Room measurements & equalization with REW + PEQ/Audyssey XT32

[Nootmuskaatje]

Hello! I've been trying to get my system just right using REW with an UMIK-1. It's not an easy thing to do, so I'm hoping experienced people here could guide me a little bit . I feel like I've done quite a bit, but with lots to improve still.

While Audyssey already did a lot of work, Before this I had to use DEQ to enjoy most bass. Now I noticed Audyssey EQ ran bass 6dB too cold and I needed to do some PEQ in the SVS app. I slightly raised the 30Hz dip and lowered the 20Hz and the 42, 53 & 80Hz peaks.

Purple line is average pre-EQ, red is average post-EQ. then there's the subwoofer, green being post-eq, red being pre-eq. Getting a nice house-curve in there.

Spoiler: REW measurements

Spoiler: SVS PEQ + Audyssey EQ

Surrounds have the same curve as the center.

Overall it looks like a lot of improvements are made. I'm not sure if that +4.5dB(+6-1.5) on 30Hz in the SVS app is a bit too much?

I do have a massive dip between 70 and 140Hz. The crossover is set to 90Hz on all speakers, and my surrounds already have a dip before that, but the center and fronts are fine. My subwoofer should handle 70-90Hz just fine, just like it does with my fronts/center. But those surrounds already dip at 80 or 70Hz.

Anyone knows what's up here? FL is highlighted next to all other speakers.

Spoiler: FL vs all other speakers

And at last there's this +6dB peak 1.1kHz on my FL. The FR doesn't suffer from this. Could that be fixed with a simple (room) adjustment? Audyssey doesn't EQ speakers seperately, its either both fronts or none.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!

Also, the room in question. Not sure if there are many changes that can be made.

Spoiler: My mancave

 

[flipflop]

Hi.

I'm not sure if that +4.5dB(+6-1.5) on 30Hz in the SVS app is a bit too much?

If headroom isn't a problem, I would boost it by an additional 2 dB and use a higher Q.

I do have a massive dip between 70 and 140Hz.

I think this is a smoothing problem. The less smoothed subwoofer response looks fine. Try to take a look at the red curve with Var smoothing.

Anyone knows what's up here? FL is highlighted next to all other speakers.

You shouldn't let Audyssey apply EQ above the transition frequency. There's a risk it will hurt sound quality. If you are already doing the bass EQ manually, you should disable Audyssey altogether.

Also, the room in question. Not sure if there are many changes that can be made.

Front L+R don't seem to be angled properly, both the vertically and horizontally. The drivers should be facing towards your head (or between the 2 seats of the couch in this case).
The speakers could also be moved closer to the LP and placed on stands to reduce adjacent boundary effects, but the room is probably too small for that to work properly.

 

[Nootmuskaatje]

If headroom isn't a problem, I would boost it by an additional 2 dB and use a higher Q.

6dB is the max within the app, it does add a lot of distortion at 30Hz. I tried a higher Q already, but that didn't make it better. I tested out the SPL meter as well, I tend to listen at around 75dB and had some peaks between 90-95dB So the sub should have more than enough headroom.

I think this is a smoothing problem. The less smoothed subwoofer response looks fine. Try to take a look at the red curve with Var smoothing.

Even with var smoothing the surrounds dip hard at 70-75Hz to 140Hz.

Spoiler: var smoothing

You shouldn't let Audyssey apply EQ above the transition frequency. There's a risk it will hurt sound quality. If you are already doing the bass EQ manually, you should disable Audyssey altogether.

I do like the curve Audyssey gives. Highs roll of nicely and I got a bit of a downwards slope playing with the curve in the app. How else could I let it EQ above bass frequencies?

Front L+R don't seem to be angled properly, both the vertically and horizontally. The drivers should be facing towards your head (or between the 2 seats of the couch in this case).
The speakers could also be moved closer to the LP and placed on stands to reduce adjacent boundary effects, but the room is probably too small for that to work properly.

The drivers do face the center of the couch horizontally, maybe a few % off. I couldn't adjust it more downwards sadly, or fit it anywhere else in here. I'm using the Q150s because once I move out, they'll be replaced by towers and go surround. Having the coaxial design helps a ton though. I had the dali spektor line before this, that one suffered quite a lot in high frequencies.

 

[flipflop]

6dB is the max within the app

If you've got more filters available, you could try adding another one that's 1 Hz higher or lower than the current.

