• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Room Correction, Dirac and devices that can implement it?

roog

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
369
Likes
397
Location
UK, Keynsham
I have been contemplating trying room acoustics correction in my system for quite some time and wondered what would be the 'best way' for me to add it to my quite generic system?
Dirac seems to be quite prevalent in their field, perhaps because of their marketing in the field of domestic HiFi products?
Also which manufactures offer Dirac as a part of their solution?

So far I have only seen the following, quite few, makers offer it as a part of a Stereo component:
  • NAD
  • Mini DSP, I note that Mini DSP products test well here.
Or should I sell most of my stuff and buy a Lyngdorf ? Seems a bit drastic.

In the absence of a ready made solution that I 'warm to' I wondered if it would be practical to implement it or other room correction software solution on a headless desk top PC with streamer software and 'Dirac' or other room correction software running in harmony, what are the chances of this working?

btw: I am not very 'PC tech aware'
 
Last edited:

tw99

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
467
Likes
1,069
Location
West Berkshire, UK
If you're not particularly "tech aware" you could consider the DSpeaker Anti-mode X2, perhaps. IME their devices are extremely simple to use, and very effective for bass room correction, albeit the older Anti-mode 2.0 didn't measure that well when Amir tested it. The MiniDSP stuff with Dirac works well, but it's a lot more fiddly to set up.

I think Strictly Stereo in the UK are a dealer for DSpeaker and also MiniDSP, you could get some direct advice or maybe even a loaner from them ?
 

Willem

Major Contributor
Joined
Jan 8, 2019
Messages
3,658
Likes
5,276
It does depend on the rest of the system. However, the cheapest option would be to get a umik-1 calibrated measurement microphone, measure the in-room response using the free REW software, construct an REW correction curve, import that into the free Equalizer Apo (plus free Peace interface) software on a PC, and connect that to your DAC.
If you want something really easy, the DSPeaker gear is great: their Antimode 8033 for subwoofer use, and the X2 for main speakers plus subwoofer integration. The X2 is also a basic DAC and preamplifier, and does not cost an arm and a leg.
 
OP
roog

roog

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
369
Likes
397
Location
UK, Keynsham
Thank you for your responses, I have a umik-1 mic and have used REW in the past to analyze my room and manually input parameters into my RME ADI-2 DAC using the parametric EQ, so the idea of porting the REW profile into a programme running on a PC would not be too far a stretch for me.

What would be the options to achieve this, 'Equaliser Pro' I now know, are their an other ideas which follow a similar pattern?

I am of course happy to buy software that is easy to use and works well.
 

Willem

Major Contributor
Joined
Jan 8, 2019
Messages
3,658
Likes
5,276
Ah, with the ADI-2 filters you have already achieved much of the benefits (I have one too). Do you use subwoofers?
I am about to embark on a new round of equalizations. I plan to use Multi Sub Optimizer and a miniDSP 2x4HD to equalize my two subs and calculate filters for my main speakers to apply to my ADI-2 for the range above the subs and below 250 Hz.
My only warning would be that Multi Sub Optimizer is not an easy program. However, it will do more than anythiung else, I guess.
 
OP
roog

roog

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
369
Likes
397
Location
UK, Keynsham
Thank you for your thoughts @Willem I think that my situation is quite simple really, I took the measurements from REM, filtered them to show up the main culprits and devised my own Parametric EQ profiles to deal with the couple of peaks below 120Hz. I was guided by a very helpful 'Modmin' on the RME forum, whose advice sensibly started with, "if you can change your measurements by moving your seating position, do that first before dialling in any dsp filters".

I don't have a sub so my system is a very simple two speaker stereo set up.

From experience I have sought to minimise the dsp I apply to the signal just applying enough to kurb the biggest offending bass humps.

As I am a convert to 'gentle' dsp room correction I just wondered if i was missing something by not trying Dirac or similar quality applications?
 
Last edited:

tw99

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
467
Likes
1,069
Location
West Berkshire, UK
Thank you for your thoughts @Willem I think that my situation is quite simple really, I took the measurements from REM, filtered them to show up the main culprits and devised my own Parametric EQ profiles to deal with the couple of peaks below 120Hz. I was guided by a very helpful 'Modmin' on the MRE forum, whose advice sensibly started with, "if you can change your measurements by moving your seating position, do that first before dialling in any dsp filters".

