- Joined
- Jul 12, 2024
- Messages
- 803
- Likes
- 1,195
¿por qué no los dos?The obvious suspicion is really sloppy test setup, making it worthless. The worse suspicion is deliberate manipulation to fabricate perceivable differences.
¿por qué no los dos?The obvious suspicion is really sloppy test setup, making it worthless. The worse suspicion is deliberate manipulation to fabricate perceivable differences.
Since we love to have our facts straight I checked myself (a bit handicapped working on a Linux PC with only Audaciity installed).
If douchebag manipulated the files and is lying, the levels are different and the video commenter said it sounded like he was using a hpf, which would not surprise me, your wasting your time. Hes a scammer who knows little real electronics. Come on, different levels for a comparison test? Hes either scamming or knows nothing about this subject. I think its both.@pkane, I made an attempt to compare Danny's opamp recordings via DeltaWave but the delta's are that large that it's difficult to believe they result from swapping opamps. Can you have a look at these graphs (file 1 versus 2) and check if you see something that might point to processing issues (incl. me making errors)? (Result file is also in attachment).
Edit: I trimmed the start and the end of the files manually because it looks like there's an alignment issue, but I can't get a better result.
View attachment 437738
View attachment 437739
View attachment 437740
Zoomed in alignment
View attachment 437776
With file 1 versus file 3 DeltaWave had issues with matching clock drift, which is also strange.
Since we love to have our facts straight I checked myself (a bit handicapped working on a Linux PC with only Audaciity installed). The 3 recordings available on Danny's video, start of the tracks perfectly aligned. You can even see the left channel of the 3th track clipping just by looking at the waveform:
View attachment 437238
@pkane, I made an attempt to compare Danny's opamp recordings via DeltaWave but the delta's are that large that it's difficult to believe they result from swapping opamps. Can you have a look at these graphs (file 1 versus 2) and check if you see something that might point to processing issues (incl. me making errors)? (Result file is also in attachment).
Edit: I trimmed the start and the end of the files manually because it looks like there's an alignment issue, but I can't get a better result.
View attachment 437738
View attachment 437739
View attachment 437740
Zoomed in alignment
View attachment 437776
With file 1 versus file 3 DeltaWave had issues with matching clock drift, which is also strange.
Do you understand how opamps work? The gain and frequency response are set by the external components.I think that we cannot rule out the possibility that some of those discrete op-amps have been deliberately designed with additional time constants in order for them to act like a subtle tone control or equalizer.
@pkane, I made an attempt to compare Danny's opamp recordings via DeltaWave but the delta's are that large that it's difficult to believe they result from swapping opamps. Can you have a look at these graphs (file 1 versus 2) and check if you see something that might point to processing issues (incl. me making errors)? (Result file is also in attachment).
Edit: I trimmed the start and the end of the files manually because it looks like there's an alignment issue, but I can't get a better result.
View attachment 437738
View attachment 437739
View attachment 437740
Zoomed in alignment
View attachment 437776
With file 1 versus file 3 DeltaWave had issues with matching clock drift, which is also strange.
I am not trying to defend anyone.Do you understand how opamps work? The gain and frequency response are set by the external components.
[...]
The guy is a fraud and it's naïve to try to defend him.
But anyone who understands electronics can. It doesn't matter what you do in those modules, you cannot increase the gain of the circuit.I for myself cannot rule out the possibility
Sorry, wasn't following the discussion here. Where can I get the clips to be compared?
The op-amps used in the GR-Research youtube video are not off-the shelf op-amp from reputable established manufacturers of ICs, but discrete op-amps built by some companies that address a particular clientele. I for myself cannot rule out the possibility that those discrete op-amp are actually not plain simple op-amps but that their circuit boards are deliberately designed with built-in components to alter the gain or frequency response and/or that those discrete op-amps cannot be used unconditionally in any existing circuit and remain stable.
And there is the problem. You start from a false premise.I just search for reasonable explanations for the measured differences under the following condition I have outlined : 'assuming no errors or cheating were made by the author with the test or the recording set-up'.
“If my mother had two wheels, she’d be a bicycle.”And there is the problem. You start from a false premise.
They are linked to the YouTube video referenced earlier. Links:
1. https://bit.ly/3FPAKde (Stacatto + Stock)
2. https://bit.ly/4bJvsw4 (Stacatto + Sparkos)
3. https://bit.ly/4kxKlpb (Sparkos + Sparkos)
So, it's reasonable to conclude that the files aren't worth comparing due to multiple factors, including level differences, clipping, and unexplainable artifacts?Here's comparison. 2 and 3 are clipping in a number of places and there's an obvious level difference between 1 and 2 and 1 and 3. #1 is not clipping anywhere.
Comparing 1 to 2, frequency response is strange (those consistent frequency lines across the recording) and there's 0.93dB difference in levels:
View attachment 437977
Removing clipped areas, the RMS of the difference is -40dB full spectrum, and -49.6dBA, which is not awful, but still suspicious due to the frequency artifacts (and clipping).
Comparing 1 to 3 shows a larger difference in level of 2.3dB, and null RMS value of only about -22dB and 42dBA. Spectrogram shows larger, more pronounced frequency bands across the recording:
View attachment 437982
Removing clipped areas, the RMS of the difference is -40dB full spectrum, and -49.6dBA, which is not awful, but still suspicious due to the frequency artifacts (and clipping).
I only glanced at the datasheet but the Sparkos stuff seems like a quite conventional "objectivist-friendly" design. It's always possible misusing it in the wrong circuit will cause issues but it's a fine audio op-amp.The op-amps used in the GR-Research youtube video are not off-the shelf op-amp from reputable established manufacturers of ICs, but discrete op-amps built by some companies that address a particular clientele. I for myself cannot rule out the possibility that those discrete op-amp are actually not plain simple op-amps but that their circuit boards are deliberately designed with built-in components to alter the gain or frequency response and/or that those discrete op-amps cannot be used unconditionally in any existing circuit and remain stable.
Right. Seems to me these op amps were not configured correctly in circuit, likely resulting in oscillations and frequency response artifacts. Level differences can be corrected for in comparison, but clipping and oscillations cannot.Thanks. I only used the first 40 sec of the tracks to stay out of the part that’s clipping and got similar delta value. Suspicious indeed. The root cause remains unknown, but it's safe to conclude people shouldn't use these recordings to get a reliable impression of the effect of opamp swapping.
Which is exactly why swapping op amps will, at best, have no benefit, but will far more likely make things worse. It's a stupid thing to do.Seems to me these op amps were not configured correctly in circuit, likely resulting in oscillations and frequency response artifacts