Schitt Sol Turntable

[watchnerd]

Given Schiits product line, and how they offer the same gear with optional tubes sticking out of the top for x-tra dollars, if this Sol thing catches fire (figuratively speaking, of course) I'm thinking the company ought to release a version with tubes sticking out of the top. The toobs wouldn't even have to do anything. Just be there. For emotional support.

I though it was discontinued / "in beta" due to QC reasons?

 

[majingotan]

That's about it. Oh. I forgot. The biggest difference between the two brands is that Michiko Ogawa and Sara Ott look a lot better than the Full of Schiit guys. That alone would make me pull the trigger for the Technics, all other things being equal.

Pretty much why Chinese/Asian ads of their DACs, amps, DAPs, IEMs always have attractive women as their models. Shame that MQA is spelled as "MAQ" on their DAP lol.

 

[Frank Dernie]

These are the differences as I find them:

Technics has an integrated phono stage. Sol plus their phono stage is going to match the price of the Technics, maybe a hundred dollars less. With free shipping from a place like Crutchfield, and not having to pay return freight and stocking fees if you don't like it, any price difference might be a wash.

Technics uses an Ortofon, Sol ships with either a Grado or AT. My guess is that either a lower end Grado or AT will perform (sound) better than the Ortofon Red, but it's just a guess on my part. At this price point it could be a toss up.

Sol has a modernist tinker-toy industrial look about it which could appeal to some buyers. Technics has that '70s 'traditional' Japanese look which could appeal to some buyers.

Unipivot tonearms are often flaky to set up, and wonky. Unipivots in general have that going for them. I don't know about the Sol, but it's a unipiviot. The Technics gimbal supported arm is going to be a lot easier to set up/change cartridges. On the other hand, Sol offers replaceable arm wands if one has to change cartridges. Not as quick as headshells, but it's there. Headshells are generally a lot cheaper to stock than tonearm wands. Sol uses carbon fiber, Technics aluminum.

Quartz PLL direct drive is going to be much more precise than belt drive, but not as simple to effect. However, in actual practice it might be difficult to hear a rotational artifact (wow/flutter) from either, if both are on speed. Sol uses a high speed motor with belt reduction to achieve rotational stability. The Technics motor is connected to the platter and turns at the selected speed.

You get 78rpm with Technics. Unless you are a 78 collector, the higher speed will only be used for using a Discwasher brush real fast.

Technics has no suspension to speak of. Sol uses a spider assembly that appears to be somewhat damped. Both should probably be kept away from acoustic and mechanical vibration.

If you want to play the mod game, KAB makes an aftermarket fluid damper for the Technics--resistive silicon gunk trough with paddle, located at the pivot. Oil damping was often standard with unipivots back in the day (Formula 4, Ultracraft, Micro, etc.). Sol doesn't look to be damped.

Sol evidently has adjustable arm height during play. This particular Technics offers arm height adjustment, but not during play. I believe Technics uses a simple set screw, and not the rotational collar adjustment of the SL-1200 series.

Sol is manual. Technics offers end of record lift, but I've read reviews indicating that this feature is not always reliable. I've also read that the Technics cueing system is not very smooth. Don't know about the Sol.

Technics is made in Malaysia. Sol is made in the USA. If you require warranty service, my guess is that the Full of Schiit guys will interact with you better than Panasonic. Never attempt to interact with a large multinational. You'll be wasting your time, and time is too valuable a commodity to waste. Instead, make sure you have a reputable dealer if you buy Technics. [edit: FWIW I own two Technics turntables--SL-1100a from 1975 and SL-1200 Mk5 from 2005. Both work like new. Whether the Malaysian Tehnics product is as well built or will last as long? YMMV. I also own a couple of Schiit electronic products that appear to be well built for the dollar--headphone amp and DAC.]

Technics comes with a dustcover with that cool looking bubble over the arm.

That's about it. Oh. I forgot. The biggest difference between the two brands is that Michiko Ogawa and Sara Ott look a lot better than the Full of Schiit guys. That alone would make me pull the trigger for the Technics, all other things being equal.

