Sabaj A30a announced

[Roland68]

how do you know it's identical ?

When you open both devices, it's immediately apparent if you have some knowledge of electronics and circuits.
However, out of personal interest, I have taken a much closer look at the devices and also have the documentation on the components, including the Axign chip.

 

[GiBo61]

It's a shame that the SABAJ A30a amplifier is no longer produced!!! In fact, I had noticed a few weeks ago that there were no more units available for purchase on the hifi-express.com website.
I have owned this amplifier for exactly 3 years and I can only speak highly of it. It's not perfect, but I still can't find anything with a price/performance ratio that is even remotely comparable. Furthermore, I am fascinated by the fact that it is a full digital amplifier and therefore does not require the use of a DAC when the source is digital (as is increasingly the case today).
I am therefore surprised that this technology is not used by a greater number of manufacturers. I think of SMSL (VMV A2), Marantz (M1), Denon (Home Amp), Bluesound (Powernode N331), Harman Kardon (Citation Amp), Pioneer (A-70DA / A-50DA / A-30DA). Any others?
Practically unanimously, all owners of fully digital amplifiers praise them for their remarkable sound quality, even though some models have problems that were never resolved (HK Citation Amp: insufficient heat dissipation; Marantz M1: hissing noise when connected to certain types of speakers).
Initially, I used the SABAJ A30a with a Wiim Mini connected to the optical input, and for about €500 I had a powerful audio system with excellent technical measurements. I currently use it as a power amplifier, using a Wiim Ultra as the source.
I think the only reason I would replace it is if I needed more power, but since I live in an apartment building, I don't think that need will arise anytime soon.

 

[Dsggolv77]

It's a shame that the SABAJ A30a amplifier is no longer produced!!! In fact, I had noticed a few weeks ago that there were no more units available for purchase on the hifi-express.com website.
I have owned this amplifier for exactly 3 years and I can only speak highly of it. It's not perfect, but I still can't find anything with a price/performance ratio that is even remotely comparable. Furthermore, I am fascinated by the fact that it is a full digital amplifier and therefore does not require the use of a DAC when the source is digital (as is increasingly the case today).
I am therefore surprised that this technology is not used by a greater number of manufacturers. I think of SMSL (VMV A2), Marantz (M1), Denon (Home Amp), Bluesound (Powernode N331), Harman Kardon (Citation Amp), Pioneer (A-70DA / A-50DA / A-30DA). Any others?
Practically unanimously, all owners of fully digital amplifiers praise them for their remarkable sound quality, even though some models have problems that were never resolved (HK Citation Amp: insufficient heat dissipation; Marantz M1: hissing noise when connected to certain types of speakers).
Initially, I used the SABAJ A30a with a Wiim Mini connected to the optical input, and for about €500 I had a powerful audio system with excellent technical measurements. I currently use it as a power amplifier, using a Wiim Ultra as the source.
I think the only reason I would replace it is if I needed more power, but since I live in an apartment building, I don't think that need will arise anytime soon.

How about Popudigi on aliexpress, with Renesas / Intersil D2 audio dsp, not Axign though.

 

[Roland68]

How about Popudigi on aliexpress, with Renesas / Intersil D2 audio dsp, not Axign though.

Read the discussion about it among technicians in the DIYAudio forum, and it'll clear things up quickly.

Price-wise, it's the opposite of the A30a—a lot of money for significantly less performance and functionality. I'd rather spend that money on a new or used Yamaha A-S1XXX/2XXX.
One of the special features of the A30a is that it is completely digital, outputs the signal directly at the output via PWM analog and does not require a DAC.

 

[Roland68]

Es ist wirklich schade, dass der SABAJ A30a Verstärker nicht mehr hergestellt wird! Tatsächlich habe ich vor einigen Wochen bemerkt, dass auf der Website hifi-express.com keine Geräte mehr zum Kauf angeboten werden .
Ich besitze diesen Verstärker seit genau drei Jahren und bin restlos begeistert. Er ist zwar nicht perfekt, aber ich habe bisher kein vergleichbares Gerät mit einem ähnlichen Preis-Leistungs-Verhältnis gefunden. Besonders fasziniert mich, dass es sich um einen volldigitalen Verstärker handelt und daher bei digitalen Quellen (wie sie heutzutage immer häufiger vorkommen) keinen DAC benötigt.
Ich bin daher überrascht, dass diese Technologie nicht von mehr Herstellern eingesetzt wird. Ich denke da an SMSL (VMV A2), Marantz (M1), Denon (Home Amp), Bluesound (Powernode N331), Harman Kardon (Citation Amp) und Pioneer (A-70DA / A-50DA / A-30DA). Gibt es noch weitere?
Nahezu einhellig loben alle Besitzer volldigitaler Verstärker deren bemerkenswerte Klangqualität, obwohl einige Modelle Probleme aufweisen, die nie behoben wurden (HK Citation Amp: unzureichende Wärmeableitung; Marantz M1: Zischgeräusche beim Anschluss an bestimmte Lautsprechertypen).
Anfangs nutzte ich den SABAJ A30a mit einer Wiim Mini am optischen Eingang und hatte so für rund 500 € ein leistungsstarkes Audiosystem mit exzellenten technischen Werten. Aktuell verwende ich ihn als Endstufe mit einer Wiim Ultra als Zuspieler.
Ich denke, der einzige Grund, warum ich es ersetzen würde, wäre, wenn ich mehr Leistung bräuchte, aber da ich in einem Mehrfamilienhaus wohne, glaube ich nicht, dass dieser Bedarf in absehbarer Zeit entstehen wird.

