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Schiit Saga Grounding and Hum Issues?

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amirm

amirm

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Quick search indeed shows the problem and dangerous fix:

1538097999557.png
 
OP
amirm

amirm

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All this direct selling straight from websites, all over the world, is resulting in stuff like this and some of awfully bad Chinese stuff we are seeing.
Schiit is an American company. So far I have seen better from major Chinese companies.
 

garbulky

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What you need to do is ask Schiit if they think these pictures represent proper manufacturing of their product or not. You are active in a forum where they participate and would read your posts. Are you willing to do so?

If Schiit wants to test the product then that is great and is what I wished they would have done when the owner asked. They need to fetch his machine free of charge and get it for testing in California and not some distributor in Europe.

We are dealing with serious safety and performance issues here. This is no place for debating tactics such as you practicing on me.
I suggest you ask them the questions you would like. You are after all accusing them of a bad product, not me. Amazon sells a multimeter for $8.40 plus it comes with a 5% off coupon. Perhaps the gentleman would use one? Schiit;s warranty service with him isn't my business. So I don't really care that they want to ship back a 6 pound unit because he says it hums. That's the cost of buying overseas.

I won't discount that the unit ground could be defectively done like in the Jot. That is a signficant issue that Schiit needs to address - IF - that is the case. But we'd never know because nobody stuck a multimeter on it.
Though I have never owned the Saga (or any Schiit product), I have listened to it. I thought it sounded okay. There was no hum. It colored the sound less than some preamps I've heard though I felt the tube mode did, uh, "tube" things up in the treble. Not my cup of tea and I preferred the sound of my DC-1 direct to my amps.
 

derp1n

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Schiit;s warranty service with him isn't my business.
In fact, none of it is your business. Yet here you are defending Schiit products again and making statements far outside your field of understanding.
 

garbulky

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In fact, none of it is your business. Yet here you are defending Schiit products again and making statements far outside your field of understanding.
Eh? My business is what I make it. I'm surprised nobody else is asking for it to be tested with a multimeter before taking it as gospel. Amir tested the Jot with a multimeter and he PROVED that there was an issue. Hence Schiit acknowledged it and said they'd fixed it. If they did or not, I got no clue.
 
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amirm

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I suggest you ask them the questions you would like.
I have. They chose to ban me from their thread and hence any discussion with them. They are welcome to join this forum and have a conversation as they do in other forums. They have chosen not to do that.

And as I mentioned, I encouraged the owner to contact Schiit and only after they gave him the cold shoulder I decided to post it here.

I am doing all the work here. You seem uninterested to make just one post asking them about it.

You are after all accusing them of a bad product, not me.
Nonsense. These are statements of facts, coming on the heels of another one of their products with identical problem.

I am here to get action on behalf of a frustrated owner that wants resolution to his hum problem. He contacted Schiit and they did not care. So I am helping raise awareness as I did with Jotunheim to see if we can get a solution.

Amazon sells a multimeter for $8.40 plus it comes with a 5% off coupon. Perhaps the gentleman would use one?
He has it and has used it. He can't go any further as I cannot advise him to modify the mains wiring. We have gone back and forth for a couple of weeks behind scenes with me trying to help him. For heaven's sake, the company should be doing this, not me. I am not their support line.

Your posts are a disservice to owners of Schiit products. Unless we raise the quality bar, they will continue to build subpar equipment.
 

derp1n

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Eh? My business is what I make it. I'm surprised nobody else is asking for it to be tested with a multimeter before taking it as gospel. Amir tested the Jot with a multimeter and he PROVED that there was an issue. Hence Schiit acknowledged it and said they'd fixed it. If they did or not, I got no clue.
Yes, you pick and chose your trolling. We know. You're extremely obvious and embarrass yourself here regularly.

Nice spin, too. Schiit never acknowledged there was a process problem, only isolated issues. Jason claimed the devices are correctly grounded as part of the manufacturing process, yet they had no test procedure for this until after ASR made an issue out of it.
 

garbulky

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He has it and has used it.
What was the result? Does it show that the case is not grounded? Is he willing to post a picture of that. If he sends Schiit a picture of that, it shows a clear manufacturing defect, I think it would go a long way to covering his shipping.

Your posts are a disservice to owners of Schiit products. Unless we raise the quality bar, they will continue to build subpar equipment.
I don't see it that way, but I understand why you might. It looks like I come off as a shill for the company. I'm not trying to.

I'm not trying to hamper quality control. A multimeter showing no grounding is imo better evidence than "look the paint isn't buffed off enough" to make adequate contact. If you recall when you posted your multimeter picture of the jot, I posted and acknowledged that was an issue they need to fix.
 
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garbulky

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Yes, you pick and chose your trolling. We know.
I'm not trolling. At least not intentionally. This whole being called a troll experience doesn't happen to me at other forums.
Nice spin, too.
I wasn't trying to spin.
Jason's post which you linked: "none of the ones I've tested were like that. The paint is ground out of the chamfer during manufacturing specifically for that purpose.

In any case, the new test procedure checks for grounding in toto, and went into effect today. All shipping Jotunheims were checked and found to have proper grounding. Tomorrow we'll go through the rest of the stock just to be sure.

Again, if you have issues with your specific Jotunheim (or any other product), please contact us at [email protected] and we'll be happy to take care of it."
So there you go...that's what I read too. Take what you want from it. I think that response was appropriate. Just read Jason's post and not my "spin".
 
