SHD to bi-amp vs SHD Studio active speakers - which is best?

[beefkabob]

I know I want Dirac room correction. It's easy and I am not going to treat my room. I know I'd like having a built-in streamer. That makes the SHD products the best choices, IMO. I don't want to hook up a PC. I do have a NAS on 24/7.

I know I want 2.0 or 2.1, not surround. Too many speakers = ugly. Surround sound never thrilled me.

Is it better to go from an SHD Studio into a pair of active speakers, maybe with and active sub, or is it better to go from a full SHD into two amps and then bi-amp a pair of speakers? Maybe also add a sub.

I don't have a set budget. I could afford the Dutch and Dutch 8, but I don't really want to spend that much unless it's going to blow my mind. I was looking at things like the HEDD 20 (around 4k for a set) but then I don't want to sit in one place. I'd rather have good sound that fills a larger room. Off-axis performance matters. I could do a full Benchmark setup, with DAC, pre-amp, and amp. Then I'd still need a streamer and something to do Dirac, which would make having that expensive DAC kind of stupid.

The local audiophile store wanted me to get a pair of Paradigm 75F, which sounded clean and clear but thin on the bass and didn't strike me as a value. Also no in-home auditions, so why bother buying local then?

SHD Studio into a Dutch and Dutch 8? Is that a waste of money? Can I get 90% of the performance for half the money or a quarter of the money?

So confused.

 

[digicidal]

SHD Studio would work with the DD8C's but you've got redundancy there that is likely unnecessary. The 8C's already have streaming and DSP room correction built in as far as I know. If you're looking for a budget version then you could go with the full SHD, two good studio monitors, and two good subs... you'd have full range and Dirac for everything, plus streaming.

One thing to consider for the difference in the SHD vs SHD Studio is that with the Studio you're required to either have actives with built in DAC (in which case some will have their own DSP capabilities as well), or a secondary DAC. Have you listened to the 8C's? Considering the cost, and the fact that they already provide almost everything you want by themselves... you could get them first and if you find their DSP capabilities inadequate for some reason... you could then add an SHD Studio into the mix. On the other hand... if you're not positive - then I'd pick your speakers first.

I seriously doubt anyone would call the D&D 8C's "a waste of money" - but nothing is perfect (at least speaker-wise). How much space do you have for them? If you're open to the possibility of a 2.1 or 2.2 setup... then you might find even better sound - after all you can then move the subs to optimal locations and not have them possibly interacting with the direct sound from the mid/high drivers. Since you're committed to not treating your room - I'm assuming that you're not all that flexible with placement either? For close to full-range in a relatively compact package, the 8C's are probably the best you can get. However, I'd bet that a pair of Series 7 JBL actives and a pair of good 12" subs would sound as good for about half the cost.

Just my $0.02 and not worth a penny more probably... but something to think about. I'm in the same boat however... I would love to have a great preamp with DAC, streaming, Dirac, and HDMI switching as my TV processor (no surround there). I've considered the NAD C 658 - which has a good look and usability, but likely less than spectacular DAC section (but does have Dirac). Also consider the Mytek Brooklyn Bridge, which should be a great DAC, etc. but no Dirac (not sure any DSP functions built-in). And there's the Matrix Audio Element X which tested amazingly here. All of them have something I want, but something I'm not so pleased about - which is what keeps me using my Marantz 8801A despite not using 90% of it and not being satisfied with much of what I am using.

 

[jhaider]

Is it better to go from an SHD Studio into a pair of active speakers, maybe with and active sub, or is it better to go from a full SHD into two amps and then bi-amp a pair of speakers? Maybe also add a sub.

Don't overthink it. If you have speakers or amps with digital inputs - Dutch & Dutch do I think - then the digital SHD makes sense. If you have speakers or amps with analog inputs, measurements here show the SHD analog section performs well. There is no reason I can see to do bass management externally.

