RME ADI-2 FS Version 2 DAC and Headphone Amp Review

[amper42]

I might also try a returnable USB isolator.
Actually, the D90 ||| also has the option to equalize.

- Rich

It's really not the same thing. With the RME ADI-2 DAC FS Loudness control it can apply different settings based on user defined loudness levels. It a huge step above basic EQ.

 

[gvl]

The problem for me is that I absolutely can't stand listening to music on them. There is something really wrong. I'm no audiophool and wanting to be objective I'd conclude that the way these DACs reproduce music is more "correct" and whatever is bothering me is actually in the recording and possibly obfuscated by less precise DACs.

Sounds like it may be time to learn how to properly apply EQ that is fortunately comes naturally built in with these devices.

 

[Chazz6]

My subjective and completely unverified experience with all RME devices is that:

1. They seem to have these sharp artificial high frequency range that makes the sound "thin"
2. Lack of body in transients, flat and uninvolving, undynamic

1. It sounds as though you have a preamp or amplifier with a volume control. So does the RME DAC. You can have one or the other do most of the attenuation, so compare and decide whether it makes a difference.

2. The RME has a five-band parametric equalizer. You can really clamp down on a frequency range.

 

[amper42]

Personally, I think post 3048 may be a crank post.

It's a complaint about the sound of a device that can act as a chameleon and sound like anything. This doesn't ring true as a serious post. Most likely it's a hoax?

 

[kieko]

Thanks for all the responses, I'll try to give a bit of info about my background / setup. I am an amateur musician and have been dabbling in recording and studio equipment for about 20yrs. I think my first RME was an HDSP 9632 PCI back in 2004. I had a numberof setups mainly pro-audio (RME, Prism, Motu, ESI, TC Electronics, Steinberg..). I am familiar with digital audio principles and theory.


I don't have a treated room but my setup is relatively high quality right now. I have a couple of Genelec 8020D + 7040 with wall and desk compensation, bass traps.


Preamp is the Benchmark HPA4 so no compromise here. Headphones currently AT K70xa.


Normally I volume match 2 devices and play them at the same time on the HPA4 and I can seamlessly switch. I always use linear phase fast when the filter is selectable which is historically what is considered most "correct" in pro audio.


I'll do some actual blind tests with a friend and will report back with the results. We did something somewhat blind in that I told him I had a new DAC, put on a song he is familiar with and his reaction was immediately very negative. I didn't tell him it was the ADI2.

I have the following other DACs at the moment:

• Prism Lyra
• Benchmark DAC3B
• Teac NT-503
• EverSolo DAC-Z8 (prob defective, I posted the very bad jitter measurements in another thread)
• Topping D90 III (tested recently don't have it anymore)
• Teac UD-701 (tested recently don't have it anymore, posted some jitter measurements and subjective impressions in another thread)

I've done loads of different tests with different sources etc on these and over the years so I have a bit of experience.

I'm mainly looking to make sense of what I hear that's different from these devices rather than make it sound good, so really not interested in DSP. I think we all start with the assumption that they should sound the same when volume matched but they don't (to me). I know this is controversial but consider the discussions that go on since 25+ years in Gearspace and the like about mastering DACs.

 

[ahofer]

consider the discussions that go on since 25+ years in Gearspace and the like about mastering DACs.

Consider this massive thread

How can DAC's have a SOUND SIGNATURE if they measure as transparent?

I know there are people out there that think cables affect sound, which is much worse, but there really is no response to something like that, but just to smile and nod. But what about people who talk about DACS as if they were headphone drivers or speakers, and talk about the SOUNDSTAGE...

audiosciencereview.com

 

[amper42]

If you are looking for 547 pages of why DAC's don't sound different start reading this post:

How can DAC's have a SOUND SIGNATURE if they measure as transparent?

I know there are people out there that think cables affect sound, which is much worse, but there really is no response to something like that, but just to smile and nod. But what about people who talk about DACS as if they were headphone drivers or speakers, and talk about the SOUNDSTAGE...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[C. Cook]

Can't speak to the measurement part, but I have the same DAC and I prefer to listen to it with "loudness" on and have created a few EQ settings for music and movies. You might try playing with the EQ - create a few profiles to use on headphones vs. your speakers (check if there are measurements for the speakers so you know what frequencies to manipulate depending on your room). Otherwise, without benefit of measurements for all I know yours is defective.

