Scientific reasons why cables matter for audio

[Audiofire]

I have just glanced at the video this morning. Among other things, Lachlan approved of the comment that I referred to here in my initial post (with the flies part now edited out), and that, among other things, still declares "naysayers" to be people who "spew attacks on the character, ethics and motivation" of others, who, by nature, "belittle that which they can't have or can't afford," and who "just have no class in life and ignorance is bliss." Coming, by the way, from someone who gives a clear name and purports to be "Sales Director, Iconoclast Cables." Can't go wrong with that kind of marketing. Ironically and unironically, by the way.

Ad hominem, zero science given to support expensive cables. We are implicitly informed Iconoclast Cables is a waste of time.
Ancient wisdom (including the life of Diogenes) revealed well that love of money is the mother of all evil.

 

[wwenze]

You raise an excellent point. Why hasn't biwiring for power delivery caught on? After all, what is AC mains power but a robust 60 Hz (or 50 Hz, depending on one's location) analog audio signal?

Opportunity awaits the truly innovative entrepreneur.

Why stop at 2?

 

[fpitas]

View attachment 558236



Why stop at 2?

View attachment 558234
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A classic case of "be careful what you wish for"

 

[Audiofire]

Litz cable doubling down on ignorance by causing parasitic capacitance

 

[DonH56]

Why stop at 2?

View attachment 558234

Just to pick one, 20 AWG cross-sectional area is 0.518 mm2 so four wires have a combined area of 2.072 mm2. A single 12 AWG wire's area is 3.31 mm2 thus 60% greater. Litz structure at audio frequencies is irrelevant, even more so for a power cable, so struggling to see why a regular old 12 AWG power cable would not be a better choice. Not even going to bother with the nonsense in the other marketing pictures.

 

[arqwfxdv]

FYI:

And I asked there:

Dear Galen Gareis: If you could just ... please, please and please with a cherry on top ... provide a set of measurements, an APx Dashboard would make me the happiest person on the planet, I will be your slave forever.This will be the only post I make in this video.

 

[arqwfxdv]

Your username is more interesting than the video. Does "arqwfxdv" mean anything or are those just random letters?

It's the English translation of the French "vdxfwqra" . Or it's just random letters, identical to my random letters on YouTube. I never really found out.

 

[egellings]

Naim Audio used to specify their amplifiers required specific speaker cables and a specific minimum length because their amplifier output stage design used the physical speaker wire as an electrical component to maintain stability.

Don't think this is the case anymore, but was certainly a thing when I had Naim equipment.

Nothing like outsourcing the completion of the design of the amplifier for stability, hey?

 

[egellings]

Just to pick one, 20 AWG cross-sectional area is 0.518 mm2 so four wires have a combined area of 2.072 mm2. A single 12 AWG wire's area is 3.31 mm2 thus 60% greater. Litz structure at audio frequencies is irrelevant, even more so for a power cable, so struggling to see why a regular old 12 AWG power cable would not be a better choice. Not even going to bother with the nonsense in the other marketing pictures.

Such thick wire for the last 6 feet or so, when the house wiring leading up to it is so much thinner.

 

[WeekendWarrior]

Nothing like outsourcing the completion of the design of the amplifier for stability, hey?

I had the original Nait 1 back in the day, and bought their NAC A4 cable which was fine as it was relatively inexpensive and certainly good quality. The explanation was that they eschwewd components on the output to stabilise the circuit, and relied on the speaker cable to do this, because it sounded better this way.

Don't know if this was snake oil or not, but at the time didn't want to risk it with my pride and joy.

 

[rcstevensonaz]

Such thick wire for the last 6 feet or so, when the house wiring leading up to it is so much thinner.

Sure, there is a small stream on one side (thin wiring) and a wide river (thick power cord) on the other.

The key here is that the electrical outlet box functions as a reservoir. It holds back a vast amount of electricity, that can then be then allowed flow down to the device — through the very thick power cord — with full force and unimpeded power. Bounded only by the upper limit of the circuit breaker (or device fuse).

 

[Mnyb]

I had the original Nait 1 back in the day, and bought their NAC A4 cable which was fine as it was relatively inexpensive and certainly good quality. The explanation was that they eschwewd components on the output to stabilise the circuit, and relied on the speaker cable to do this, because it sounded better this way.

