Sennheiser HD 820 Review (headphone)

[frix]

Yep. And with those steps it is super low res and smoothed. Obviously designed for marketing (ohh look how flat it measures, haha)

 

[hger]

Hello Amir, hello all
Thank you for your educational videos and very informative website. As an engineer (chemical engineer), I really appreciate that you make assessments based on measurements and physics.
I have been reading the tests and the comments on the forum about my headphones (Sennheiser HD 820) and my headphone amplifier (Sennheiser HDV 820). The results and the comments are rather poor and it seems that EQ is required to get a good sound. This does not coincide at all with my experience and so I have a rather basic question. Maybe you or someone on the forum can answer this question. I would like to understand the relationships in more detail.
The Frequency Response curve deviates greatly from the ideal. Therefore, many recommend that you use EQ to compensate for these deviations and linearize the curver. To my ear, however, the HD 820 and the HDV 820 sound very good. Could it be that my hearing is a perfect match for the Frequency Response curve. By this I mean that, for example, amplified highs fit my age-related hearing loss. This would put the overlay arriving in the brain back in the good range. So, by chance, one could have a matching hearing with its deficits for all frequency ranges of the headphones, and when the overlay is applied, a quasi-linear curve results in the brain. If I linearize the headphones by EQ the sound of the headphones would be good but not the felt signal in my brain. Does this consideration make sense?
I am very curious about your comments.

 

[respice finem]

Hello Amir, hello all
Thank you for your educational videos and very informative website. As an engineer (chemical engineer), I really appreciate that you make assessments based on measurements and physics.
I have been reading the tests and the comments on the forum about my headphones (Sennheiser HD 820) and my headphone amplifier (Sennheiser HDV 820). The results and the comments are rather poor and it seems that EQ is required to get a good sound. This does not coincide at all with my experience and so I have a rather basic question. Maybe you or someone on the forum can answer this question. I would like to understand the relationships in more detail.
The Frequency Response curve deviates greatly from the ideal. Therefore, many recommend that you use EQ to compensate for these deviations and linearize the curver. To my ear, however, the HD 820 and the HDV 820 sound very good. Could it be that my hearing is a perfect match for the Frequency Response curve. By this I mean that, for example, amplified highs fit my age-related hearing loss. This would put the overlay arriving in the brain back in the good range. So, by chance, one could have a matching hearing with its deficits for all frequency ranges of the headphones, and when the overlay is applied, a quasi-linear curve results in the brain. If I linearize the headphones by EQ the sound of the headphones would be good but not the felt signal in my brain. Does this consideration make sense?
I am very curious about your comments.

IMHO the "catch" is the special character of headphone listening (the anatomical ear making for the most of the "listening room"):
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-of-headphone-listening-loose-thoughts.19996/
That said, I do EQ my headphones, but my EQ is about 50% "flatter" than recommended, but that's just me. Ears (or rather the combination of outer ear / ear canal / tympanic membrane etc.) are probably as unique as fingerprints. With speakers, those anatomical differences will be less important, because of the room influence.

 

[solderdude]

To my ear, however, the HD 820 and the HDV 820 sound very good

They do to me as well (the HD820). I did find the bass a bit disattached from the rest, certainly when compared to the HD800S.
It's possible you don't have a perfect seal (hairs, glasses, overall fit) in which case bass sounds a lot better.
Bass response in the HD820 is extremely seal dependent. (perfect seal, thin glasses, thicker glasses, headphone just slightly lifted)

Could it be that my hearing is a perfect match for the Frequency Response curve. By this I mean that, for example, amplified highs fit my age-related hearing loss.

There are no amplified highs in the HD820, there are in HD800 and HD800S (but less).

Enjoy the HD820, it has some excellent qualities.

 

[hger]

Wow. Thanks for your quick responses!
Yes, I do enjoy them.
Would be curious to EQ them. But my HDV 820 is linked to my streamer by optical cable. I use the HDV 820 DAC which I found is the perfect combination. The HD 820 is connected via Pentaconn. As far as I know, there is no possibility to digital EQ, right?

