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Should a power amplifier be grounded through RCA cables or power supply?

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When the amplifier is class II (double isolated) or is fed via an isolated external power supply it does not have to be 'grounded' (connected to safety ground).
I can surely feel electrical zap when the amp is not grounded through RCA cables. I surely don't want a device that zaps me. That leakage current should be dumped into the outlet ground. It's hard to imagine that something that zaps me has no effect on noise.

What happens if I connect AIYIMA A07 to a grounded power supply like GST60A24-P1J or GSM60A24-P1J anyway? Something wrong happens? Or, nothing becomes worse, compared to this?
 
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solderdude

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Nothing wrong happens.
You may need to run a separate wire from the metalic parts to safety ground.
Most likely the 'tingling' comes from the USB source the DAC is connected to.
 
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Most likely the 'tingling' comes from the USB source the DAC is connected to.
The USB source is the computer which is grounded.

Amp <-> DAC <-> Computer <-> Electrical ground. There is nothing else.

When amp is not connected to DAC, it tingles.
 
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You may need to run a separate wire from the metalic parts to safety ground.
Need? That sounds like something wrong or something worse.

In any case, either RCA cables or the power supply will ground the metal case to the safety ground, will they not?

The fact that RCA cables remove the zap through the computer means the metal case should be connected to the safety ground through the computer if the metal case is not connected to the safety ground through the power supply.

Does the removal of zap not prove that the metal case is connected to the safety ground?
 
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NTK

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Note that the negative side of the output from the Mean Well GST60A power supply is not connected to ground.

mean_well.png
 

solderdude

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Need? That sounds like something wrong or something worse.

IF you want to red rid of the 'tingling' you may have to need to do this.
That said, IF it doesn't happen when connected and it gets grounded via RCA/USB/PC then there is nothing to worry about
 
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@NTK What about GSM60A power supply?

2023-03-31 22:55:11.png

If both the power supply and the RCA cable are grounded, then could it create a ground loop despite the fact that everything is connected to a power strip?
 

solderdude

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It is the same for ALL these SMPS.
NONE of them have the DC out connected to safety ground.
All of these SMPS are galvanically separated by a small sized transformer.

All of them will have some leakage and common mode noise on the DC out. This is what causes the tingling when not connected to grounded gear.
You will either need to ground it through the audio cable, an external ground wire or use a medical grade SMPS to lower the leakage.
 

sonder

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> You may need to run a separate wire from the metalic parts to safety ground.
Need? That sounds like something wrong or something worse.

I've linked you to the same paper which explains all of this three times now, in two thread, the difference between audio grounding and power grounding, why you need additional wires in your cables (XLR, not RCA), full balancing, to achieve the grounding.

What's the point in asking the same things over and over and persisting when you have literally 8 full forum pages of people saying the same things to you, linking to the canonical sources, giving you the calculations, and so on.

I've learned so much in these threads over the same time period and made very informed decisions based on great information from people trying to help you here like solderdude and mdsimon2. Seriously there's so much gold in all the posts that you've already had that it's probably one of the best threads with all the numbers, all the sources, all the various ways of tackling the issues throughout full stacks, and links to a wealth of products, that it could be summarized in to one of the most helpful resources on the subject available on the web.

Just actually read the things that have been said and that you've been linked to, it's gold, and will upgrade your understanding ten fold, as it has mine.

1680275082906.png
 
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@solderdude I think I'm reasonably satisfied. Thanks. I think I know what I want to do now.

I will buy GSM60A24-P1J.
 
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@sonder You may already know, but it takes time to learn something new especially when it is convoluted.

I have difficulty with understanding a lot of new concepts laid before me. I can't just understand it immediately.

While I may read the pdf file soon, don't expect people to read everything as quickly as possible.
 

Doodski

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@sonder You may already know, but it takes time to learn something new especially when it is convoluted.

I have difficulty with understanding a lot of new concepts laid before me. I can't just understand it immediately.

While I may read the pdf file soon, don't expect people to read everything as quickly as possible.
I experienced the same thing when I studied electronics. I was up till ~midnight or 1am studying diligently and in class @ 8am. I missed a few things/concepts and they where concerned about me at the beginning but I persevered and the result is I got the 2nd highest mark in the class. So don't let it get you down. You can do this. :D It's sometimes tricky and difficult stuff and that's normal for electronics study. :)
 

sonder

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@sonder You may already know, but it takes time to learn something new especially when it is convoluted.

I have difficulty with understanding a lot of new concepts laid before me. I can't just understand it immediately.

While I may read the pdf file soon, don't expect people to read everything as quickly as possible.
I started learning about this at the same time, however I've been fortunate to be able to commit more hours and go a bit more in depth.

Ultimately, we all have shared goals, better audio for each other, and for our own personal flavour.

Coming from a similar setup, I don't know what speakers you have, but so far the amp is arguably the weak point in the chain here, but can be improved a bit, the d10s is great.
 

dan kolov

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Hello, on Japanese audio equipment from the 80s. made for the European market with S and D plug markings without N and L markings. Which is Phase and which is Zero. Regards.
 
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