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Frankly, the Sol was started by people who had no idea about what they were doing. it was a project from the outset for anybody who knows about record players. I was gobsmacked how clueless they were and how absent their understanding of the fundamental physics was and their obvious lack of foresight in the manufacturing side.
Technics know what they are doing from a concept and manufacturing side.
They are about 10,000 times more competent in this arena than Schiit showed themselves to me.
Mind you it seems plenty of people believe their meandering BS.

Did I mention ?

 

[thefsb]

I don't own any Schitt products but I’m really glad to see them own up to a mistake and not pussy foot around trying to offer “credit” or vouchers but a full refund.

It's the right thing to do.

Nothing more can be asked of any company.

Yes it can.

 

[watchnerd]

Pretty much why Chinese/Asian ads of their DACs, amps, DAPs, IEMs always have attractive women as their models. Shame that MQA is spelled as "MAQ" on their DAP lol.

They're business women, not models.

And it's not an ad.

I don't this is an example of using sex to sell.

 

[anmpr1]

They're business women, not models.

Ms. Ogawa is evidently a Panasonic employee, and has been for a while. As far as I can tell Ott is there as a 'brand representative'. Someone paid just to be there.

Pretty much why Chinese/Asian ads of their DACs, amps, DAPs, IEMs always have attractive women as their models.

In China you see a lot of 'brand ambassadors' at product showings--again, having nothing to do with the product but hired because they are well known and attractive. For a 'sophisticated and elegant' look it might be a middle age TV actress such as Ma Yili or Yuan Quan; if it's something appealing to the younger set then it might possibly be Angelababy or Yang Mi. I don't follow it that closely as far as the current names. The biggest draw up until a few years ago was Fan Bingbing, but Miss Fan was caught illegally double dipping in the reimbursement department, and the Party quickly put a stop to that. So she's been laying pretty low. Not sure if/when she'll be able to make a comeback.

In any case this sort of advertising/branding would not work for a company like Schiit. At least in China. No famous Chinese model/actress would want to be associated with a name like that once they were informed what it meant in translation. Besides, how could Schiit compete with Topping in the technical excellence department? It would be a lost cause for them, over there.

For the visually inclined, below is a pic of Ma Yili and Yuan Quan. Just to keep it in perspective.

 

[anmpr1]

Frankly, the Sol was started by people who had no idea about what they were doing

Are you saying that the Sol isn't the F1 of turntables?

Maybe the 24 Hours of Lemons is more its speed.

https://24hoursoflemons.com/

 

[mhardy6647]

if this Sol thing catches fire (figuratively speaking, of course)

I see what you did there.

I'm thinking the company ought to release a version with tubes sticking out of the top. The toobs wouldn't even have to do anything. Just be there. For emotional support.

This makes sense since Schiit appears to be going for the erswhile Dynaco market, and Dyna was known as the 'poor man's McInstosh'. Schiit could then compete with the latest and greatest McIntosh lifestyle product--Mac's record player with the green tubes on top. LOL

<said with a cheezy, tweedy ersatz Oxonian or Cantabrigian accent>

Yes. Yes. Quite.

 

[617]

I don't mess around with turntables much but the sheer amount of engineering in a 1200 embarrasses most budget turntables. How much do they want for a mdf plinth? The Technics is a huge aluminum casting bolted to an incredibly heavy rubbery plastic base. The tonearm looks old fashioned but it is a dream to use. The speed control is rock solid and easy to set. There is no bullshit tomfoolery on these things. Aside from the dust covers. Seriously, look at and feel the threaded vta adjustment and the little machined channel for your fingers, it's a dream. And we're supposed to believe a tonearm with strings and magnets is high end??

These high end 70s and 80s era Japanese turntables from Technics, Denon, Micro Seiki and Sony would be my first choice if I was looking to get into vinyl seriously. I might consider a Thorens, but not much else.

 

[anmpr1]

These high end 70s and 80s era Japanese turntables from Technics, Denon, Micro Seiki and Sony would be my first choice if I was looking to get into vinyl seriously.

And we're supposed to believe a tonearm with strings and magnets is high end??

