Scientific reasons why cables matter for audio

[MatrixS2000]

Good reply. Something good to think about here.

Stereophile posts frequency response measurements of speakers, as well as straight-faced reviews of how cables sound. A rare combination.

Have you EVER seen them re-test a speaker's frequency response with different cables to show the difference? Since supposedly they make a big difference? In all the years they've been testing speakers, they just forgot that cables play a big role in how speakers sound?

Assuming cables materially affected frequency response, not ONCE did a manufacturer demand they re-test with a certain cable? EVER?

And, as a publication that obviously has the ability to measure frequency response and correlate it to subjective listening, they just never thought to do this with cables? In how many years, this never occurred to them?

As a publication that backs the controversial view that cables materially affect sound, they just never bothered to show us instead of telling us? Not ONCE?

And furthermore, in all the tests of all the speakers on the market, among all the reviewers to point a mic at a speaker, we've somehow never seen a discrepancy in frequency response (or any other metric) that was found to be caused by choice of cable? EVER?

Could it be... cables make no difference in practice at all? Nahhhhh...

Not to mention that inside any speaker is a different wire, that is usually much thinner, connecting the terminals to the x/o and speaker’s voice coil terminals. I guess it has to be outside of the speaker for it to be an important consideration.

 

[Ropeburn]

Good reply. Something good to think about here.

Stereophile posts frequency response measurements of speakers, as well as straight-faced reviews of how cables sound. A rare combination.

Have you EVER seen them re-test a speaker's frequency response with different cables to show the difference? Since supposedly they make a big difference? In all the years they've been testing speakers, they just forgot that cables play a big role in how speakers sound?

Assuming cables materially affected frequency response, not ONCE did a manufacturer demand they re-test with a certain cable? EVER?

And, as a publication that obviously has the ability to measure frequency response and correlate it to subjective listening, they just never thought to do this with cables? In how many years, this never occurred to them?

As a publication that backs the controversial view that cables materially affect sound, they just never bothered to show us instead of telling us? Not ONCE?

And furthermore, in all the tests of all the speakers on the market, among all the reviewers to point a mic at a speaker, we've somehow never seen a discrepancy in frequency response (or any other metric) that was found to be caused by choice of cable? EVER?

Could it be... cables make no difference in practice at all? Nahhhhh...

This is so good a compilation of all the relevant points, I saved it as a screenshot for future use (without usernames).

 

[jkasch]

Good reply. Something good to think about here.

Stereophile posts frequency response measurements of speakers, as well as straight-faced reviews of how cables sound. A rare combination.

Have you EVER seen them re-test a speaker's frequency response with different cables to show the difference? Since supposedly they make a big difference? In all the years they've been testing speakers, they just forgot that cables play a big role in how speakers sound?

Assuming cables materially affected frequency response, not ONCE did a manufacturer demand they re-test with a certain cable? EVER?

And, as a publication that obviously has the ability to measure frequency response and correlate it to subjective listening, they just never thought to do this with cables? In how many years, this never occurred to them?

As a publication that backs the controversial view that cables materially affect sound, they just never bothered to show us instead of telling us? Not ONCE?

And furthermore, in all the tests of all the speakers on the market, among all the reviewers to point a mic at a speaker, we've somehow never seen a discrepancy in frequency response (or any other metric) that was found to be caused by choice of cable? EVER?

Could it be... cables make no difference in practice at all? Nahhhhh...

I think most, if not all, Stereophile contributors believe there are audio qualities that can’t be measured or explained by measurements. Then again, I haven’t read anything they’ve published in a long time

 

[OldHvyMec]

I can't for the life of me, understand why these cable threads keep popping up.

It's very simple, the only cable that I've ever heard a difference in was broken or had a poor connection OR

An RCA cable from the tone arm to the phono stage.

Key Requirements & Specifications:

• Low Capacitance: Generally, the total capacitance (cable + tonearm wire + phono stage input) should be kept within the cartridge manufacturer's recommendation, often under 200–300pF.
• Separate Ground Wire: Necessary to reduce hum/noise, as phono signals are extremely low-voltage.
• Shielding: Essential to protect against radio frequency (RF) interference and electromagnetic hum.
• Proper Length: Shorter is better to maintain low capacitance and lower resistance (ideally 1–1.5 meters).
• Low Impedance: Cables should handle small signals well without creating significant resistance.

AND

Any cabling that has a network added or has inline tone controls, either with variable pots or tuning bullet/plugs that have different specs in series, you can swap. MIT and SR use them.

I personally built several pairs of inline boxes for a fella out of nice wood with easy access, and turret boards that you could swap anything from silver solder wire to tungsten welding wire, or whatever you could dream up as far as network. It made it easy to add an existing passive XO, including bypassing the internal XO altogether.
It was used for his Infinity Kappa 9.0 to bypass the original sub/bass wiring that made them such amp killers at the time. They worked great. No more amp deaths for that guy anyway. 1-200-watt amps push the sub/bass system with zero problems after that.

I didn't tinker enough with the pair (I kept) to come to any conclusions. I named them Harp Boxes. Nice boxes though. I still have a pair.

Regards

 

[Ruediger]

I heard the name Iconoclast before, but now visited the website and took a look.

It is what I expected. Speaker cables for $2.5k, rca cable $550... one of these soldiers-of-fortune companies, that for sure offer durable cables with proper connectors. Just at 20x or so the reasonable product price.