Es überrascht mich nicht wirklich, da die Hersteller fast ausschließlich die Basisfunktionen genutzt haben und offenbar niemand das Potenzial dieses genialen Chips erkannt hat.
Darüber hinaus haben fast alle Hersteller die Anzahl der Entwickler drastisch reduziert, insbesondere die der teuren, innovativen und fähigen.
Das interne Design und die zusätzlichen ICs, die im A30a verwendet wurden, zeugen eindeutig von einem mangelnden Verständnis dieser Technologie und einem generellen Mangel an Kenntnissen über die Entwicklung und Funktionsweise von Verstärkern.

 

[GiBo61]

It's a shame that the SABAJ A30a amplifier is no longer produced!!! In fact, I had noticed a few weeks ago that there were no more units available for purchase on the hifi-express.com website.
I have owned this amplifier for exactly 3 years and I can only speak highly of it. It's not perfect, but I still can't find anything with a price/performance ratio that is even remotely comparable. Furthermore, I am fascinated by the fact that it is a full digital amplifier and therefore does not require the use of a DAC when the source is digital (as is increasingly the case today).
I am therefore surprised that this technology is not used by a greater number of manufacturers. I think of SMSL (VMV A2), Marantz (M1), Denon (Home Amp), Bluesound (Powernode N331), Harman Kardon (Citation Amp), Pioneer (A-70DA / A-50DA / A-30DA). Any others?
Practically unanimously, all owners of fully digital amplifiers praise them for their remarkable sound quality, even though some models have problems that were never resolved (HK Citation Amp: insufficient heat dissipation; Marantz M1: hissing noise when connected to certain types of speakers).
Initially, I used the SABAJ A30a with a Wiim Mini connected to the optical input, and for about €500 I had a powerful audio system with excellent technical measurements. I currently use it as a power amplifier, using a Wiim Ultra as the source.
I think the only reason I would replace it is if I needed more power, but since I live in an apartment building, I don't think that need will arise anytime soon.

I just want to add that what I like about the SABAJ A30a (and the nearly identical SMSL VMV A2) over other Axign-based all-digital amplifiers is that you don't need a dedicated app or network connection to take advantage of its features.

 

[Roland68]

I just want to add that what I like about the SABAJ A30a (and the nearly identical SMSL VMV A2) over other Axign-based all-digital amplifiers is that you don't need a dedicated app or network connection to take advantage of its features.

This has nothing to do with the Axign chip or amplifiers, but rather with the manufacturers' nonsensical ideas.

 

[Dsggolv77]

Read the discussion about it among technicians in the DIYAudio forum, and it'll clear things up quickly.

Price-wise, it's the opposite of the A30a—a lot of money for significantly less performance and functionality. I'd rather spend that money on a new or used Yamaha A-S1XXX/2XXX.
One of the special features of the A30a is that it is completely digital, outputs the signal directly at the output via PWM analog and does not require a DAC.

D2-92633 also converts pcm to pwm without traditional dacs. There are more popudigi models on taobao worldwide.

 

[Roland68]

D2-92633 also converts pcm to pwm without traditional dacs. There are more popudigi models on taobao worldwide.

The STA309A chip, also used in the A30a and quite inexpensive, can do that too, just like many others; it's nothing special.

For our industrial products, we collaborate with several developers who specialize in high-energy PWM applications. Since we're exploring building such an amplifier ourselves, I've gone through all the available ICs for these applications with them, as well as other options. Among them, besides many others, was the D2-92633 with integrated DSP, which I think is a bad idea.
Aside from the fact that the Axign chip works very well and reliably, someone must have thought outside the box during its development, because other solutions would require a lot of development and programming to achieve the integrated and easy-to-use capabilities, which has become prohibitively expensive these days.

