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S.M.S.L DA-9 vs AO200?

Papaya_X

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Nov 26, 2021
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Sorry for the late reply.

I actually just pulled the trigger on the AO200, as I saw it on sale on amazon.co.jp during the point-up sale, knocking the price down to around 215 USD.

I plan pair it with an RME ADI-2 DAC FS once I move out of my current apartment later this month, really looking forward to it.
I think you will like this combo !
 

Weesky85

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Good Evening! I am new here. :)

Guess not many people register in a forum to post good news these days, but I just bought an AO200 here in Belgium. First one sadly had a bit of a funny crackle noise on the right channel once there was some lows being played. The issue traveled when swapping cables around from left to right and also with different speakers and inputs.

Returned the first one and the second one seems pretty flawless. My Monitor Audio speakers are 90dB so pretty sensitive and pick up a little bit of the hiss when gain is turned up and nothing is being played. But at 35 out of 70 you must really get your ear very close to hear it. When Balanced is selected, the hiss is even less.

Reasonably happy with the USB input to be honest, BT is lala, RCA and Balanced not tested yet.

Cheers and have a great weekend!

Weesky
 

dynamisoz

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Hi all..
Just received my ao200 yesterday. This amp sounds fantastic. Coming from smsl Q5 pro... this ao200 is better in every way. Its definitely a nice upgrade for me. Just a quick question... i've read some people say their ao200 is dead silent. on my ao200 when the volume is 60 or above (70 is max) i hear a very faint hiss when my ear is about 6 inch away from the tweeter. at 12 inch or more away i cant hear them, thats how faint the hiss is. now I presume this is ok. is this normal? do i need to return this..

p.s. everything else is perfect
 

Jon wise

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Hi all..
Just received my ao200 yesterday. This amp sounds fantastic. Coming from smsl Q5 pro... this ao200 is better in every way. Its definitely a nice upgrade for me. Just a quick question... i've read some people say their ao200 is dead silent. on my ao200 when the volume is 60 or above (70 is max) i hear a very faint hiss when my ear is about 6 inch away from the tweeter. at 12 inch or more away i cant hear them, thats how faint the hiss is. now I presume this is ok. is this normal? do i need to return this..

p.s. everything else is perfect
I get the same, I am also presuming its normal for this amp.
 

Weesky85

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I think you will have a hard time finding an amp that does not have any tweeter hiss at that gain level.

I changed speakers from my Triangle 90db to 88db Q ACOUSTICS and the hiss has reduced by more than half. (Not measured, just going by ear)
 

dynamisoz

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I think you will have a hard time finding an amp that does not have any tweeter hiss at that gain level.

I changed speakers from my Triangle 90db to 88db Q ACOUSTICS and the hiss has reduced by more than half. (Not measured, just going by ear)
My speaker is Klipsch RP 160M , which is 95db sensitive. so i guess hearing a faint hiss is normal at that gain level. just wanted to confirm with others.. thanks
 

Toku

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Reasonably happy with the USB input to be honest, BT is lala, RCA and Balanced not tested yet.
I also bought and used two AO200s.
The USB input of AO200 is a bonus function that uses the DAC function of Bluetooth. The corresponding sample rate is 48kHz/24bit only. But the sound quality is good enough for general use. However, I recommend using a full-fledged external DAC in the future to fully utilize the performance of the AO200.
 

Steamrolly

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I have both a A07 and AO200, if someone was starting out and asked me what to buy I would suggest the AO200 and start by using the internal DAC with an RPI as a streamer instead of the A07 with an external DAC. Going the AO200 route allows you an upgrade route to a future DAC, or even balanced DAC and then adding a sub if that suits your needs. Plus with the balanced and unbalanced input you can connect two components without an adapter. I guess there is the BT as well but my antenna is still in the box.
 

Weesky85

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Yes, further down the line, I want to add the DO200. But will wait for the price to come down a bit.
 

ObjectiveSubjectivist

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Is anyone having an issue where DA-9 loses its memory?
After turn unit on/off using remote (standby) all settings are lost, I have to manually setup everything (brightness/input/volume etc.)
I already did factory reset but it didn't help.
Any ideas? @SMSL-Mandy @SMSL_Liu
 

RandomEar

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Many moons back, @arkelectron reported an issue with hiss on his AO200:
I received my SMSL AO200 without the screen working. I found that the FFC cable was slightly damaged and not connected to the screen properly. I was able to repair it and get it working.