One sub is at cross-purposes with "sounds good everywhere" though. Dirac or other auto EQ can make it sound good in one spot, but the spatial variance in the bass will be high. If that is an important criterion, 8C is a good fit. They provide two full range bass sources, as well as potentially lower spatial variance in the upper bass because of the cardioid midbass loading.

 

[beefkabob]

All great input. Still confused.

 

[digicidal]

All great input. Still confused.

My wife and I feel the same way about car shopping.

However, unlike the case with autos - with audio there's much less of a necessary compromise IMO. With any kind of a decent budget - you can get sound unlike anything possible 50 years ago. But I understand the confusion. Every time I try to figure out the "best way" to achieve what I want... I'm either looking at another pile of boxes each with a dedicated purpose - or a single device that lacks one or two significant features.

 

[Olli]

I‘d go for the SHD - it has everything the Studio version has, but you are more flexible wrt speakers.

A nice and reasonably priced combo (if you want Dirac and not something more complex like Audiolense) could be a SHD, 2 JBL 705 or 708 ps, and 2 Rythmik F8 subs. I would definitely recommend 2 subs, and these ones are really slim and easy to integrate, you can put the bookshelves on top of them with some Isoacoustics Pucks in between.

 

[beefkabob]

My wife and I feel the same way about car shopping.

However, unlike the case with autos - with audio there's much less of a necessary compromise IMO. With any kind of a decent budget - you can get sound unlike anything possible 50 years ago. But I understand the confusion. Every time I try to figure out the "best way" to achieve what I want... I'm either looking at another pile of boxes each with a dedicated purpose - or a single device that lacks one or two significant features.

See, I like car shopping. I totally understand it. I've also bought a lot more cars than speakers.

Two reasons to have the SHD or SHD Studio, even with DSP speakers, are the volume control and streamer. The SHD can more-easily integrate subs, it'd seem.

Then there's the KEF LS50W, which integrate everything into a decent speaker. No clutter. Plus I can get them at Best Buy then return them if I don't like them. Erg!

 

[beefkabob]

I‘d go for the SHD - it has everything the Studio version has, but you are more flexible wrt speakers.

A nice and reasonably priced combo (if you want Dirac and not something more complex like Audiolense) could be a SHD, 2 JBL 705 or 708 ps, and 2 Rythmik F8 subs. I would definitely recommend 2 subs, and these ones are really slim and easy to integrate, you can put the bookshelves on top of them with some Isoacoustics Pucks in between.

How different are the 705 and 708 once you add in subs?

 

[Olli]

How different are the 705 and 708 once you add in subs?

Can't tell you, I only have the 705. But I can assure you that they already sound awesome, and since the F8 subs are good up to 250 Hz, I wouldn't be to worried about the smaller woofer. I have them crossed at 165 Hz.

 

[Olli]

And of course, the KEF LS50 is also a nice option. If you get a Hypex based amp at March Audio (he is also active on this forum, I have the P252: www.marchaudio.net.au), you are probably looking at a similiar price, but more domestic asthetics.

 

[beefkabob]

I‘d go for the SHD - it has everything the Studio version has, but you are more flexible wrt speakers.

A nice and reasonably priced combo (if you want Dirac and not something more complex like Audiolense) could be a SHD, 2 JBL 705 or 708 ps, and 2 Rythmik F8 subs. I would definitely recommend 2 subs, and these ones are really slim and easy to integrate, you can put the bookshelves on top of them with some Isoacoustics Pucks in between.

I ended up ordering the 708p b-stock that just went on sale and sold out over night. I also ordered an SHD Studio. I want to stay digital as much as I can since all my sources are digital. I'll add subs later. I may end up with something that takes a digital in, or I may get a DAC that takes coaxial and then output to powered subs.

 

[BDWoody]

I'm interested in your opinion of using the SHD with the 708's. I picked up a pair during the same sale. I'm also trying to learn more about the HiQnet connection...seems that would/should allow remote setting changes if combined with JBL software? Anyway, hope you are happy with your 708's!

