Scratching that Genelec itch?

[barry59]

Greetings....current home office (rectangular room 15' x 10') set up is laptop -->USB into SMSL DO 100 Pro -->XLR into JBL LSR 310S --> XLR into Adams Audio T7V. No EQ.

• Listening is both nearfield and I guess mid field (11' from speakers to sitting area)
• HF on the T7V is set to +2 db
• LF on the T7V is set to 0
• Level on the T&V's is set to 0 (recommended in most situations)
• Crossover on the JBL sub is set to 80 hz
• Volume on the JBL is set to about 3/4 of max.
• Design of the room set up as a home office requires that the L/R speakers need to be set up 5 inches from the back wall, and the left speaker is also next to the side wall.
• Room is fully carpeted, with a desk, a dresser and a very comfortable Lazy Boy. I put a Foam Bass trap in one far corner; the other corner opens to a bathroom and has no bass trap. (Girl friend calls it "frat house like" )
• No room EQ, I futzed around and failed miserably with Equalizer APO for windows.
• Music only, classic rock and jazz.

If this kit was what I had to listen to for the rest of my life I could definitely live with it.... HOWEVER, and this is where the Genelec itch comes into play (part one). I feel like I've maxed out performance wise what I can get out of the T7V/JBL set up because the T7V's need to be set up so close to walls. The T7V manual recommends optimal placement 16 inches from walls.

I'm toying with the idea of auditioning a pair of 8030C's, (size/pricewise perfect fit) replacing the T7V's. The 8030C's look to have greater built in room adjustments and can be placed close to the walls. Also toying with the idea of maybe replacing the JBL with an SVS SB Pro 1000. I've got a pair of them in the main living room and I love them. They have greater frequency range; amp is 125 watts greater and I like and am using the app to EQ the subs. Genelec itch part two...I'm a drummer in a for the most part, a local cover band. We put an EP out last year of 3 originals and were again in the studio recently. The main studio monitors were a pair of Genelecs, not sure of the model, but they were bookshelf size with probably an 8-inch woofer, engineer did not know what model.... they were the best sounding speaker I had ever heard, by a country mile. I kept looking for a sub, engineer was laughing, it was just the bookshelf Genelecs.

So, in my mind, I feel like the 8030C/SVS SB Pro 1000 combo will allow better "out of the box" adjustments to account for the constraints of the room and get me to "audio nirvana".
Am I mistaken in my thought process.

Thanks in advance for all comments and suggestions.

 

[vsch]

I have an 8030C + SB-1000 (classic) combo myself (integrated via a miniDSP Flex), and it’s an excellent nearfield setup. One general thought though: sub integration and room correction usually matter more than swapping competent speakers.

If you’re open to adding a box, I’d consider upgrading in roughly this order:

1) Add proper DSP for sub integration and room correction (you can also do this software wise with a multichannel audio interface, but it's less convenient).

Something like a miniDSP Flex + UMIK-1 lets you do:

• proper time/phase alignment
• steep active crossovers (e.g., 48 dB/oct)
• PEQ room correction (manually via REW or with Dirac)

Done well, this can be a huge upgrade — often bigger than changing speakers.

2) Then consider a speaker upgrade

The 8030C are great, but I’m not sure how large the upgrade over the already competent T7V would be — particularly after proper sub integration and room correction.

3) Subwoofer upgrade only if needed

If you’re not running out of output or low-end extension, a new sub may not transform things. In my experience, once subs are properly integrated and EQ’d, differences between competently designed subs tend to be negligible apart from spl capability and low end extension. FWIW, after proper integration and room correction, I cannot tell apart my Arendal 1961 1S, SVS SB-1000 (classic), and KEF HTB2 with music material at reasonable spl.

 

[barry59]

You are suggesting that my concern with the placement of the T7V's close proximity to the back/side walls, and the possible impact on the sound produced can be corrected with DSP?

 

[kemmler3D]

Placement can't really be corrected with DSP, and the 8030s will have the same placement issues as the Adams in that location.

You probably heard the 8050 or 8040 in the studio, they are similar to 8030 but with a bigger woofer. I would guess the nice quality you heard was not just that they're good speakers (they are) but in the studio you also have good placement and good room treatment, so the speakers can really shine. Take the same speakers into your room and you definitely won't hear the same magic.

I have 8030s in my desktop setup, and likewise no complaints, they're great... but I also agree they would not be expected to be game-changers relative to the T7V.

A speaker that was just announced that might be interesting to you would be the Palmer Orbit 11... it's currently looking a little too good to be true, but if the measurements hold up on the test bench, it will compete with the 8030s (or even 8050s) and they're coaxial and cardioid, so somewhat less sensitive to bad placement, especially near-the-wall placement. These are fundamental changes to the design that affect how they work in a nearfield setup. I think it would run slightly more expensive than the 8030 but it's (potentially) a step ahead in terms of features / capability.

I just told my wife I would "never" be upgrading my speakers again but they're making me think I might have to break that promise...

I also agree that room correction with EQ is worth another shot either way.

 

[Waxx]

The 8030C do work close to walls, that is how they are set up in the radio studio i work in regulary. But they still need about 20cm distance minimum from the walls as they got a back port. They are quiet directive on higher frequencies, so unless you put the direct next to the screen, they should work right. Room correction is mainy for the low frequencies important, that won't be that much different than with the JBL's. The adjustments are for how close you put them to a wall.

If you want full integration, you need dsp systems like Dirac (or equivalents), but you don't have that now neighter. I think that will make a bigger difference than changing speakers. I would first focus on that before thinking about swapping speakers.

 

[goofytwoshoes]

I had a pair of 8030C for a couple of years, recently upgraded to 8040B when a pair became available in Canada. Love 'em both. Also have a pair of 8330A (and 7350A sub) with GLM, set up beside the 8040B pair on identical 24 inch stands. Bought all on the used market.

If you're thinking you want sophisticated DSP, IMHO there is none better than Genelec's GLM. Get 8330A or 8340A speakers and GLM Kit and run the calibration cycle with GRADE report selected. There's a sample GRADE report on the Genelec website.

If you'd prefer a simpler approach, 8030C or 8040B speakers, a UMIK-1 mic, and REW software along with Genelec's how-to video goes a long way.

 

[barry59]

thanks all for thoughts/advise....to close the loop, and kind of a "Things I Learned Today" moment, above I mentioned that I had the level on the T7V's at 0, when in fact I had it set to +18. When I first set them up out of the box, the 0 setting was quiet, too quiet. So, for S's and G's, I set it to 0 and increased the volume through the DAC. It made a big difference, to the point I understand why these T7V's are highly regarded. Low end sounded more than adequate, and the boxiness that I was attributing to the left and right being close to the walls disappeared, both near field and mid field. Bottom line, (for the moment ) the Genelec itch is not going to get scratched.