Now,I have a problem with a hiss coming from the unit itself. With just power and nothing connected it doesn't make the sound. When the speakers are connected, the hissing starts.

...

I actually had what sounds like the same problem with my unit (and a replacement I ordered) and have now found a fix described in this post: Put a 22 µH choke in line with your speakers - in my case only with the tweeter section - and you're done. I couldn't detect any negative consequences in my setup, but I think it could potentially alter the frequency response in the 10+ kHz range. Just wanted to report this here, in case anyone stumbles upon this issue. For details see the linked post.
 

Goodsound

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I can easily recommend this amplifier (AO200) to anyone who is shopping for a good to great sounding amplifier, who doesn't care about brand name but cares about good sound. This amplifier is very musical.

I tend to disagree. This little class D amp suffers of the same deficits like all the cheap class D amps; while highs and lows are OK it’s the mids that are problematic: voices are too thin and guitars have not enough body. On one hand SMSL have great engineers that even integrate DSP options like SDB on the other hand they only offer a dozen variants of loudness focusing on highs and lows instead of treating the real Achilles’ heel of lacking midrange. Obviously they don’t listen to their own products. This unit has the usual non musical sterile class D sound signature and no reviewer is honestly telling you about it. I regret ordering one. Maybe a firmware update could solve this problem, I don‘t know.
 

pfgiv

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I tend to disagree. This little class D amp suffers of the same deficits like all the cheap class D amps; while highs and lows are OK it’s the mids that are problematic: voices are too thin and guitars have not enough body. On one hand SMSL have great engineers that even integrate DSP options like SDB on the other hand they only offer a dozen variants of loudness focusing on highs and lows instead of treating the real Achilles’ heel of lacking midrange. Obviously they don’t listen to their own products. This unit has the usual non musical sterile class D sound signature and no reviewer is honestly telling you about it. I regret ordering one. Maybe a firmware update could solve this problem, I don‘t know.
Have you blind AB tested this with level matching against a class A amp? Could it be that a previous amp was full of distortion causing a sound you actually preferred? A properly functioning amp that is distortion free isn’t going to “sound” any specific way. It’s just going to cleanly power your speakers the way they should sound.
 

Pillars

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Have you blind AB tested this with level matching against a class A amp? Could it be that a previous amp was full of distortion causing a sound you actually preferred? A properly functioning amp that is distortion free isn’t going to “sound” any specific way. It’s just going to cleanly power your speakers the way they should sound.
Well, it's the distortion that maybe helps :) I prefer my Akitika GT-102 to the DA-9 for this reason - though I rather enjoy the DA-9 for 2ch home theater use.
 

Goodsound

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Have you blind AB tested this with level matching against a class A amp? Could it be that a previous amp was full of distortion causing a sound you actually preferred? A properly functioning amp that is distortion free isn’t going to “sound” any specific way. It’s just going to cleanly power your speakers the way they should sound.

Your further inquiry about blind AB test is a bit odd to me. Like if I was in a restaurant, complaining to the waiter that the dish wasn’t satisfying and the cook didn’t do a good job. Then the waiter would ask me if I blind AB tested the meal with spice matching against another restaurant? If that would happen I would laugh at him, then saying: „wait, are you serious? - let me even laugh harder.“
I agree that a proper designed amp is neutral, adding nothing to the sound nor emphasizing certain frequencies. But then still, some manufacturers seem to have a signature sound to their brand/products.
The problem isn’t distortion either, maybe the variance in loudspeaker impedance through different frequency bands and that interaction with the amps output stage resulting in a rather analytical, cool sound.
My main complaint was about, when SMSL is adding DSP functions to allow customers altering the sound to their tastes, why only in the highs and the lows disregarding the mids (because there is the most need of action according to my opinion)?
 
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RandomEar

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Your further inquiry about blind AB test is a bit odd to me. Like if I was in a restaurant, complaining to the waiter that the dish wasn’t satisfying and the cook didn’t do a good job. Then the waiter would ask me if I blind AB tested the meal with spice matching against another restaurant? If that would happen I would laugh at him, then saying: „wait, are you serious? - let me even laugh harder.“
I agree that a proper designed amp is neutral, adding nothing to the sound nor emphasizing certain frequencies. But then still, some manufacturers seem to have a signature sound to their brand/products.
The problem isn’t distortion either, maybe the variance in loudspeaker impedance through different frequency bands and that interaction with the amps output stage resulting in a rather analytical, cool sound.
My main complaint was about, when SMSL is adding DSP functions to allow customers altering the sound to their tastes, why only in the highs and the lows disregarding the mids (because there is the most need of action according to my opinion)?
I think you're missing the point of blind ABX testing. Your example with the restaurant is applicable, but not in the exaggerated way you put it: Compare a home cooked meal on day X to another, identically prepared one on day Y. Do you think they will taste exactly the same? What if day X was a much better day for you than day Y? Still think the meal will taste the same? (Hint: It won't.)