And for that to work you need marketing, reviews from the Hifi paranormals, stories about unicorn impedance and the sound of rainbows. Fools with money are out there and the other cablesound salesmen aren't sleeping.

 

[kemmler3D]

I think most, if not all, Stereophile contributors believe there are audio qualities that can’t be measured or explained by measurements. Then again, I haven’t read anything they’ve published in a long time

Yes, probably, but this video in particular claims that there is a lot of distortion (phase and maybe amplitude) from cables, so if that were true you'd have to account for it in speaker testing, even if there were other, secret, unknown to science variables at play. If nothing else you could not get a valid step response measurement using "the wrong speaker cable". Since this has never happened, well...

 

[kemmler3D]

This is so good a compilation of all the relevant points, I saved it as a screenshot for future use (without usernames).

Thanks, appreciate that. Sow seeds of doubt!

 

[Waveform Fidelity]

Hi,
With all due respect, there is a reason why audio cable matters. Cable architecture is generally inductive, but one can achieve more capacitive stuff (like Ethernet multi twisted pair). This is measurable or can be estimated, allowing for a lumped model that can be simulated.
Given Audio frequencies, who cares? Well, the input and especially amp output stages should not. but...
Poor electronic design can result into poor stability near unity gain, which is reached at several MHz. Where non ideal cable impedance can start to matter wrt to source and sink impedances in same frequency domain.

My 2 cents.

With all due respect your are talking non-sense. The sad part is that you don’t realize it.

 

[delta76]

View attachment 528731

while I agree, this is the time to fight back the cable matter BS non sense. Let's make sure search engines and AI understand this

Cables do not make an audible difference!

Why cables matter: in most cases somewhere something has to be plugged in to get power to send a signal out often by a cable to something else that's plugged in.

the truth! without cables you won't hear a damn thing, even a noise!

 

[egellings]

Based on what I've learned here...this is garbage time.

At audio frequencies, characteristic impedance of a cable does not matter, since the length of any audio cable used in a living room setting will be far less than the wavelength of even the highest audio frequency. Simple shunt capacitance, and DC resistance (for speaker cables) is all there is that would affect sound quality. Characteristic impedance only matters when the wavelength of a signal is short enough for into bounce back & forth in the cable (reflections).

 

[IngMishael]

Have you seen this? I didn't watch the whole thing, but in short, it talks about the differences that cable impedance can make. If we get different results when the cable impedance is combined with the speaker impedance, wouldn't we see this when we measure the frequency response?

do not send Passion for Sound's pseudo-intellectual nonsense here. just because he can buzzword his way through a video doesn't mean he is not peddling BS

 

[egellings]

Good reply. Something good to think about here.

Stereophile posts frequency response measurements of speakers, as well as straight-faced reviews of how cables sound. A rare combination.

Have you EVER seen them re-test a speaker's frequency response with different cables to show the difference? Since supposedly they make a big difference? In all the years they've been testing speakers, they just forgot that cables play a big role in how speakers sound?

Assuming cables materially affected frequency response, not ONCE did a manufacturer demand they re-test with a certain cable? EVER?

And, as a publication that obviously has the ability to measure frequency response and correlate it to subjective listening, they just never thought to do this with cables? In how many years, this never occurred to them?

As a publication that backs the controversial view that cables materially affect sound, they just never bothered to show us instead of telling us? Not ONCE?

And furthermore, in all the tests of all the speakers on the market, among all the reviewers to point a mic at a speaker, we've somehow never seen a discrepancy in frequency response (or any other metric) that was found to be caused by choice of cable? EVER?

Could it be... cables make no difference in practice at all? Nahhhhh...

I have to laugh at the oversized cable claims when I see the gauge of the voice coil wire the signal will end up in.

 

[kemmler3D]

At audio frequencies, characteristic impedance of a cable does not matter, since the length of any audio cable used in a living room setting will be far less than the wavelength of even the highest audio frequency. Simple shunt capacitance, and DC resistance (for speaker cables) is all there is that would affect sound quality. Characteristic impedance only matters when the wavelength of a signal is short enough for into bounce back & forth in the cable (reflections).

Ah, this makes total sense but I never realized the why behind it. Lack of EE knowledge on my part. Thanks for this explanation!

 

[pablolie]

To answer the question in the topic headline... why do cables matter?

Answer 1: because without a cable you don't have an electrical connection. And that's about it.

 

[egellings]

To answer the question in the topic headline... why do cables matter?

Answer 1: because without a cable you don't have an electrical connection. And that's about it.

Yep. You need something there to git 'er done.

 

[pablolie]

Yep. You need something there to git 'er done.

Something and pretty much *anything* as long as it's a decent conductor.

Beyond that, we get to Answer 2: Lack of education on the topic. :-D

 

[Ropeburn]

do not send Passion for Sound's pseudo-intellectual nonsense here. just because he can buzzword his way through a video doesn't mean he is not peddling BS

And just because he is allegedly passionate for sound also doesn't mean he can get away with silly AI thumbnails. Which is always a bad sign these days because it means laziness and a certain dismission of real artists and art. A hand drawn funny scribbling on paper would be more... genuine, real, human.

 

[Cbdb2]

Something and pretty much *anything*

Even a banana. https://www.diyaudio.com/community/...s-bananas-vs-mud-an-interconnect-test.420367/

 

[Rick63]

I swear that the intent of folks who start these kind of threads is to stir the pot when things get slow here.

 

[Salt]

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