I don't have a sub so my system is a very simple two speaker stereo.

From experience I have sought to minimise the dsp I apply to the signal just applying enough to kurb the biggest offending bass humps.

As I am a convert to 'gentle' dsp room correction I just wondered if i was missing something by not trying Dirac or similar quality applications?

If you're happy with the results from the RME PEQ, I would leave it at that. The only real problem with the RME for this purpose is the limited number of PEQs, but if you can flatten the response enough in your room with it, then you don't really need more. I don't think Dirac would provide a night&day type of difference, personally. If you can post your before/after REW graphs here, that might help people to advise further.
 
OP
roog

roog

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
369
Likes
397
Location
UK, Keynsham
Thank you @tw99 to some extent I was looking forward to tinkering with a new toy, but I take your point if the RME PEQ works why worry.
I have been through the whole compare the before and after charts with the RME guys and others on the RME forum, they were very helpful and I ended up with three PEQ profiles (some profiles go further than others with regard to the frequencies I try to address) which i can dial in with a push of a remote control button. I expect the charts and dialog are still there in my thread on their forum!

The RME dsp works very well and if I can do without it, usually with properly recorded classical and jazz music, which doesn't excite the room quite so much, I can just turn the dsp off with another button!

As I mentioned I thought that i might be missing out on something good/fun to play with!
 

HarmonicTHD

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Mar 18, 2022
Messages
3,326
Likes
4,829
Thank you for your responses, I have a umik-1 mic and have used REW in the past to analyze my room and manually input parameters into my RME ADI-2 DAC using the parametric EQ, so the idea of porting the REW profile into a programme running on a PC would not be too far a stretch for me.

What would be the options to achieve this, 'Equaliser Pro' I now know, are their an other ideas which follow a similar pattern?

I am of course happy to buy software that is easy to use and works well.
APO EQ runs in PC (often used with its PEACE skin), which does what you describe and that for free.

Alternatively if you use an RPi as a streamer (instead of a PC) Moode (also free) with its integrated Camilla EQ/DSP takes also REW filter values as input.

Both solutions have much more filters available to them in comparison to the 5 from RME. Does that matter? That is whole different debate and depends very much on the individual aspirations.

I tried both. Works quite well and one can get a “taste” of Room EQ without breaking the bank.
 

mglobe

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Mar 18, 2022
Messages
458
Likes
702
Location
Texas
Thank you for your responses, I have a umik-1 mic and have used REW in the past to analyze my room and manually input parameters into my RME ADI-2 DAC using the parametric EQ, so the idea of porting the REW profile into a programme running on a PC would not be too far a stretch for me.

What would be the options to achieve this, 'Equaliser Pro' I now know, are their an other ideas which follow a similar pattern?

I am of course happy to buy software that is easy to use and works well.
If you can manage REW, you won't have an issue working with Dirac, nor with minDSP stuff.
 
OP
roog

roog

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
369
Likes
397
Location
UK, Keynsham
If you can manage REW, you won't have an issue working with Dirac, nor with minDSP stuff.

Thanks, I got the impression that Dirac was fairly straight forward and designed for domestic users, it was its implementation with a streamer all within a headless PC that had me unsure. Effectively putting together my own PC based music streamer complete with dirac.
 

Willem

Major Contributor
Joined
Jan 8, 2019
Messages
3,658
Likes
5,276
If you don't have subs I would stick with just the filters on the RME. However, if you really want a smoother response I would get two smallish subs, equalize them with MSO and a miniDSP 2x4 HD, use MSO to design filters for the main speakers up to 250 Hz, and apply them on the RME. That at least is what I am planning to do in the next few weeks.
 

mikematrix

Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2023
Messages
31
Likes
17
Hello, sorry I don't speak English. I translate with Google.

