies were 100Hz and 8kHz. It was an amazing speaker in a smallish room.

Martin

I'm confused. Isn't a speaker system with two crossovers kind of definitionally a 3-way speaker?

 

[ZolaIII]

I'm confused. Isn't a speaker system with two crossovers kind of definitionally a 3-way speaker?

Don't be confused as you are right. Still Foster FE line is rather good, especially largest one (FE206) but still not enough on it's own and usually paird with external self stand twiter such as T90A.

 

[Dennis Murphy]

Good to get feedback on the Manger. Thanks Dennis. I remember reading about it like twenty years ago or so. Never really saw anything come of it. I guess your testing showed us why.

Have you tested all the sizes of BMRs?

Manger is still in buiness and still trying to crack our market. Stereophile reviewed two of its towers fairly recently--one active tower and one passive. John only published measurements for the passive, but said the active measured basically the same. The driver has changed a little since I worked with it, but the listening window plot looks a lot like my on-axis. The off axis plots are waaaaaaay down in the treble. The review is here:

https://www.stereophile.com/content/manger-p1-loudspeaker-measurements
In what has to be one of John's most diplomatic conclusions, "I was intrigued by the p1's use of a bending-wave drive-unit to cover most of the audioband. The p1's measured performance nicely correlates with its sonic character.—John Atkinson

 

[AlexanderM]

Anyone know this company, are they good? Price is for a pair, 10".

https://www.lii-audio.com/product/n...tal-cone-high-end-crystal-10-in-pair/#reviews

15", 12" also available and on sale.

https://www.lii-audio.com/product/r...ker-with-tube-amplifier-f-15-in-pair/#reviews

 

[mhardy6647]

Anyone know this company, are they good? Price is for a pair, 10".

https://www.lii-audio.com/product/n...tal-cone-high-end-crystal-10-in-pair/#reviews

15", 12" also available and on sale.

https://www.lii-audio.com/product/r...ker-with-tube-amplifier-f-15-in-pair/#reviews

Much chatter on these elsewhere on teh webz.
e.g.,
https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?search/61015435/&q=Lii&o=date
https://hifihaven.org/index.php?threads/lii-audio-f-15.5249/

 

[LightninBoy]

https://www.stereophile.com/content/manger-p1-loudspeaker-measurements
In what has to be one of John's most diplomatic conclusions, "I was intrigued by the p1's use of a bending-wave drive-unit to cover most of the audioband. The p1's measured performance nicely correlates with its sonic character.—John Atkinson

Ha! Depending how one reads that, it is either extremely diplomatic or an absolutely savage burn.

 

[KR500]

I have a pair of SEAS Prestige FA22 8 inch full rangers in 2.8 cu. ft. Cabinets in my listening room.
Used to power them with either a good SET or AB tube amp until I simplified with a NAD SS integrated.
They are somewhat directional, but I listen from my same chair every day , so not a big issue.
Do they have the treble extension of my Klipsch with the tractrix horn ?
The bass extension ?
The boom and sizzle of my friends Paradigms ?
No way, but the midrange of the full ranger is awesome and easy to enjoy.
For $300 in drivers and $30 in the recommended filter circuit components plus cabinetry = happy listening

 

[Vandemann]

I have Lii-15 full range speakers in an open baffle and couldn't be happier. Here are the manufacturer's measurements:

https://www.lii-audio.com/product/r...loudspeaker-with-tube-amplifier-f-15-in-pair/

 

[AlexanderM]

I have Lii-15 full range speakers in an open baffle and couldn't be happier. Here are the manufacturer's measurements:

https://www.lii-audio.com/product/r...loudspeaker-with-tube-amplifier-f-15-in-pair/

Thanks!! I like the idea of the full-range, especially in 10" or above, and the Lii pricing makes it that much easier! No need for crossovers, I read sometimes people will add a tweeter. If there aren't any North American dealers then, hey Amir, what do you think?? lol

 

[markus]

I have Lii-15 full range speakers in an open baffle and couldn't be happier. Here are the manufacturer's measurements:

https://www.lii-audio.com/product/r...loudspeaker-with-tube-amplifier-f-15-in-pair/

Haha, that frequency response graph is certainly wishful thinking, especially for a 15" driver.

Here's what to expect from fullrangers:
https://mehlau.net/audio/full-range-radiation-patterns/index.html
...and these are heavily smoothed graphs (1/3 octave).

 

[Vandemann]

Haha, that frequency response graph is certainly wishful thinking, especially for a 15" driver.

Here's what to expect from fullrangers:
https://mehlau.net/audio/full-range-radiation-patterns/index.html
...and these are heavily smoothed graphs (1/3 octave).

Maybe, but if it's a different driver we're talking apples and oranges.

 

[markus]

Maybe, but if it's a different driver we're talking apples and oranges.

Not really. You can't cheat physics. Fullrangers tend to have huge magnitude response variations and/or massive dispersion issues besides other system inherent distortion issues. Here's some more real world data: http://rutcho.com/speaker_drivers/default.html

Show some measurements of your Lii! In-room, gated is a good first start.

 

[Ericglo]

I looked at some of the other drivers and their frequency driver graphs look more like what I anticipated.

They do show a measurement set up, so it looks like they are taking their own measurements.

 

[markus]

I looked at some of the other drivers and their frequency driver graphs look more like what I anticipated.

They do show a measurement set up, so it looks like they are taking their own measurements.

Cryptic post. What "other drivers"? What exactly did you anticipate? Who is "they" and where did you see "a measurement set up"?

 

[Ericglo]

Cryptic post. What "other drivers"? What exactly did you anticipate? Who is "they" and where did you see a "measurement set up"?

Not that cryptic. The last couple of posts were discussing the Lii drivers. I looked at a couple of the other drivers on their website. The graphs do have the zig zag that I would expect from a full range driver.

 

[tomchris]

Two 'single' driver full range electrostatic loudspeakers worth mentioning:

Martin Logan CLS - Curvilinear Line Source

Quad ESL-63 - full range electrostatic loudspeaker
Virtual point source devised by 7 circular concentric conductors fed by delay lines.

 

[Harmonie]

Sony ss-R10 back in 1995
Edit: Not relevant as per @somebodyelse 's remark, sorry.

 

[AlexanderM]

Doubt I'll do it, but have been thinking these.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/330...8#3468#15607#69&&pdp_ext_f={"sceneId":"3339"}

With these.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/328...xp_id=088eb67c-6a91-40e9-bd17-56c43446dfa6-29

 

[somebodyelse]

Sony ss-R10 back in 1995

Isn't that a 3 way with high, mid and low panels?

 

[tuga]

It’s something I think I’ll investigate myself. Subjectively a good single driver has certain things it does way better. I would love to pinpoint what that is in terms of objective measurement, but only to apply those principles to a multi-way speaker.

Other than it being a point source at normal listening distances and having no transition/crossover in the fundamentals range everything else about it’s performance is quite poor.