Sennheiser HDB 630

[Oldson]

ahh, that explains it then.
with all that going on, i am surprised i didnt notice any latency issues on youtube videos!

 

[SoySalsaPicante]

ahh, that explains it then.
with all that going on, i am surprised i didnt notice any latency issues on youtube videos!

That usually occurs on the HDB 630 when connected wirelessly due to the encoding and decoding being heavy calculations. I never had lag/lip-synch issues when connected via USB, and I don’t imagine the ADC induces much delay when using analog input either.

 

[Sebby]

I know I might get flamed for this, but today I had the chance to try them, with the HD800s right next to them.
I managed to listen in complete silence, even though Milan is packed with people because of the Olympics.
Without EQ, I prefer the HDB630 over the HD800s.
The wide soundstage of the HD800s (which on my Arya Stealth is just as wide) is the only area where they come out ahead. In everything else, I think the 630 are superior in every respect. Maybe it’s because I can’t really stomach the severe lack of bass and the 6 kHz peak of the HD800s, which to my ears make them sound like a broken pair of headphones. The only downside is that my ears get very hot after 10 minutes

 

[BlueTunes]

I've just finished a wrestling match replacing the rechargable battery on my Jabra headset which was goosed after 4 years.
Changing it physically wasn't difficult but actually getting a replacement battery was next to impossible, either from the manufacturer or the OEM.
I've ended up with a 3rd party battery from Ebay which, meh, just about works but doesn't report battery level properly.

As these new ennehiser BT headphones cost £400 and according to the blurb: "Batteries are not exchangable... recyling..."
Are they effectively going to be disposable e-waste afte a few years?

I don't fancy fannying around with them as i have done with the Jabra if i do buy them, which, considering the above, unless something changes, i probably won't.

Is nobody arsed about this?

 

[solderdude]

I've replaced the battery in the PXC550-II from my son about a year ago with an aftermarket battery from Ali-express and that worked but within a year that battery also essentially died.
Now he uses it directly from USB (so effectively wired).

It's the main reason why I hate wireless stuff.... longevity of the battery.
The HDB630 is so new no-one had to replace the batteries yet but am sure in a few years time most owners will have to if they want to keep it running.

Young folks usually don't seem to mind and after a few years they want the latest and greatest anyway.
Usually the pads are gone by then too.

 

[Sebby]

I've replaced the battery in the PXC550-II from my son about a year ago with an aftermarket battery from Ali-express and that worked but within a year that battery also essentially died.
Now he uses it directly from USB (so effectively wired).

It's the main reason why I hate wireless stuff.... longevity of the battery.
The HDB630 is so new no-one had to replace the batteries yet but am sure in a few years time most owners will have to if they want to keep it running.

Young folks usually don't seem to mind and after a few years they want the latest and greatest anyway.
Usually the pads are gone by then too.

It’s also true that considering the duration of a single charge and that today’s batteries, in the worst case scenario, reach 80% capacity after 300 cycles, and the best ones even 1000 cycles, even in the worst case it would last at least 12 years if used 3 hours a day every day.

Taking into account that a battery also degrades while sitting idle I’d say 9/10 years is perfectly realistic and you’d still be at 80% capacity, which in terms of runtime is still higher than many brand new headphones today.

The battery in my Sony Xperia X Compact, purchased in 2016 and now used as a DAP, showed signs of wear after the Covid period and I replaced it myself. I don’t think battery issues are a major concern today in the short to medium term...

 

[kharan]

It’s also true that considering the duration of a single charge and that today’s batteries, in the worst case scenario, reach 80% capacity after 300 cycles, and the best ones even 1000 cycles, even in the worst case it would last at least 12 years if used 3 hours a day every day.

Taking into account that a battery also degrades while sitting idle I’d say 9/10 years is perfectly realistic and you’d still be at 80% capacity, which in terms of runtime is still higher than many brand new headphones today.

The battery in my Sony Xperia X Compact, purchased in 2016 and now used as a DAP, showed signs of wear after the Covid period and I replaced it myself. I don’t think battery issues are a major concern today in the short to medium term...

Except that the headphones stay in a low power state when you don't use them so that they can wake up when you put them on your head or when the appropriate bluetooth wake up signal plays.

And the auto power down isn't 100% reliable.

 

[Sebby]

Except that the headphones stay in a low power state when you don't use them so that they can wake up when you put them on your head or when the appropriate bluetooth wake up signal plays.

And the auto power down isn't 100% reliable.

It could be, but I don’t think battery management is that different from IEMs. I have the Technics AZ100 TWS I bought at the Munich High End and if I don’t use them for a month, the battery level of both the IEMs and the case stays exactly where I left it, so I’m not sure how much impact that really has.

With top line Sennheisers I’d hope they have decent idle battery management. The important thing is to keep the number of cycles as low as possible

 

[kharan]

It could be, but I don’t think battery management is that different from IEMs. I have the Technics AZ100 TWS I bought at the Munich High End and if I don’t use them for a month, the battery level of both the IEMs and the case stays exactly where I left it, so I’m not sure how much impact that really has.