I've already said something about the Popudigi. I'm certainly willing to spend a lot of money on an amplifier or a good device. Unlike many other users, I also understand the costs of development work and higher prices for small production runs.
But I want to get something in return, in terms of sound, development, and/or materials, which I don't see there.

I've had amplifiers here for €10,000 and €50,000, and now I have two A30As for about €500 each. They've been holding me back for three years from a long-planned purchase of two amplifiers for €4,000-€6,000 each.

 

[syzygy]

It's a shame that the SABAJ A30a amplifier is no longer produced!!! In fact, I had noticed a few weeks ago that there were no more units available for purchase on the hifi-express.com website.
I have owned this amplifier for exactly 3 years and I can only speak highly of it. It's not perfect, but I still can't find anything with a price/performance ratio that is even remotely comparable. Furthermore, I am fascinated by the fact that it is a full digital amplifier and therefore does not require the use of a DAC when the source is digital (as is increasingly the case today).
I am therefore surprised that this technology is not used by a greater number of manufacturers. I think of SMSL (VMV A2), Marantz (M1), Denon (Home Amp), Bluesound (Powernode N331), Harman Kardon (Citation Amp), Pioneer (A-70DA / A-50DA / A-30DA). Any others?
Practically unanimously, all owners of fully digital amplifiers praise them for their remarkable sound quality, even though some models have problems that were never resolved (HK Citation Amp: insufficient heat dissipation; Marantz M1: hissing noise when connected to certain types of speakers).
Initially, I used the SABAJ A30a with a Wiim Mini connected to the optical input, and for about €500 I had a powerful audio system with excellent technical measurements. I currently use it as a power amplifier, using a Wiim Ultra as the source.
I think the only reason I would replace it is if I needed more power, but since I live in an apartment building, I don't think that need will arise anytime soon.

No longer produced? Is that true?

I see it's still available on HiFiExpress ( low stock: 1 left Edit - looks like that one may be 'refurbished' - and on sale)

And I could find nothing on the Sabaj website to indicate it was discontinued? Their landing page seems to highlight the A30a (although their website looks like it hasn't been updated in a couple years.)

 

[Evo42]

No longer produced? Is that true?

I see it's still available on HiFiExpress ( low stock: 1 left Edit - looks like that one may be 'refurbished' - and on sale)

And I could find nothing on the Sabaj website to indicate it was discontinued? Their landing page seems to highlight the A30a (although their website looks like it hasn't been updated in a couple years.)

I asked them about it on their AliExpress store.

 

[daniboun]

The STA309A chip, also used in the A30a and quite inexpensive, can do that too, just like many others; it's nothing special.

For our industrial products, we collaborate with several developers who specialize in high-energy PWM applications. Since we're exploring building such an amplifier ourselves, I've gone through all the available ICs for these applications with them, as well as other options. Among them, besides many others, was the D2-92633 with integrated DSP, which I think is a bad idea.
Aside from the fact that the Axign chip works very well and reliably, someone must have thought outside the box during its development, because other solutions would require a lot of development and programming to achieve the integrated and easy-to-use capabilities, which has become prohibitively expensive these days.

I've already said something about the Popudigi. I'm certainly willing to spend a lot of money on an amplifier or a good device. Unlike many other users, I also understand the costs of development work and higher prices for small production runs.
But I want to get something in return, in terms of sound, development, and/or materials, which I don't see there.

I've had amplifiers here for €10,000 and €50,000, and now I have two A30As for about €500 each. They've been holding me back for three years from a long-planned purchase of two amplifiers for €4,000-€6,000 each.

It's a real shame that Amir never tested it. I owned the Sabaj A30A and it's a great FDA (Full Digital Audio) device. For those in the know, it's a copy of the SMSL VMV A2.
By analogy, one can therefore get an idea of the theoretical performance of the A30A by reading this ASR test.

SMSL VMV A2 Review (Stereo Amplifier & DAC)

This is a review and detailed measurements of the SMSL VMV A2 stereo "desktop" DAC and amplifier. It was sent to me by the company and costs US $999. VMV is the higher-end brand in SMSL lineup. The look and feel of the A2 is similar to the latest line from SMSL: It looks nicer though in...

www.audiosciencereview.com

You can find it if you search carefully on the web. I bought mine for around €300.

 

[Roland68]

It's a real shame that Amir never tested it. I owned the Sabaj A30A and it's a great FDA (Full Digital Audio) device. For those in the know, it's a copy of the SMSL VMV A2.
By analogy, one can therefore get an idea of the theoretical performance of the A30A by reading this ASR test.