 

[pjn]

Hello Amir, hello all
Thank you for your educational videos and very informative website. As an engineer (chemical engineer), I really appreciate that you make assessments based on measurements and physics.
I have been reading the tests and the comments on the forum about my headphones (Sennheiser HD 820) and my headphone amplifier (Sennheiser HDV 820). The results and the comments are rather poor and it seems that EQ is required to get a good sound. This does not coincide at all with my experience and so I have a rather basic question. Maybe you or someone on the forum can answer this question. I would like to understand the relationships in more detail.
The Frequency Response curve deviates greatly from the ideal. Therefore, many recommend that you use EQ to compensate for these deviations and linearize the curver. To my ear, however, the HD 820 and the HDV 820 sound very good. Could it be that my hearing is a perfect match for the Frequency Response curve. By this I mean that, for example, amplified highs fit my age-related hearing loss. This would put the overlay arriving in the brain back in the good range. So, by chance, one could have a matching hearing with its deficits for all frequency ranges of the headphones, and when the overlay is applied, a quasi-linear curve results in the brain. If I linearize the headphones by EQ the sound of the headphones would be good but not the felt signal in my brain. Does this consideration make sense?
I am very curious about your comments.

Interesting - as a fellow age-related hearing loss person, I can pretty much ignore everything that is happening above 9 kHz and not worry about it. However, I am curious as to what is happening in those inaudible (for me) regions - it indicates how much thought the engineers who build these things have put into their product.

Even more curiously though is the fact that one of my ears hears quite a bit less well than the other by about 5-10 db. I think I notice this with speakers but I don't notice it at all with headphones and presume that headphones will, in addition to pushing sound down the ear canal to the eardrum and then onto to the brain (with a boat load of transducers down there), also result in hearing through the bones of the skull, bypassing the pinna, the ear canal and the ear drum. This is how Beethoven made such great music in spite of being deaf and apparently it is good for much higher frequencies than I would have guessed - https://www.tinnitusjournal.com/art...-sound-in-the-audiometricultrasonic-range.pdf

My hearing loss was measured with a couple of earpods (yes, I know...) as this was what the app on my phone was calibrated for, so it would be completely focussed on the ear canal, ear drum and points beyond that.

The bottom line, though, as always, is "do you like the sound?". If yes, then great. Just don't push this as an objective finding!

And, my arguments avoid me spending hard cash on a headphone amp that allows balance controls. Although curiosity is a great motivator.

 

[respice finem]

The bottom line, though, as always, is "do you like the sound?". If yes, then great. Just don't push this as an objective finding!

This, and, pleasant does not equal accurate. In this case (hearing loss) accuracy is useless for the listener, who must find his "own fidelity".

 

[hger]

The bottom line, though, as always, is "do you like the sound?". If yes, then great. Just don't push this as an objective finding!

I totally agree. But Sennheiser must have had a clear development target. Has anybody ever heard why they did it (Frequency Response Curve) this way?

 

[pjn]

I totally agree. But Sennheiser must have had a clear development target. Has anybody ever heard why they did it (Frequency Response Curve) this way?

To sell more headphones! I'm sure they have focus groups etc - not people like the typical ASR reader I would guess.

There is also the weird mental state (sunk cost) where the more you pay, the better the product which applies everywhere in society from healthcare to cars

 

[hger]

There is also the weird mental state (sunk cost) where the more you pay, the better the product which applies everywhere in society from healthcare to cars

You're right!

 

[pozz]

Interesting - as a fellow age-related hearing loss person, I can pretty much ignore everything that is happening above 9 kHz and not worry about it. However, I am curious as to what is happening in those inaudible (for me) regions - it indicates how much thought the engineers who build these things have put into their product.

Even more curiously though is the fact that one of my ears hears quite a bit less well than the other by about 5-10 db. I think I notice this with speakers but I don't notice it at all with headphones and presume that headphones will, in addition to pushing sound down the ear canal to the eardrum and then onto to the brain (with a boat load of transducers down there), also result in hearing through the bones of the skull, bypassing the pinna, the ear canal and the ear drum. This is how Beethoven made such great music in spite of being deaf and apparently it is good for much higher frequencies than I would have guessed - https://www.tinnitusjournal.com/art...-sound-in-the-audiometricultrasonic-range.pdf

My hearing loss was measured with a couple of earpods (yes, I know...) as this was what the app on my phone was calibrated for, so it would be completely focussed on the ear canal, ear drum and points beyond that.

The bottom line, though, as always, is "do you like the sound?". If yes, then great. Just don't push this as an objective finding!

And, my arguments avoid me spending hard cash on a headphone amp that allows balance controls. Although curiosity is a great motivator.