Even with var smoothing the surrounds dip hard at 70-75Hz to 140Hz.

Strange. You might be able to correct it with EQ.

I do like the curve Audyssey gives. Highs roll of nicely and I got a bit of a downwards slope playing with the curve in the app.

What looks good to the eyes might not sound good to the ears.

How else could I let it EQ above bass frequencies?

By feeding it anechoic data. I'm not sure if that's possible, though, as I don't use Audyssey myself.
I would just leave it alone if I were you.

The drivers do face the center of the couch horizontally, maybe a few % off.

Fair enough. Pictures can sometimes be misleading

I couldn't adjust it more downwards sadly, or fit it anywhere else in here. I'm using the Q150s because once I move out, they'll be replaced by towers and go surround. Having the coaxial design helps a ton though. I had the dali spektor line before this, that one suffered quite a lot in high frequencies.

Yeah, coaxial speakers have good vertical directivity, so it's not too bad.

 

[Nootmuskaatje]

If you've got more filters available, you could try adding another one that's 1 Hz higher or lower than the current.

Sadly only 3, I could stack 2 indeed. But then I'd lose something else.

Strange. You might be able to correct it with EQ.

I tried a lot. Higher crossover, bump up the curve like mad in Audyssey. It helped a little bit, but wasn't worth it for the compromises. But like you said, looks good to the eye, doesn't sound the way to the ears. Never had problems with my surrounds, not like they do a lot of work compared to my behemoth center. Don't movies even use a seperate LFE channel, which gets sent to the sub anyway?

What looks good to the eyes might not sound good to the ears.

The ears like the added bass for sure! I have the ports plugged since they're wall-mounted, so I missed out quite a bit of bass. Even though the tested Q350 has a pretty bump at upper-bass, my (stuffed) q150 doesn't share that quality at all. My sub level was also pretty low. DEQ took care of all of the bass. For movies I definitely should not turn DEQ on now, which is nice, because it doesn't mess with my surrounds anymore.

I guess I could see what half plugged/unplugged ports would do. Could give a hefty bass bump next to a wall, for the better or worse. I could still do with a nice bump around 100Hz. Not sure if removing a plug would help there, I'll see tomorrow.

Spoiler: Average Front LR

By feeding it anechoic data. I'm not sure if that's possible, though, as I don't use Audyssey myself.
I would just leave it alone if I were you.

That's a good tip. Sounds like it isn't much for a newbie..

Fair enough. Pictures can sometimes be misleading

It is indeed taken at a bit awkward angle. I can't stand behind the couch when it's in listening position, the chair is in the way.

Yeah, coaxial speakers have good vertical directivity, so it's not too bad.

That's what amazed me the most. My dali's were absolutely one of the worst choices in this configuration. I had it flipped upside down to get the tweeter a bit closer to ear level, which was a big improvement. Later learned about directivity and noticed it's also better above the tweeter than below (in Dali's case).

 

[flipflop]

Don't movies even use a seperate LFE channel, which gets sent to the sub anyway?

They do. Whether the LFE gets utilized properly depends on how your setup is configured.

The ears like the added bass for sure!

Below the transition frequency, what is measured in-room is also what is heard. Above it, what is heard is a combination of the direct and reflected sound, but what is measured is mainly the reflected sound, hence my advice of leaving those frequencies unequalized.

Even though the tested Q350 has a pretty bump at upper-bass, my (stuffed) q150 doesn't share that quality at all.

I wouldn't be so sure. If the speakers are too close to a room boundary, the adjacent boundary effects (also sometimes referred to as SBIR) can include a cancellation/dip in the upper bass. This also explains why the upper bass dip can't be effectively EQed.
Not that I'm saying this is the only explanation for the measured dip.

 

[Nootmuskaatje]

I wouldn't be so sure. If the speakers are too close to a room boundary, the adjacent boundary effects (also sometimes referred to as SBIR) can include a cancellation/dip in the upper bass. This also explains why the upper bass dip can't be effectively EQed.
Not that I'm saying this is the only explanation for the measured dip.

I see. Most speakers have a big dip at 100Hz, my front left that's in a corner has it at 200Hz. Looking up SBIR, my only 2 options are mounting flush against a wall or getting them away from the walls. Both aren't possible in my room . I could maybe get it about 2.5cm closer to the wall, but the toe-in prevents more.