SMSL VMV A2 Review (Stereo Amplifier & DAC)

This is a review and detailed measurements of the SMSL VMV A2 stereo "desktop" DAC and amplifier. It was sent to me by the company and costs US $999. VMV is the higher-end brand in SMSL lineup. The look and feel of the A2 is similar to the latest line from SMSL: It looks nicer though in...

www.audiosciencereview.com

You can find it if you search carefully on the web. I bought mine for around €300.

Internally, the A30a is practically a twin of the VMV A2, and the components are likely all the same. Even the layout of the back panel is almost identical (the A2's is mounted upside down), and the Axign chip and transistors are the same as well. Since they also use the same power supplies, I don't expect any difference in performance.
I was able to compare the A2 with the A30a twice, and there was no audible difference. Unfortunately, I wasn't allowed to open the units.
Therefore, I don't expect a test of the A30a to have yielded any different results.

If anyone has pictures of the circuit board of the VMV A2 (not the Pro), or could take some (you only need to unscrew the bottom panel), it would be great if they could post them.

 

[daniboun]

Internally, the A30a is practically a twin of the VMV A2, and the components are likely all the same. Even the layout of the back panel is almost identical (the A2's is mounted upside down), and the Axign chip and transistors are the same as well. Since they also use the same power supplies, I don't expect any difference in performance.
I was able to compare the A2 with the A30a twice, and there was no audible difference. Unfortunately, I wasn't allowed to open the units.
Therefore, I don't expect a test of the A30a to have yielded any different results.

If anyone has pictures of the circuit board of the VMV A2 (not the Pro), or could take some (you only need to unscrew the bottom panel), it would be great if they could post them.

This is what I said )

Additional measurements of the A2 :

Measurements & Review SMSL VMV A2 All-in-One Amp - L7Audiolab

台式设备 前阵子测了一台 SMSL VMV A1 ，实话说我对测量结果不甚满意。后来和双木三林那边沟通的时候，他们表示，A1 确实是一种特别的玩票设计，回头借我一台他们即将推出的 SMSL VMV A2 测测看，于是今天我收到了这货

www.l7audiolab.com

 

[KL....]

Additional measurements of the A2

Measurements & Review SMSL VMV A2 All-in-One Amp - L7Audiolab

台式设备 前阵子测了一台 SMSL VMV A1 ，实话说我对测量结果不甚满意。后来和双木三林那边沟通的时候，他们表示，A1 确实是一种特别的玩票设计，回头借我一台他们即将推出的 SMSL VMV A2 测测看，于是今天我收到了这货

www.l7audiolab.com

Thank you, @daniboun, very good measurements, aren't they, at all power/load levels (measured).
From your perspective/focus, what would you consider are the most important measurements/graphs?

 

[daniboun]

Thank you, @daniboun, very good measurements, aren't they, at all power/load levels.
From your perspective/focus, what would you consider are the most important measurements/graphs?

If I could point to a graph, I think the measurements related to the 45 Khz bandwidth. This show that this FDA stands out particularly from certain other Class D products with a minimal load dependence.

 

[KL....]

If I could point to a graph, I think the measurements related to the 45 Khz bandwidth. This show that this FDA stands out particularly from certain other Class D products with a minimal load dependence.

View attachment 488374

Thank you, @daniboun, this suggests that (amplifyer) noise is the real issue not THD,doesn't it, (stablely) decreaseing with power/W (increaseing/>SNR which decreases/reduces Noise Masking (difference/>=70db), allowing Contrast to improve/increase, doesn't it?) although >=15Khz/THD becomeing higher then falls a little, doesn't it? To ask and if you do not mind (further) clarifying, how would you suggest that this shows minimal load dependence, (possablely) its Linearity regardless of input frequency (20-45Khz) or power level?

What are thoughts of the Crosstalk?

 

[antcollinet]

Thank you, @daniboun, this suggests that (amplifyer) noise is the real issue not THD,doesn't it, (stablely) decreaseing with power/W although >=15Khz/THD becomeing higher then falls a little, doesn't it? To ask and if you do not mind (further) clarifying, how would you suggest that this shows minimal load dependence, (possablely) its Linearity regardless of input frequency (20-45Khz) or power level?

What are thoughts of the Crosstalk?

The noise doesn't decrease with power - it stays the same - but the power increases, so it becomes a lower percentage of the power - which is better SNR.

 

[KL....]

The noise doesn't decrease with power - it stays the same - but the power increases, so it becomes a lower percentage of the power - which is better SNR.

Thank you, yes, added SNR/Masking/Contrast Effect for @daniboun

 

[daniboun]

@antcollinet
It's been a while since I last read your posts. I hope you're doing well, man.