Please see this thread for context: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ds/most-useful-diagram-of-hearing-loss.26779/

I don't have any advice other than: go to an audiologist and get some measurements done. They won't be high resolution, but they will let you see what kind of loss and imbalance you have, roughly.

 

[pjn]

Please see this thread for context: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ds/most-useful-diagram-of-hearing-loss.26779/

I don't have any advice other than: go to an audiologist and get some measurements done. They won't be high resolution, but they will let you see what kind of loss and imbalance you have, roughly.

Thanks. An interesting thread (I didn't listen to the talks, but will) - your comment, of course, leads to a critical medical question, one which often is not asked: "what do you want to get out of this?" Given the mild hearing loss that I've had for ages (not nearly as severe as figure 2!), the answer is just that I want my idle curiosity indulged. And no more.

I remember a social session at a meeting a long time ago when one of my colleagues and a good friend said "I don't like these sorts of thing much - when I was in the Swedish military I was in the artillery and it didn't do my hearing much good. So I have trouble following what people say in a crowd". So yes, it does affect the ability to distinguish multiple conversations. A lot.
Interestingly, though, he and I had enormously overlapping tastes in music - choral in particular. Which was completely counterintuitive.

The mental perception of sound is intensely personal - much like the philosophical conundrum of if you say "isn't the sky a pretty blue" I actually have no idea what you are seeing, but would agree if whatever I see pleases me too. And I would know that whatever I saw, it was called "blue"

 

[pozz]

"what do you want to get out of this?"

I'll answer for myself: to know and let go of untested suppositions. Once you have experimental data you can begin examining your perceptions anew and maybe learn about how, unconciously, you've adapted or developed certain personal tactics.

 

[pjn]

I'll answer for myself: to know and let go of untested suppositions. Once you have experimental data you can begin examining your perceptions anew and maybe learn about how, unconciously, you've adapted or developed certain personal tactics.

I like that - yes, often good to get an unbiased opinion to anchor reality.

 

[Carlo2AC]

Does she complain about the midrange dip?

AHaHahahaHah damn you for making me laugh

 

[Deleted member 2702]

HD 820's comfort is the best I have tried for a closed headphone and I find its sound great as well.
That being said, I prefer the HD 800S, but that headphone is open.

 

[tarikuz]

HD 820's comfort is the best I have tried for a closed headphone and I find its sound great as well.
That being said, I prefer the HD 800S, but that headphone is open.

I agree with you. I own it since years, it is a top confort device and the only over ears that I can use in the Sumner time. Definitively I love it. P.s. I have an hifiman susvara and a focal elegia too, do I have good device ti benchmark and say it's good. I

 

[Hoegaardener70]

This headphone was and is consistently ranked at the bottom, by some reviewers worst tier 134 out of 137. Yet, I own and greatly enjoy it … more than the highest ranking ones. It is super comfortable, the perfect headphone for media and gaming with its huge soundstage plus bass reponse and is as a bonus - like the hd800s - tuned perfectly to work with classical music. And all that (kind of) now closed.

Well, that’s what it is to me, at least. But my ears are weird, I also like the Z1R

 

[jacko]

This headphone was and is consistently ranked at the bottom, by some reviewers worst tier 134 out of 137. Yet, I own and greatly enjoy it … more than the highest ranking ones. It is super comfortable, the perfect headphone for media and gaming with its huge soundstage plus bass reponse and is as a bonus - like the hd800s - tuned perfectly to work with classical music. And all that (kind of) now closed.

Well, that’s what it is to me, at least. But my ears are weird, I also like the Z1R

Looking at the positive reception the HD620 has gotten the HD820 doesn't seem to far off. I see a homologous change in response with closed capsules as opposed to the open open design. Instead of trailing bass it retains its low-end strength and the high-end is attenuated. Owing to varying fitment that absurd bass hump is probably reduced for most people as the large HD8-- cups are not known to seal perfectly for anyone except your hairless dummy head. So two "problems" of the HD800 are solved in one go with the HD820 - lack of bass to presence of bass and the shrill peaks become mellowed out.

 

[Jumbotron]

On the Sennheiser store they have the Sennheiser days, ending today. These can be bought for €1328 online at the store, shipment included. I'm tempted to buy. They look comfortable and are light weight. I haven't tried them, though.