'70s Japanese designs had the benefit of a large engineering staff and manufacturing skill. Production costs could be amortized down because they made tens of thousands of units over exceedingly large price points. The current SL-1200 is certainly more sophisticated than the SL-1200 Mk X, but the price differential is huge. I paid $500.00 for mine in 2005. Panasonic is asking upward of $4000.00 for the new model. Their DJ oriented Mk8 is more pedestrian, but will still set you back a Grover Cleveland.

SL-1600 seems to me to be a good all-around value that is probably going to last a lifetime (if their previous models are any indication of longevity). Obviously their latest and greatest SL-1000 plays in a different universe.

My big concern with vintage Japanese decks from Sony/Denon/JVC is the longevity of those models' electronic tonearms... the so-called Biotracer/servo arms. If it broke I don't know if it would be easily fixable.

Magnets have a history. Stanton's Gyropoise turntable featured a magnetic platter bearing said to minimize rotational friction. I never saw one but heard it was flaky in actual use.

A clever tonearm was made in New York, in the mid '60s--the Castagna (see below). Ridiculously expensive for the day, it featured a magnetic pivot suspension with precision jewel ball bearings. Sao Win used it for his last turntable in the '80s. He must have found some NOS boxes in a warehouse. In another thread, Frank Durnie reminded me that a top of the line'60s era Garrard tonearm used jewel pivot bearings. Techincs used ruby bearings in their EPA-100 arms; word on the street said they were very fragile and prone to fracture.

I have an early '70s Garrard record changer with magnetic anti-skating. I suppose the magnets still function as intended--I've read they weaken with age but I have no way nor any desire to check that out. I once owned a Thorens TD-160 that had magnetic anti-skating (if I remember correctly).

 

[mannye]

I’ve been back and forth on the whole “which turntable” thing.

For 20 years I’ve been perfectly happy with my Music Hall MMF-5 purchased new in late 1999 or early 2000 don’t really remember. It’s the original model with the matte vinyl over MDF plinth and the 115v AC motor. Later versions came with a 16v DC motor.

Most important, the included cart was a Goldring 1012GX which to my ears mates perfectly with the Pro-Ject arm that came with the turntable.

After spending a considerable amount of time thinking about what to get now that I’m in the market for a new turntable. I was stuck between vintage (Yamaha 2000-GT) or new (Technics 1200G).

I don’t want to fiddle around with my turntable anymore. I want to set it up, maybe roll some carts until I find one I like then be done. So for me it will be the 1200G.

With a lower 800-1000 range budget, I would pick the lower end Technics which will probably punch above its weight in sound and last a very long time.

Vintage is fun and cool, but only if you enjoy fiddling and/or have the budget to spend in restoration/repair.

 

[anmpr1]

1) After spending a considerable amount of time thinking about what to get now that I’m in the market for a new turntable. I was stuck between vintage (Yamaha 2000-GT)...

2) Vintage is fun and cool, but only if you enjoy fiddling and/or have the budget to spend in restoration/repair.

1) For reasons that I will never hope to understand, the latest and greatest Yamaha GT turntable tonearm has no offset. Is this supposed to be engineered?

https://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio_visual/hifi_components/gt-5000/index.html

2) Manual turntables are the simplest, and are easier to troubleshoot. Some old Garrard automatics seem to last forever. Of course by now they need to be cleaned and you sometimes can't easily find idler reduction wheels--but the originals tend to last a long time. Once you get into the 'high tech' Sony/JVC/Denon decks (with magnetic speed control and motorized tonearms) YMMV.

 

[ribosradagast]

So for me it will be the 1200G.

Out of curiosity, what made you disqualify the 1200GR? It seems a decent option for people without deep pockets

 

[mannye]

Out of curiosity, what made you disqualify the 1200GR? It seems a decent option for people without deep pockets

Just that I figure that the G is about as close to a “halo” product as I can get with my analog source and my budget. The next step up is the SP-10r and that’s out of my budget range.

I know that with the G I can keep upgrading the downstream components and cart and probably not have the source be the limiting factor. At least not at my budget levels.