In short: I think you're overestimating the reliability and objectiveness of your senses and underestimating the effects of (expectation-)bias and other "soft" factors on your sensory perception. Also: Even being aware of a bias doesn't make it go away.

That being said: If you reduce bass and treble on an EQ, the result is the same as when you increase the mids. Apart from a slight negative pre-amp, that is - which doesn't affect the tonality in any way. Therefore, the amp does have the ability to EQ the mids - just not quite as elaborated as devices with 3 or 5 independent EQ bands.
 

pfgiv

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Your further inquiry about blind AB test is a bit odd to me. Like if I was in a restaurant, complaining to the waiter that the dish wasn’t satisfying and the cook didn’t do a good job. Then the waiter would ask me if I blind AB tested the meal with spice matching against another restaurant? If that would happen I would laugh at him, then saying: „wait, are you serious? - let me even laugh harder.“
I agree that a proper designed amp is neutral, adding nothing to the sound nor emphasizing certain frequencies. But then still, some manufacturers seem to have a signature sound to their brand/products.
The problem isn’t distortion either, maybe the variance in loudspeaker impedance through different frequency bands and that interaction with the amps output stage resulting in a rather analytical, cool sound.
My main complaint was about, when SMSL is adding DSP functions to allow customers altering the sound to their tastes, why only in the highs and the lows disregarding the mids (because there is the most need of action according to my opinion)?
Your claim was "This little class D amp suffers of the same deficits like all the cheap class D amps; while highs and lows are OK it’s the mids that are problematic: voices are too thin and guitars have not enough body." If you're making a claim that the amps "sound" a specific way vs non class D amps, it's not unrealistic to ask how you have arrived to that conclusion. Without blind tests, you have bias. I would laugh at a waiter too if he asked this, but your example isn't the same. You've made a claim that says class D topology makes mids sound poor. Saying 'I didn't like the scampi', isn't the same thing.

This is why I mention blind AB testing. If you take two amps, both neutral and clean power, level match the two, you're not going to tell a difference between the two amps if the amps are hooked up to speakers they can properly power. The only way that you will hear a difference is if the amp is providing distortion, or one isn't properly able to power the speakers.
 

Goodsound

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I think you're missing the point of blind ABX testing. Your example with the restaurant is applicable, but not in the exaggerated way you put it: Compare a home cooked meal on day X to another, identically prepared one on day Y. Do you think they will taste exactly the same? What if day X was a much better day for you than day Y? Still think the meal will taste the same? (Hint: It won't.)

In short: I think you're overestimating the reliability and objectiveness of your senses and underestimating the effects of (expectation-)bias and other "soft" factors on your sensory perception. Also: Even being aware of a bias doesn't make it go away.

That being said: If you reduce bass and treble on an EQ, the result is the same as when you increase the mids. Apart from a slight negative pre-amp, that is - which doesn't affect the tonality in any way. Therefore, the amp does have the ability to EQ the mids - just not quite as elaborated as devices with 3 or 5 independent EQ bands.

Interesting read and I agree being human, not a robot, but I don’t think that will nullify my opinion. Reducing bass and treble doesn’t equal increasing the mids because this isn’t done linearly as it should (in this unit AO200 at least).
 

Goodsound

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This is why I mention blind AB testing. If you take two amps, both neutral and clean power, level match the two, you're not going to tell a difference between the two amps if the amps are hooked up to speakers they can properly power. The only way that you will hear a difference is if the amp is providing distortion, or one isn't properly able to power the speakers.

Your claim (if true) would turn every reviewer of High End gear into a blatant liar as they describe (subtle) differences in sound when reviewing and comparing amps (and speakers etc).
Every engineer/designer of audiophile gear fine-tunes the sonic character to the ideal of that brand. On one side this could be analytical and cool vs. neutral vs. rich and warm (and anything in between). So it’s easy to tell apart gear that is on the opposite sides of tonality. But tonality is not the only trait of an amp. There will also its imaging assessed and its dynamic capabilities and more. All these traits shape into a sonic character that will either please you or not, based on your personal listening preferences and the other gear it has to work with.
 
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