 

[Krunok]

SHD Studio would work with the DD8C's but you've got redundancy there that is likely unnecessary. The 8C's already have streaming and DSP room correction built in as far as I know.

It has only PEQ filtering where everything has to be done mannually - nothing close to what automated room EQ system like Dirac or Audyssey do.
You may however be able to enter the PEQ values from REW automated correction system.

 

[digicidal]

It has only PEQ filtering where everything has to be done mannually - nothing close to what automated room EQ system like Dirac or Audyssey do.
You may be able to enter the PEQ values from REQ automated correction system.

Yeah I wondered about that... the documentation on them is "sparse" to put it mildly. They mention nothing in the manual whatsoever, but mention in other marketing materials "tune the speakers to your room not your room to your speakers" - which led me to believe they had some room correction setup in their control app. I guess not.

 

[Krunok]

Yeah I wondered about that... the documentation on them is "sparse" to put it mildly. They mention nothing in the manual whatsoever, but mention in other marketing materials "tune the speakers to your room not your room to your speakers" - which led me to believe they had some room correction setup in their control app. I guess not.

Yep, nothing in the manual. You can find screenshot from the mobile app here.

 

[beefkabob]

I'm interested in your opinion of using the SHD with the 708's. I picked up a pair during the same sale. I'm also trying to learn more about the HiQnet connection...seems that would/should allow remote setting changes if combined with JBL software? Anyway, hope you are happy with your 708's!

Yeah, I'm trying to figure out the Hiqnet stuff too. I should be able to skip the SHD entirely and stream over the network. Looks like Dante has software for $30, and there may be free alternatives. Trying to figure it out. The SHD Studio may prove unnecessary even if convenient.

 

[BDWoody]

Yeah, I'm trying to figure out the Hiqnet stuff too. I should be able to skip the SHD entirely and stream over the network. Looks like Dante has software for $30, and there may be free alternatives. Trying to figure it out. The SHD Studio may prove unnecessary even if convenient.

Indeed. There's a lot built in, but the documentation is worthless, so it's going to involve some poking around.

And what's up with that spotlight on the front!
First and likely only tweak...a piece of tape.

 

[beefkabob]

The SHD arrived last night. I set it up, mostly. Don't have the speakers yet! I'm going to try an RCA cable in place of a COAX to see if I can play anything out of the stereo through my $15 Amazon DAC.

 

[beefkabob]

Have the speakers. Don't have the cables! They arrive Monday. I did manage to get the SHD Studio connected, through the cheap DAC, to the old amp and stereo. It, of course, sounds just like before, except now I can stream to the server. Volumio is pretty mediocre, I must say. I'm not gonna bother to set up Dirac with the old system. I'd rather just hear the new.

Also the 708p b-stock speakers look excellent. They were also packaged perfectly.

As for HiQnet, my understanding is that the 708p speakers support Blu Link and such, but it takes expensive, specialized routing and control hardware to make them work. It's not a direct hookup to an ethernet network then streaming to the device. So a DAC or an SHD Studio is necessary. Like I said, I wanted to avoid an extra DA AD transition. It's just aesthetically better. What can I say?

 

[BDWoody]

Have the speakers. Don't have the cables! They arrive Monday. I did manage to get the SHD Studio connected, through the cheap DAC, to the old amp and stereo. It, of course, sounds just like before, except now I can stream to the server. Volumio is pretty mediocre, I must say. I'm not gonna bother to set up Dirac with the old system. I'd rather just hear the new.

Also the 708p b-stock speakers look excellent. They were also packaged perfectly.

As for HiQnet, my understanding is that the 708p speakers support Blu Link and such, but it takes expensive, specialized routing and control hardware to make them work. It's not a direct hookup to an ethernet network then streaming to the device. So a DAC or an SHD Studio is necessary. Like I said, I wanted to avoid an extra DA AD transition. It's just aesthetically better. What can I say?

I was getting to the same conclusion on the Hiqnet thing...
I am looking at this...

https://www.minidsp.com/products/usb-audio-interface/u-dio8

Just USB-8xDigital out...