 

[Curvature]

when volume matched

This is a lot more complicated than it seems and requires knowledge about the electrical output and gain staging of each device. You can't approximately match using your best guess by twisting knobs because the ear is far more sensitive than most people suspect. 0.1dB or better is the standard.

Even when volume matched, unless you are listening to controlled material you can fool yourself into differences. Hearing is dynamic and you have the ability to select certain elements from a soundscape and focus on them to the exclusion of others.

25 years of DAC debates are nothing compared to over 100 years of psychophysical testing. I bring that up because it might seem like there is a whole unexplored and unknown universe of sound out there, only after doing some reading you find out that many people have ventured out and worked on these topics for generations.

 

[kieko]

This is a lot more complicated than it seems and requires knowledge about the electrical output and gain staging of each device. You can't approximately match using your best guess by twisting knobs because the ear is far more sensitive than most people suspect. 0.1dB or better is the standard.

Even when volume matched, unless you are listening to controlled material you can fool yourself into differences. Hearing is dynamic and you have the ability to select certain elements from a soundscape and focus on them to the exclusion of others.

25 years of DAC debates are nothing compared to over 100 years of psychophysical testing. I bring that up because it might seem like there is a whole unexplored and unknown universe of sound out there, only after doing some reading you find out that many people have ventured out and worked on these topics for generations.

What I do is I play a 1khz sine and match with a db meter on my phone, I'm sure one can influence themselves but imo less likely if you can switch seamlessly and quickly like tha and spend some time with it.

 

[RandomEar]

What I do is I play a 1khz sine and match with a db meter on my phone, I'm sure one can influence themselves but imo less likely if you can switch seamlessly and quickly like tha and spend some time with it.

This is by far not precise enough. You'll easily be out by 1 dB using this method, likely more. But you need to be below 0.2 dB to ensure a fair comparison.

The safest way to get the levels matched is by using a multimeter at the DAC output. Play a medium-ish frequency sine wave (say 500 Hz - check your multimeter specs for bandwidth) and tune the volume. I think a difference of 20 mV or less should be fine.

 

[Marc v E]

@kieko I get your point of view totally. Mainly because I used to listen to changes in dacs and thus bought quite a few.

I also experienced pro dacs sounding sterile for my taste (that was a few years ago). Turns out when I used the same benchmark dac/pre with a genelec 8531 all concerns disappeared because everything sounded so 'right'. I have no better word or description for it.

I still have to bring myself to upgrading speakers in stead of dacs and amps, but I'm learning and getting better results.

Oh and by the way, this is just my experience, you are free to choose whatever you like. Take care

 

[Roland68]

What I do is I play a 1khz sine and match with a db meter on my phone, I'm sure one can influence themselves but imo less likely if you can switch seamlessly and quickly like tha and spend some time with it.

dB measurements, even precise ones, are far too imprecise for a blinded comparison. Calibration with a multimeter and a test signal is absolutely necessary.

Switching directly between devices is also not helpful, a mistake many make. I recommend playing the same 10-30 second (maximum) section of music on both devices.
If you do not approach a blinded comparison with due care, you will only waste your time with no usable results or with incorrect results.

 

[Xyrium]

Thanks for all the responses, I'll try to give a bit of info about my background / setup. I am an amateur musician and have been dabbling in recording and studio equipment for about 20yrs. I think my first RME was an HDSP 9632 PCI back in 2004. I had a numberof setups mainly pro-audio (RME, Prism, Motu, ESI, TC Electronics, Steinberg..). I am familiar with digital audio principles and theory.

Why do you feel that all of the DACs that you've tried aren't sufficient? Now the RME isn't making the cut somehow for you as well.

Given that some feel the Gennie's have a very "revealing" sound character, perhaps try Neumann?

 

[amper42]

1. Is it possible you have some variety of EQ turned on and don't know it? Check the EQ and Loudness buttons to see if they are engaged.

2. The RME can sound anyway you want it with the Loudness features and the ADI-2 app engaged. Other DAC's can only dream about these features. If you are not willing to use these amazing tools to set the sound just the way you want it, then use something else.

