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Room set up

StaresyJ

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okay need some expert views here. I am lucky to have a large basement (den for those USA friends). I have a few options but none seem ideal. Picture 1. Current set up (ignore little speakers these are going to be KEF Q150’s. I have potential TV reflection and an open space on the right . Cannot move TV without major rewiring. Picture 2. Narrow end of rectangular room. Concerned about blocking from large chimney. Is this likely to be a problem ? Better enclosed space for sure. Option 3, move large sideboard and have speakers again on short rectangle space? Thoughts?
 

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MacCali

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My only input would be you should be positioned facing the long side, and pull those speakers out as far as possible from the back wall. I think 2.5 feet is minimum the further you pull out the better it will be so going short side won’t be ideal.

Also don’t be seated all the way against the back wall, so balance between being a couple feet away from both ends[you and the speakers]. If one is not possible be certain the speakers get the extra space

From the looks of it I would definitely move the sofa back to near where the dressers are and moving everything foward. You can adjust how far out the speakers go by the first reflection point.

Not sure if it’s a good idea to have a reflection point on one side and not the other.

I’ve seen the “golden” triangle for audio and that might be something to consider. Not sure if it’s necessary for rectangle rooms but I’m in a 12 x 14 so I implemented it cause a square room is bad
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StaresyJ

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Thanks for the comments! Much appreciated.
Whilst this is a large space it does have its problems unless I shift a lot of furniture around, which is not a real problem, just a bit of a pain with big heavy pieces! The basement is 3.8m wide (15 feet) so plenty of scope to get speakers a good 3 feet away from the walls and still leave enough room to look at the golden triangle off the long wall? It would be less problematic to set this up on the left side as you look at the chimney end picture.
 

Sokel

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Every room has it's compromises,I too had to go for the long distance (about 11.5 meters) even thought the small one (7 meters) was plenty.
The bad thing is that mine is odd,no right angles.
Everything measured better there according the pro's that did my installation.
Measure it,try it.
 

ZolaIII

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Pool both speakers and TV out to the beginning of doorway and little wider put speakers (about 2 m), add cuple of acoustic dumpers/bass traps to the back wall and corners and clean out the furniture you actually don't need (extended part's of that angular garniture and what ever is that behind it).
 
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StaresyJ

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Pool both speakers and TV out to the beginning of doorway and little wider put speakers (about 2 m), add cuple of acoustic dumpers/bass traps to the back wall and corners and clean out the furniture you actually don't need (extended part's of that angular garniture and what ever is that behind it).
There are a number of issues with that. The main one being my listening position will be almost smack bang in the middle of the room (which is about 7meters long) and I thought having your sweet spot in the middle of a room was to be avoided? The room doubles as a relaxing space when children come home so I won’t get permission to convert it entirely for my use! I’m still keen on trying the speakers off the long wall at one end, but I can see some problems with that as well! Nothing is easy!
 

ZolaIII

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@StaresyJ reference whose to first picture just moving them out a little more to how much it's possible by the beginning of doorway on the left.
If we let's say that's about meter from back wall leaving some 70 cm behind 60 when you put bass traps it's just fine. You can get a listening position at 3 m away from that and that's 4 m together, not exactly ideal 4.67 m (⅔) but good enough and not a problem with phase compensation. Thing is I would avoid pulling them out more into the doorway and leaking into it which would be hard to deal with.
It's not really much different than what MacCali did drown you just little more objective to space you actually have.
You don't really need to address refractions (at least hopefully) just to dump the back wall (at least that's the most important part) and not whole wall cuple panel traps and corners. You can keep 3~4 seats just clear the path of the speakers. When you get KEF's we should see twitter dispersion from measurements regarding how to angle them and towards how many seats.
 

MacCali

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There are a number of issues with that. The main one being my listening position will be almost smack bang in the middle of the room (which is about 7meters long) and I thought having your sweet spot in the middle of a room was to be avoided? The room doubles as a relaxing space when children come home so I won’t get permission to convert it entirely for my use! I’m still keen on trying the speakers off the long wall at one end, but I can see some problems with that as well! Nothing is easy!
The short side is RW, the long side would be where the doorways are. The distance from the rear walls doesn’t matter as long as it’s pulled out far enough.

Use a mirror to check out the first reflection point and make sure both speakers hit a wall on the right and left.

I’ve never heard about the center of the room being an issue. But the speakers should follow the distance of the side walls. If your room is 15 ft wide it should be 4 feet away from the walls. And you should be about 6 feet away from the speakers.
 