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TimW

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Noticed I had a hum coming from my tweeters a couple of weeks ago. I pulled my Schiit Saga out of that system along with a second amplifier I had connected and noticed the hum is gone. Thought it was because I had two amps stacked on top of each other but now I'm starting to think it was the Saga. Would check to see if the Saga is grounded but I lent it to someone.

At one point I had a stack of cheap Schiit and to simplify the power supply situation I bought the Schiit Floor Wart aka "Cthulu." One day I came home to the smell of hot plastic and after searching for a while saw a fog like smoke rolling off of the shelving holding my audio gear. After unplugging everything I found the smoldering hot Floor Wart smelled like Schiit and I threw it into my garage to cool off. I was really mad because if I hadn't been home that thing could have burnt my house down. Schiit paid for return shipping but all they said to console me was "We are sorry to hear what has happened." They still sell the stupid thing in their store.
 

watchnerd

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Noticed I had a hum coming from my tweeters a couple of weeks ago. I pulled my Schiit Saga out of that system along with a second amplifier I had connected and noticed the hum is gone. Thought it was because I had two amps stacked on top of each other but now I'm starting to think it was the Saga. Would check to see if the Saga is grounded but I lent it to someone.

At one point I had a stack of cheap Schiit and to simplify the power supply situation I bought the Schiit Floor Wart aka "Cthulu." One day I came home to the smell of hot plastic and after searching for a while saw a fog like smoke rolling off of the shelving holding my audio gear. After unplugging everything I found the smoldering hot Floor Wart smelled like Schiit and I threw it into my garage to cool off. I was really mad because if I hadn't been home that thing could have burnt my house down. Schiit paid for return shipping but all they said to console me was "We are sorry to hear what has happened." They still sell the stupid thing in their store.

LOL...

I'm sorry for your near tragedy, but your description really cracked me up.

Hmmm, I have a Mjolnir 2 and Freya sitting in my closet. Maybe I should check them.
 

valar_k

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sadly Schiit just told him to ship his unit at his expense to the European distributor. With round trip shipping expense becoming a substantial cost percentage of the cost of the unit, that is an improper burden on him. He is hearing hum in his unit and likes a resolution.

When my Jotunheim stopped turning on after ONE MONTH, they forced me to pay shipping at my expense to have it repaired. In total it took one month. Part of the delay was because their support form emailer script was broken on their site. When I said this, they (Jason) basically called me a liar on Headfi. When other people chimed in about it, he didn't even apologize and instead just said "ok I'll have our devs deal with" (link). I tried to be diplomatic in the HF thread but it was pretty bad.

People on Headfi told me I was an entitled brat for expected them to cover shipping on repairs for (in their words after repairs) a "compromised power rail" causing complete failure of the unit after a single damn month of ownership.

There's a reason people have been recognizing Schiit for the collection of dumpster fire humans they are, from the designers like Mike and Jason, to the support people like Nick, to the ones who assemble this crap.
 
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TimW

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With all of these issues I'm really starting to feel embarrassed for owning Schiit products. It's great that ASR is here to provide us with measurement based product reviews and recommendations. And a place to discuss real issues without being attacked by fans of a brand.
 

Wombat

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When the connection is made between scraped coated panels the connection has to be made by overcoming the two thicknesses of coating separating the panels by some mechanical pressure. Even then, the material(s) the panels are made from may not form satisfactory electrical contact over time.

Cheap and nasty method in the first place.
 

Thomas savage

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It seems as though Schiit has not got a tight hold on their manufacturing process, maybe they are busier than they ever thought and have expanded too quick , maybe they don’t have the right people in place to organise and maintain reliable systems within their business.

I’m afraid this is very normal in the audio industry ime

There’s a science behind manufacturing, and these type of companies just don’t have the personnel , expertise and infrastructure to operate properly.

They know this so what I find unforgivable is the type of service being described here when folks find these issues, the companies responsible should recognise their limits and build in measures in their customer service to deal with problems correctly .

There’s no excuse for this, not even the best commercial lawyers like @garbulky could excuse this lol
 

garbulky

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It seems as though Schiit has not got a tight hold on their manufacturing process, maybe they are busier than they ever thought and have expanded too quick , maybe they don’t have the right people in place to organise and maintain reliable systems within their business.

I’m afraid this is very normal in the audio industry ime

There’s a science behind manufacturing, and these type of companies just don’t have the personnel , expertise and infrastructure to operate properly.

They know this so what I find unforgivable is the type of service being described here when folks find these issues, the companies responsible should recognise their limits and build in measures in their customer service to deal with problems correctly .

There’s no excuse for this, not even the best commercial lawyers like @garbulky could excuse this lol
I agree. Though I'm sure they have their reasons. I think the right way for internet companies to operate, at least in audio is to offer free 2 way shipping especially if it looks like it's a real problem. I.e. have some person with intelligence guesstimate if it's an issue and then spring for shipping both ways.

When one provides 2 way shipping, they gain some advantage similar to a B&M store.

The moment a customer finds out about paying for shipping the message they get is, the company doesn't think my issue is their fault and that leaves a bad impression. A reputation is spread much better through word of mouth. At Emotiva, they've taken care of any issues I've had so I've kept coming back. I've reccomended them to friends and they've bought their stuff. You can't buy that kind of publicity with an ad. But even they charge return shipping. But ocassionally when it's clear they've messed up, they will just pick up shipping both ways.
 
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