With top line Sennheisers I’d hope they have decent idle battery management. The important thing is to keep the number of cycles as low as possible

I'm speaking about my own pair. Not overly worried about it as I recharge about three times a month, but the auto-power down has been flaky.

 

[BlueTunes]

It’s also true that considering the duration of a single charge and that today’s batteries, in the worst case scenario, reach 80% capacity after 300 cycles, and the best ones even 1000 cycles, even in the worst case it would last at least 12 years if used 3 hours a day every day.

Taking into account that a battery also degrades while sitting idle I’d say 9/10 years is perfectly realistic and you’d still be at 80% capacity, which in terms of runtime is still higher than many brand new headphones today.

The battery in my Sony Xperia X Compact, purchased in 2016 and now used as a DAP, showed signs of wear after the Covid period and I replaced it myself. I don’t think battery issues are a major concern today in the short to medium term...

I don't know what battery devices you have that are still usuable after 10 years but for me, everything with a battery regardless of charging cycles, etc tank after 3 years. I've JBL, Jabra, and umpteen other things dead U/S which are not older than 5 years.

I've a pair of HD650's manufactured 20 years ago which are still working perfectly fine. and so on.

Without a sensible repair option, battery devices are worthless after 3-4 years current tech and i see no reason to believe that Senn have invented anything to contradict that.
One should remember that Audio devices are particularly succeptable to overcharging and over draining given the usage case.

God willing, i'll come back to this thread in a year or two and will start to read owners struggling with this issue.

 

[Sebby]

I don't know what battery devices you have that are still usuable after 10 years but for me, everything with a battery regardless of charging cycles, etc tank after 3 years. I've JBL, Jabra, and umpteen other things dead U/S which are not older than 5 years.

I've a pair of HD650's manufactured 20 years ago which are still working perfectly fine. and so on.

Without a sensible repair option, battery devices are worthless after 3-4 years current tech and i see no reason to believe that Senn have invented anything to contradict that.
One should remember that Audio devices are particularly succeptable to overcharging and over draining given the usage case.

God willing, i'll come back to this thread in a year or two and will start to read owners struggling with this issue.

I’ll repeat: the battery in my old Sony Xperia lasted 8 years, my Topping G5 bought in autumn 2022 still has a perfect battery, my smartphone has 417 completed charge cycles and the battery is still at 100%.
Are you sure you’re using good quality chargers?
I have the Technics AZ100 and I’m confident that in 5 years they’ll still be perfectly fine.
In the worst case scenario, if after 5 years I end up with 8 hours of battery life instead of 10, it wouldn’t be the end of the world.

I agree that passive headphones can last much longer since they don’t have a battery, but it’s also true that the time frames are so long that I don’t see any reason to worry.
If in 2 years you come back here and read about people having issues, it will almost certainly be devices that were defective from the start, because with the number of cycles these headphones go through (no more than 100 cycles in 4 years unless you literally do nothing all day every day except listen to music), it’s simply not possible to have serious battery life or longevity problems after 2 or 3 years. It’s not possible to drop below 80% after 300 cycles even with the worst OEM batteries on the market. Aftermarket ones, yes, there’s plenty of junk that barely lasts a year.

Obviously, everything has to be backed up by proper charge and discharge management, otherwise I could make a battery blow up in three hours. We’re still talking about Sennheiser, not Chord

 

[BlueTunes]

I’ll repeat: the battery in my old Sony Xperia lasted 8 years, my Topping G5 bought in autumn 2022 still has a perfect battery, my smartphone has 417 completed charge cycles and the battery is still at 100%.
Are you sure you’re using good quality chargers?
I have the Technics AZ100 and I’m confident that in 5 years they’ll still be perfectly fine.
In the worst case scenario, if after 5 years I end up with 8 hours of battery life instead of 10, it wouldn’t be the end of the world.

I agree that passive headphones can last much longer since they don’t have a battery, but it’s also true that the time frames are so long that I don’t see any reason to worry.
If in 2 years you come back here and read about people having issues, it will almost certainly be devices that were defective from the start, because with the number of cycles these headphones go through (no more than 100 cycles in 4 years unless you literally do nothing all day every day except listen to music), it’s simply not possible to have serious battery life or longevity problems after 2 or 3 years. It’s not possible to drop below 80% after 300 cycles even with the worst OEM batteries on the market. Aftermarket ones, yes, there’s plenty of junk that barely lasts a year.

Obviously, everything has to be backed up by proper charge and discharge management, otherwise I could make a battery blow up in three hours. We’re still talking about Sennheiser, not Chord

Teasing out your repetition a little here...

Your phone has 417 cycles and is at 100%? Really? How you getting that 100% figure?

And you are using your recent purchases to justify future battery reliability? Hmm.

Let's use the one historic figure you have quoted: 8 years max.

So you are ok with the Senns going to the dump in 8 years?

Can't agree to that myself tbh.