You have a sports car that you want to drive like a Prius and then complain it doesn't go as fast as you like. It really doesn't make much sense. You are handicapping yourself. Hard for anyone to fix that.

 

[unpluggged]

and the ADI-2 app engaged

Which app? The remote only controls the hardware via MIDI commands, it does not implement any DSP features. It's not needed (neither a computer is) for any of the DSP features of the device, which was designed for a fully standalone operation.

 

[amper42]

Which app? The remote only controls the hardware via MIDI commands, it does not implement any DSP features. It's not needed (neither a computer is) for any of the DSP features of the device, which was designed for a fully standalone operation.

The ADI-2 DAC FS Remote EQ button will disengage or engage all EQ at the touch of a button. Same with LD Loudness button.
To setup EQ I use the ADI-2 app for that. It's easy to use and works on Mac and iPad. I believe there is a Windows version as well.

 

[amper42]

Let me give you an example of why you want to be proficient with the ADI-2 app.
1. It allows you to play your favorite tunes while configuring the Loudness settings.
2. This allows you to fine tune speaker performance like never before.
3. It's so easy to use and all configurations are available on three unique screens.
4. Nothing else comes close to giving you this kind of audio control in real time.

Once I felt proficient with the ADI-2 app I tried something totally different.
I have a 24x28' listening room with Revel F328Be speakers. I maximized their performance using the ADI-2 app.

I also have a 12x14' separate room next to the listening room that I use as an office. It has BMR Monitors. The F328Be sounded so great after using the ADI-2 app on them that I wanted to see if I could duplicate the sound in the office with the BMR. In both rooms I have RME ADI-2 DACs and Purifi amps.
Both rooms can play music using RPi4/Moode with Audirvana on a MacBook Pro.

I connected the ADI-2 app to the BMR setup and tweaked it to sound just like the F328Be. I had the F328Be playing while going to the adjoining BMR room making slight changes with the app until both F328Be and BMR sounded identical. I was amazed it was possible to make them both sound like duplicates. The BMR midrange was now more forward and sounded crazy good.

What I learned is if you have an RME ADI-2 DAC FS and know how to use the app you can make any reasonably good speaker sound within 95% of a speaker priced 8x higher. I realized there is absolutely NO NEED to upgrade a reasonably good speaker if you know how to use the ADI-2 app. It can get you there without spending endless amounts of cash looking for that unique sound you desire. The ADI-2 DAC FS is crazy good!

If you don't use the ADI-2 app and have a desire for a different sound you are missing out on one of the best kept secrets in audio.

 

[unpluggged]

To setup EQ I use the ADI-2 app for that. It's easy to use and works on Mac and iPad. I believe there is a Windows version as well.

Again, the app is not essential for the DSP features to work.

I'm just clarifying that this statement of yours is not entirely correct:

The RME can sound anyway you want it with the Loudness features and the ADI-2 app engaged

1. It allows you to play your favorite tunes while configuring the Loudness settings.
2. This allows you to fine tune speaker performance like never before.
3. It's so easy to use and all configurations are available on three unique screens.
4. Nothing else comes close to giving you this kind of audio control in real time.

You can achieve all this even without the app, like we have done for the 8 years that have passed between the ADI-2 Pro release and the ADI-2 Remote app release.

What I learned is if you have an RME ADI-2 DAC FS and know how to use the app you can make any reasonably good speaker sound within 95% of a speaker priced 8x higher. I realized there is absolutely NO NEED to upgrade a reasonably good speaker if you know how to use the ADI-2 app. It can get you there without spending endless amounts of cash looking for that unique sound you desire. The ADI-2 DAC FS is crazy good!

All this can be done without the app.

 

[amper42]

Again, the app is not essential for the DSP features to work.

I'm just clarifying that this statement of yours is not entirely correct:

Correct, if you want to go back to the Stone Age and learn all the secret handshakes of which buttons to push on the RME to alter EQ or Loudness it's certainly possible. But if you want an easy path that doesn't require navigating buttons in the exact proper method - then open the ADI-2 app and make all changes you want while viewing all the setting's available on your computer screen. ADI-2 app = easy access and monitoring of settings, like never before.