Sibilance- the recording or my system

[Jerry Sobel]

i have wondered about the issue of sibilance for a long time because I'm very sensitive to it. Is it a recording issue or something in my system? I know that some recordings have it but what role does the gear play in possibly accentuating it?

 

[RayDunzl]

Sibilance:

"Sibilants are louder than their non-sibilant counterparts, and most of their acoustic energy occurs at higher frequencies than non-sibilant fricatives. has the most acoustic strength at around 8,000 Hz, but can reach as high as 10,000 Hz. [ʃ] has the bulk of its acoustic energy at around 4,000 Hz, but can extend up to around 8,000 Hz."

What's the frequency response of your system at the listening position look like?

 

[Sal1950]

i have wondered about the issue of sibilance for a long time because I'm very sensitive to it.

Spitty sizzling sibilance is dreaded and has been fought by anyone who was ever seriously into HiFi.

Is it a recording issue or something in my system?

All of the above, many recordings have this nasty trend and the worst part (IMO) is that poor recordings that exhibit these errors sound worse the better (more accurate) the gear gets. Probably one of the driving forces of the subjective wing of our hobby is many years of listeners judging gear on how well is sounds with poor recordings. The belief by some that if a piece of gear can smooth those sibilant edges it is "better" IE more musical. Can you say tube gear?
Before this starts a war let me say there is really no right way, if a listeners preference is to tune his rig to be more forgiving of bad recordings, that's fine. I've been on both sides of the fence and today attempt to find a way to ride it. Building a kit that can be revealing and accurate, but being able to put switch in some controls that allow you to soften things when desired to me allows the best of both worlds.

 

[Wombat]

Don't worry. it will diminish as you get older.

Seriously, if it doesn't happen on CD or streaming then it is likely to be the vinyl, phono cartridge set-up or tracking ability.

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...dges-cant-be-played-without-sibilance.255701/

 

[Wombat]

Or a dry joint or bad capacitor.

 

[Cosmik]

Any notable example recordings?

 

[Soniclife]

What gear do you have?

I've always considered it to be a tweeter problem, or stylus profile problem with vinyl.

Have a look at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De-essing

 

[svart-hvitt]

Examples, please. Preferably on Tidal to ensure 16/44 and same-same Master.

 

[FrantzM]

Examples, please. Preferably on Tidal to ensure 16/44 and same-same Master.

I second that motion

 

[Jerry Sobel]

Any notable example recordings?

Some Holly Cole tracks on don't smoke in bed immediately comes to mind.

 

[Jerry Sobel]

What gear do you have?

I've always considered it to be a tweeter problem, or stylus profile problem with vinyl.

Have a look at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De-essing

Good article. I guess I could drop the dB between 2-10kHz on my house curve to see what it sounds like.
I do know that some recordings just have it and cannot be eliminated

 

[Soniclife]

Good article. I guess I could drop the dB between 2-10kHz on my house curve to see what it sounds like.

I'd want to know what frequency it was, and work from there, or try the audacity fix suggested in the wiki on a problem track. A REW measurement of your system would help.
I said I suspect the tweeter above, but it could also be midrange driver breaking up at the top of if range, not a simple excess of frequency.

 

[rebbiputzmaker]

Any notable example recordings?

I do not think this it is the recordings. The recordings are excaberating a system issue.

 

[Jerry Sobel]

I'd want to know what frequency it was, and work from there, or try the audacity fix suggested in the wiki on a problem track. A REW measurement of your system would help.
I said I suspect the tweeter above, but it could also be midrange driver breaking up at the top of if range, not a simple excess of frequency.

I have plenty of curves REW and Dirac Live that I can post later. I do not think it is the speakers because I had it with my previous ones also and my current ones are nearly new. Hey but anything is possible.

 

[Soniclife]

I do not think it is the speakers because I had it with my previous ones also and my current ones are nearly new. Hey but anything is possible.

What were the old and new speakers? Are you applying correction above the Schroeder frequency?

 

[Fitzcaraldo215]

Don't worry. it will diminish as you get older.

Seriously, if it doesn't happen on CD or streaming then it is likely to be the vinyl, phono cartridge set-up or tracking ability.

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...dges-cant-be-played-without-sibilance.255701/

Yup. Tracking ability and downforce. I remember that ages ago when I believed the super tracker hype on a Shure V15 at 0.75 grams. Increasing downforce fixed it nicely, though I was slow to accept that possibility and tried analog graphic EQ instead for awhile.

 

[Sal1950]

 

[Fitzcaraldo215]

I'd want to know what frequency it was, and work from there, or try the audacity fix suggested in the wiki on a problem track. A REW measurement of your system would help.
I said I suspect the tweeter above, but it could also be midrange driver breaking up at the top of if range, not a simple excess of frequency.

Yes, it might also be from the sudden directivity change between large mid and small treble drivers around the xover frequency. The workaround for that was the old BBC fairly narrow response dip at around 2,500 Hz, sometimes engineered into speakers and also (badly) into the default Audyssey target curve.

Also, though Jerry's speakers were changed, I wonder about hard reflections from walls or ceiling, unless he also changed the room, speaker position, etc.

 

[svart-hvitt]

FWIW,

the last times I noticed sibilance was:

(1) A guy who had put together a system using low-mid priced units and still trying to get «high fidelity» sound.

(2) In a SOTA 4D cinema where I suspect poor engineering/adjustments.

(3) When listening to M2 speakers.

Concerning (3) the dealer suggested the tweeter sound may be poorly aligned, meaning higher frequencies arrive sooner than lower frequencies.

Concerning (2) the sibilance was extremely annoying (especially during commercials before the film started), making me suspect there was some heavy DSP involved and what we were listening to was in fact MP3 or much lower.

Concerning (1) I thought it just was an example of how difficult it is to assemble a hi-fi system from bottom-up.

So there you have it. Sibilance is annoying and it’s difficult to say what’s the exact source. I lean towards the hypothesis, though, that really annoying sibilance is due to the system, not the recording.

 

[Cosmik]

Some Holly Cole tracks on don't smoke in bed immediately comes to mind.

On my first brief listening to it at random places in the album it sounds OK to me, but on the first track there is definitely something peculiar at about 18s in - does this happen at other places?