 

[staticV3]

Your phone has 417 cycles and is at 100%? Really? How you getting that 100% figure?

It's just like iPhones claiming to be at 100% SoC after being unplugged and used for an hour

Sure it can say that, doesn't make it any less physically impossible though.

 

[kharan]

To be fair, depending on the exact chemistry of the battery and how well managed it is thermally and from a charging standpoint, a modern battery can last 2000 cycles when the most cited number was 500 cycles some 10-15 years ago.

Samsung phones can survive twice as many charges as Pixel and iPhone, according to EU data

It's not just about how long your phone holds a charge, but also how many times you can recharge that battery before it gives up the ghost.

www.androidauthority.com

 

[danishchelsea]

Can someone please send Bose QC Ultra2 and Sennheiser HDB 630 to Amir for review … please

 

[Sebby]

Teasing out your repetition a little here...

Your phone has 417 cycles and is at 100%? Really? How you getting that 100% figure?

And you are using your recent purchases to justify future battery reliability? Hmm.

Let's use the one historic figure you have quoted: 8 years max.

So you are ok with the Senns going to the dump in 8 years?

Can't agree to that myself tbh.

Setting aside for a moment the fact that my smartphone gives me all the data explicitly, and we agree that it might not be fully reliable, there are affordable devices (<€100) like USB meters and good-quality multimeters, all the way up to more advanced equipment like the Yokogawa WT300. Sure, these aren’t the kind of instruments you’d find at SpaceX, but as you can see, you can manage just fine without spending a fortune.

Anyway, I don’t have to justify anything and I don’t see why I should, but you’re the one implying that a battery that’s gone through just a few dozen cycles is already fit for the trash. That’s absurd even to consider.

And no, I never told you that after 8 years a Sennheiser would be worthless, only that realistically you might be around 80% capacity, which would still be excellent. Even at 50% you’d still have better battery life than brand-new AirPods Max, so you’re imagining a world of problems that simply doesn’t exist. In the worst-case scenario, a lithium battery typically has a potential of around 300 charge cycles before dropping to 80%.

Then again, you’re free to believe that in two years the HDB630 will have batteries ready for the bin, if that makes you feel better

 

[Palladium]

I would prefer if everything had an option to limit max charge to 80-85% like a few phones already have (S23 Ultra, Oppo Find N7).
YMMV but that does wonders to battery longevity.

 

[solderdude]

Li battery life depends on:

temperature,
manufacturer,
chemistry,
how deep it is discharged,
charging current,
in what charge state it is stored if not used for a while,
production tolerances.

Not all lithium batteries are created equal.

The one used in a PXC550-II lasted only 4 years with mild usage of just a few hours every few days (my son uses it for gaming).
The Chinese 'replacement' battery lasted less than a year before loosing so much capacity it became unusable in practice (less than 0.5 hours of usage).

 

[Sebby]

Li battery life depends on:

temperature,
manufacturer,
chemistry,
how deep it is discharged,
charging current,
in what charge state it is stored if not used for a while,
production tolerances.

Not all lithium batteries are created equal.

The one used in a PXC550-II lasted only 4 years with mild usage of just a few hours every few days (my son uses it for gaming).
The Chinese 'replacement' battery lasted less than a year before loosing so much capacity it became unusable in practice (less than 0.5 hours of usage).

Very true, it also depends on how you treat the device. I’ve noticed it makes a big difference to recharge before it drops below 15%, and if you’re not using it for long periods, to keep the charge between 30% and 70%. Charging to 100% all the time, on the other hand, seems to make a negligible difference.

Anyway, the Sennheiser PXC 550 have to go through roughly twice as many charge cycles to deliver the same number of listening hours as an HDB, so realistically it’s not possible to run into problems after 2 years, and not even after 5.

I also have a pair of Pill CC2 that are almost 5 years old, which I use for office calls. They’re perfect for that because I need minimal isolation. I can safely get about 2.5 hours on a single charge, whereas when they were new they struggled to reach 3.5 hours.

And yes, a lot of cheap Chinese batteries you find on the market are honestly pretty awful

 

[kharan]

For curiosity's sake I checked my phone's battery, it was purchased in March 2022 so we're reaching 4 years at this point, so 1460 days.

I charge every night, let's be generous and say I charge for 0.5 cycle on average, meaning that during the day, I use 50% of the capacity of the battery. So that makes 730 full cycles.

It happens that I did test for the battery capacity of my phone when I purchased it by emptying the battery and monitoring the charging cycle until it was fully charged; back then the measured value was 4160 mAh, a bit under the nominal value, I was a bit disappointed that the time.

Earlier today I did the same, I nearly emptied the battery and proceeded to monitor the charge, the estimated battery capacity was 3970 mAh, so a whooping 95.4% battery capacity remaining after more than 700 charge cycles. Not bad.

I confess that I did take measures to protect the battery, very few deep discharges if any at all, and battery charge is limited to 80% on most days. And quite obviously, the software protecting the battery is more advanced on a smartphone than on a bluetooth headphone.