I love Dirac, the work he does for me is fantastic.
I am using a PC as a source and purchased the PC license from dirac which works as a virtual sound card.
I use tidal which comes out in dirac and then in a DAC connected via USB to the pc.
With we have 8 memories.
By registering on the Dirac site, you can download a 14-day trial version.
192khz possible.
I also used it with roon and audirvana.

https://www.dirac.com/live/studio-audio-for-creatives/

https://www.dirac.com/online-store/dirac-live-room-correction-suite/
 
OP
roog

roog

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
369
Likes
397
Location
UK, Keynsham
Thank you @mikematrix for taking the trouble to respond to my question.

You address my main question, how you use Dirac with a PC and audirvana as your streamer.
I am very pleased to hear that you are happy with the way your system works, I am very encouraged by your experience.
I would like to try your method, because I remain in control of each part of the system which I could change later if I chose.
I understand that buying a purpose made item of equipment such as those available from Mini DSP or NAD is nice because it is easy, but this will limit the flexibility of the system and I like the idea of a project to build myself.

I might be able to reuse an existing i7 desk top PC for my experiment.

I hope that my response translates as well as your post, thank you again form taking the time to tell me about your system.
 

mikematrix

Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2023
Messages
31
Likes
17
I talk about it here but in French.
https://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/posting.php?mode=quote&f=1291&p=180754467

As explained Dirac works like a virtual sound card so there is a program that you launch and in it you know how to choose the output source, it can be the TV (via hdmi so 7.1 possible), the PC sound card or a DAC plugged into it.

Then with roon, tidal or another program we choose the output source "virtual audio device" and it's over.

For audirvana it's different because there we know Dirac is integrated into the program with a VST plugin and it launches automatically with audirvana.

This is what the program gives for PC.
Dirac-processor.jpg


For calibration, press the calibrate button at the bottom right, plug in the umik microphone and follow the steps.
Once done, we know how to take the measurements again and make other target curves if we want to test this or that result.

I have 3 computers with Dirac on it and each has 8 memories but I can't use 2 at the same time.

The easiest way if you have an Umik is to test for yourself with the 14-day trial version. Basically you will be given a license valid for 14 days.

I don't know if I answered your questions ;)
 
OP
roog

roog

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
369
Likes
397
Location
UK, Keynsham
Thank you @mikematrix i think what you is say the Dirac program runs as a sub program to the music streamer, a VST, I have heard of the term VST in live music recording programs.

I think that I need to pick a suitable music streamer, perhaps audirvana would suit me? I shall check it out.
 

mikematrix

Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2023
Messages
31
Likes
17
No, you don't have to use the vst. Moreover the vst is only compatible with some programs.

Dirac can work autonomously, just launch it then launch the playback program (tidal, roon, spotify etc...) and in the playback program you have to choose the output of the virtual audio device (Dirac). The path will then be tidal > dirac > dac in usb.

Audirvana is absolutely not mandatory.

What are you using as a player?
 
Last edited:
OP
roog

roog

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
369
Likes
397
Location
UK, Keynsham
On the PC, I use Qobuz natively. It would be handy if I could just point the output of the Qobuz app straight at the dirac app/program.

I am beginning to wonder whether running Dirac on a Mini DSP device might suit me better, allowing me to use one of my existing bespoke streamers to feed it a SPDIF signal.
Whilst I do like the idea of a 'flexible PC solution', I rarely use a PC to play music in my living room Stereo system.
 
Last edited:

mikematrix

Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2023
Messages
31
Likes
17
On the PC, I use Qobuz natively. It would be handy if I could just point the output of the Qobuz app straight at the dirac app/program.
It's the case. With qobuz you select dirac in the audio devices.

MiniDSP has 4 memories and some are limited to 48khz and others at 96khz. The PC goes up to 192khz and has 8 memories. On the other hand the minidsp often have several inputs and even sometimes an analog input.

Sur PC c'est moins cher mais si vous avez d'autres sources ou si vous ne souhaitez pas utiliser d'ordinateur, la solution minidsp est plus adaptée.

But as said, you can test this for free for 14 days ;)
 
OP
roog

roog

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
369
Likes
397
Location
UK, Keynsham
Again @mikematrix thank you for your help, it’s very good of you to explain things in simple terms without skipping the stages in between!

I might just source a suitable PC and give it a go.
 
Top Bottom