Don't know if this was snake oil or not, but at the time didn't want to risk it with my pride and joy.

It was probably for the best , sound quality nah , amp stability and not blowing up yes there is small zobel network on most amps output, they probably omitted that because ”prat” or something?

 

[Cbdb2]

We can just post the video here, you know

Quick summary: dude got some expensive Iconoclast cables, mumbles a bit about “science” then concludes that that why they sound better.

On one hand, he argued about measurable differences, while in the next minutes claiming things are not. He’s basically listing a bunch of supposed engineering advantages of the cables, and then making up some allegedly audible differences from it. It’s very clear he doesn’t understand the science, nor simple logical reasoning. The whole video is one massive non sequitur.

And incidentally:

Belden ICONOCLAST XLR Cable Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the ICONOCLAST XLR by Belden (manufactured by Blue Jeans Cable). Tested sample costs US $785 for 6 foot length: I ordered a pair of XLR and RCA cables from the company. They nicely intercepted my order and asked if intended to review them. When I...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Well, hes right. The cables make as big a difference as a new DAC.... none.

 

[Cbdb2]

Yes for power. Not so much for information.

I once had a experience with glass fiber.

Back when I was just out of college looking for a real job I had an interview at Corning. They had a pilot machine about the size of a large desk. The machine was really complicated looking, very highly instrumented, and had a reel on one side that was winding up a fine glass fiber.

They started describing the mechanics of what they were doing with the fiber and asking me questions about the process to check my ability to understand the technology.

Eventually I went home, and later got a rejection letter. No big deal at the time, I found a good job elsewhere.

A few years later when I started hearing about glass fiber and lasers for high speed data transmission I realized what I had seen was the first commercial process for production of fiber optic data cable.

Now there are more than 3 billion miles of this stuff winding around the planet. And I had missed out on getting in on the ground floor of one of the most important inventions of the 20th century.

Shucks.

Ild bet theres a lot more copper data (CAT) cables worldwide.

 

[egellings]

Sure, there is a small stream on one side (thin wiring) and a wide river (thick power cord) on the other.

The key here is that the electrical outlet box functions as a reservoir. It holds back a vast amount of electricity, that can then be then allowed flow down to the device — through the very thick power cord — with full force and unimpeded power. Bounded only by the upper limit of the circuit breaker (or device fuse).

The outlet box is not a reservoir; it is simply a box with connectors in it. There is no storage of any kind in it. The electrical grid is not really a reservoir either, since it relies on continuous generation of electricity. Shut the generator (it's not a reservoir, either) off, and y'all gits no 'lectric. A reservoir is a holder of a quantity of something, like water, as an example. Best examples of an electrical reservoir I can think of would be a capacitor, and also a battery.

 

[rcstevensonaz]

The outlet box is not a reservoir; it is simply a box with connectors in it.

Thank you for the compliment. You made my day! (And as an aside, a smily face at the end of something so incredibly stupid is typically a hint it was a joke... in this case, riffing off of the concept of the thin side being like an upstream creek and the thick side being a downstream river when the water is released.)

 

[NTK]

Thank you for the compliment. You made my day! (And as an aside, a smily face at the end of something so incredibly stupid is typically a hint it was a joke... in this case, riffing off of the concept of the thin side being like an upstream creek and the thick side being a downstream river when the water is released.)

Ha ha! Poe's law strikes again

 

[fpitas]

Sure, there is a small stream on one side (thin wiring) and a wide river (thick power cord) on the other.

The key here is that the electrical outlet box functions as a reservoir. It holds back a vast amount of electricity, that can then be then allowed flow down to the device — through the very thick power cord — with full force and unimpeded power. Bounded only by the upper limit of the circuit breaker (or device fuse).

Well done. All the snakes are running for their lives!

 

[rcstevensonaz]

Ha ha! Poe's law strikes again

Since my humor runs on the very dry side, I tend to be Poe's punching bag!

 

[rcstevensonaz]

All the snakes are running for their lives!

The scary thing is that I have seen conversations related to audio-grade outlet boxes; most typically with an emphasis on purchasing hospital-grade outlet boxes.

Even more scary, I almost fell for it when we did a major remodel to our house that added a home office & media room about a decade ago.