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StaresyJ

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All great helpful stuff! Currently, the right speaker is 3 foot (100 cm) from the side wall (picture 1) and 65 from the rear wall ( picture 3). The left hand speaker is 110 cm from wall and the same distance to rear wall as RH speaker. They are toed in quite a lot and I have 160cm centre to centre between the speakers. My current sitting position is 200cm away from front edge.
 
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StaresyJ

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ZolaIII

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All great helpful stuff! Currently, the right speaker is 3 foot (100 cm) from the side wall (picture 1) and 65 from the rear wall ( picture 3). The left hand speaker is 110 cm from wall and the same distance to rear wall as RH speaker. They are toed in quite a lot and I have 160cm centre to centre between the speakers. My current sitting position is 200cm away from front edge.
Which is not a bad positioning.
Play a bit more regarding it and see how it goes. You can play with all kinds of stuff you have like putting an old mattress to the back wall (temporarily) and see how it sounds like that, putting corks in wents of speakers if you have them (or socks or towel if you don't). This way you get the picture what you can get doing acoustic treatment, how much you really nead one, how lowering room harmonics helps you and such. No need to spend anything before you are sure that you need and want it.
Buy UMIK 1 and learn how to use it and how to use REW and make a hobby out of it. Give some thought about getting a pair of subs and how to integrate them in the system but most importantly take your time and don't rush and of course have fun playing around.
 
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StaresyJ

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Thanks ! I started this thread with one main concern which was reflection from the LCD screen, and now I am thinking about lots of other things! As an experiment I cover the screen with a blanket and whilst I have no scientific evidence from measurements, the sound did appear to change for the better. High ends were clearer (I have previously needed to add tone) and less harsh to my ears.
 

TimW

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Thanks ! I started this thread with one main concern which was reflection from the LCD screen, and now I am thinking about lots of other things! As an experiment I cover the screen with a blanket and whilst I have no scientific evidence from measurements, the sound did appear to change for the better. High ends were clearer (I have previously needed to add tone) and less harsh to my ears.
The surface of the screen itself shouldn't be any different acoustically than the walls. Adding absorption panels to the front wall and rear wall and diffraction panels to the side walls at the first reflection point would probably bring significant improvement. That rear wall looks like a good place to hide bass traps.
 
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StaresyJ

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@StaresyJ If I was you I would try this with your measurements, 15x23, and use the Rule of Thirds measurements.
Try it, it is free. :)
Yes I like option 1 as favourite, the other 3 push the speakers to a too dominant position for a room which has to serve other purposes! Thank you !
 
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StaresyJ

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The surface of the screen itself shouldn't be any different acoustically than the walls. Adding absorption panels to the front wall and rear wall and diffraction panels to the side walls at the first reflection point would probably bring significant improvement. That rear wall looks like a good place to hide bass traps.
Talk to me about bass traps? I’m fairly new back to hifi and I’ve read about this but in simple terms please!?
 

Cote Dazur

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Yes I like option 1 as favourite, the other 3 push the speakers to a too dominant position for a room which has to serve other purposes! Thank you !
Yes, may not be practical, that is understandable. Still, just to hear what it can be, you still might want to try it, you might be pleasantly surprised. If so, put tape on the floor to mark the spot, just in case. :)
 

TimW

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Talk to me about bass traps? I’m fairly new back to hifi and I’ve read about this but in simple terms please!?
Honestly I don't have a lot of knowledge about bass traps. I have listened in rooms with bass traps that sounded very good. I have experimented with room treatment using 2" thick acoustic panels among other things but never bass traps. Absorptive panels help to cut down on the reverberation length in your room (RT60). High frequencies can be absorbed by thin materials like carpets and furniture so they usually have a low reverberation length in typical rooms. The lower in frequency a sound wave is, the longer it is, and the thicker a material needs to be to absorb it. So my 2" panels help to cut down reverberation length in mid frequencies but can't really do anything about bass frequencies or even the lower mids. You need very thick material to affect bass frequencies, and usually thick bass traps are placed in corners where they are most effective. I saw your unique rear wall situation and it seemed like you could add thick panels of absorptive material to it without really taking away floor space. However treating bass reverberation with bass traps is not efficient or even necessarily possible so most of us just use active room correction and multiple subs to cut down the nastiest room reverberations and get an even bass response. I would recommend that to you as well. Even if bass traps or just thick absorptive material on your rear wall doesn't give you excellent bass, it should still improve the all important midrange.
 
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StaresyJ

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Thanks! Will look into base traps on the open market
 
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StaresyJ

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Yes, may not be practical, that is understandable. Still, just to hear what it can be, you still might want to try it, you might be pleasantly surprised. If so, put tape on the floor to mark the spot, just in case. :)
When my wife leaves me because of my hifi obsession I can put them where I want!
 
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