That said, I will be auditioning both turntables side by side and who knows?

 

[ribosradagast]

Just that I figure that the G is about as close to a “halo” product as I can get with my analog source and my budget. The next step up is the SP-10r and that’s out of my budget range.

I know that with the G I can keep upgrading the downstream components and cart and probably not have the source be the limiting factor. At least not at my budget levels.

That said, I will be auditioning both turntables side by side and who knows?

Thanks for reporting back. I was almost sold on the GR, but now that they scratched my itch for an all black GR, I'm going to spring for that one.

I would be extremely interested if you can hear a difference between the two of them though!

 

[mannye]

1) For reasons that I will never hope to understand, the latest and greatest Yamaha GT turntable tonearm has no offset. Is this supposed to be engineered?

The GT-5000 is unfortunately nothing like the direct drive monster of a turntable that came before it. In my opinion, at least from the optics, it seems like a quick hit to capitalize on the success of the re-introduction of the SL-1200 and "vinyl-hysteria" in general. It's a belt-drive masquerading as a legendary DD.

Of course, I haven't HEARD the thing, so it might be amazing. It might actually be 3000 times better that the previous DD GT-2000! I'm not a fan boy of either belt drive or direct drive so it doesn't matter to me. I'm just saying it LOOKS like a marketing product rather than a serious attempt to revive a classic product.

 

[mannye]

Thanks for reporting back. I was almost sold on the GR, but now that they scratched my itch for an all black GR, I'm going to spring for that one.

I would be extremely interested if you can hear a difference between the two of them though!

Me too! I don't doubt that both will last at least as long as the previous iterations, maybe even longer. So it might come down to investing more in the cart and less on the table... to be frank, I've never really like the way the SL-1200 tables look! IMO they look more at home in a professional setting (DJ booth or radio studio) than a home, but I have always liked the way they sound and the "set it and forget it" aspect that comes with DD tables.

Shopping for a turntable is the most frustrating and the most fun part of audio equipment shopping. I have a budget of up to $1200 for the cart, but I hope something in the $500-700 range works. My ear likes the higher end Goldring MM carts which are in that range.

 

[gmsingh123]

I have a pretty darn tweako turntable (Michell Gyro SE, also very cat unfriendly) but there were a few things about the Sol design I found puzzling:

-With an outboard motor with no speed control, why are the wall wart and motor plugged into the TT itself, instead of just plugging the wall wart straight into the motor?

-Why the need to hand start the platter? Sounds like the motor is very low torque?


If you have a GyroDec you might have seen or heard about Nottingham Analogue, they require the platter to be push started too. There is a school of thought that says low torque motors provide the best sound.

 

[Frank Dernie]

A low torque motor with a high inertia platter may be a choice if the motor does not have particularly constant torque and several makers have taken this route.
If the motor is very smooth one can get away with a high torque motor and low inertia platter to give fast startup, decks for broadcast are like this.
There is everything in between too.
As ever it will be the quality of the concept and detail design which is important, things like this tend to be give a unique marketing feature rather than a breakthrough technical concept IME.

 

[Matt Diploma]

People here really do like to shit on the Schiit, don't they?

The goal of the turntable was to make the absolute best sounding turntable they could at the price point while allowing for a long path of upgradeability when it comes to phono stages and cartridges. Of course it isn't going to be as easy to use as other turntables. It was never meant to be for those new to vinyl, although now they include a cartridge which I personally think is a little silly. Sure, it'd be easier to just buy a Pro-Ject or a Rega, but for those wanting to get the best sound out of records as we can for our money, this product is here for us. Does Rega or Pro-Ject have on-the-fly VTA adjustment on their $800 turntables? Azimuth adjustment? Nope. An eleven inch tonearm to minimize tracking distortion? Nah.

If you don't want to take the time to learn why Schiit has all these adjustments, I don't blame you. It's rewarding, but obviously much more work than buying a $500 turntable and letting that be the end of it. That doesn't make the product garbage though. Now that Schiit has put the Sol back up on their website (it's been up for months) and they've fixed the old issues, it's incredible value for the dollar.