REW First Timer

[michaelahess]

Here's my super scientific, super accurate, first run of REW. I know not what I do.

I setup on my mac, hdmi to a Yamaha RX-V377 connected to my JBL S38's. One of which has no mid range at the moment, the right one. These readings are not for exact measurements, so much as comparisons between the two speakers, and the DBR62's coming tomorrow.

I don't know if this is good, bad, what...I set SPL with an ARC mic (non calibrated) to 75dB via an SPL app on my Pixel 4a, super accurate. I do have a calibrated EMM-6 but I have to run it through my Xenyx302 which probably introduces more variance?

Both Channels driven:

Left Channel:

Right Channel (no mid):

Thoughts, and advice on how to do this right, would be very much welcome!

 

[GDK]

A couple of quick things to start:

- You should change the vertical scale so that it only goes from 40-90 dB - you can do this via the Limits button on the top right)
- You should add some smoothing, like 1/12 or 1/6 to eliminate the HF comb filtering - this is done via the controls button (I think the one with the gear), also on the top right

Neither of these require new measurements, it is adjusting how your current ones are displayed.

 

[michaelahess]

Updated graphs per recommendations, that looks more normal. Thank you both!

 

[GDK]

Updated graphs per recommendations, that looks more normal. Thank you both!

Do your speakers sound bright at all? According to the measurements, they look like they would, but that could possibly be a result of the lack of mic calibration.

I would probably try to run the measurements with the EMM-6 and compare the two. I doubt that the interface would have that much impact on the FR response, but others may know better.

 

[flipflop]

I'm not exactly sure what kind of advice you're looking for but there's a few things to be said:
1) You obviously need room correction to sort out the bass range. EQ can take care of the peak at around 120 Hz and it can probably fill the 40-60 Hz dip, too.
2) The dip around 200 Hz in the right channel indicates that the speaker is too close to a boundary. Ideally, there should be a gap of 50 cm or more.
3) The response is sloping upwards past 4 kHz when it should be sloping downwards. Due to the lack of anechoic data on your speakers, it's not possible to tell whether it's them or the room that's responsible for this. A high-shelf filter could be a solution.

 

[michaelahess]

I'm not exactly sure what kind of advice you're looking for but there's a few things to be said:
1) You obviously need room correction to sort out the bass range. EQ can take care of the peak at around 120 Hz and it can probably fill the 40-60 Hz dip, too.
2) The dip around 200 Hz in the right channel indicates that the speaker is too close to a boundary. Ideally, there should be a gap of 50 cm or more.
3) The response is sloping upwards past 4 kHz when it should be sloping downwards. Due to the lack of anechoic data on your speakers, it's not possible to tell whether it's them or the room that's responsible for this. A high-shelf filter could be a solution.

Thank you, this was what I was looking for, but didn't know it.

The 200Hz dip is weird, as both speakers are on wall shelves, not really perfect but I don't have a lot of options. Wonder why one is dipping over more range than the other.

@GDK They don't sound too bright to my ear, that's one complaint I've had of all my JBL's to be honest, vs the Triangle Borea's I have in the living room, or the AJ Pioneer's I've had for years.

Thanks to you both for this info. I'll post the DBR62's graphs when I get them too. Maybe I'll do the Pioneers as well. Might be useful info to anyone with the same speakers.

 

[richard12511]

I’m guessing that high frequency rise is a mic calibration issue, though it’s possible that it’s not

 

[michaelahess]

Here's the EMM-6 calibrated mic graphs. Not sure what the black calibration line means, do the freq response curves get adjusted by the + and - of the mic calibration by the same amounts basically? Is there a way to show the adjusted response added in?

Both Channels:

Left Channel:

Right Channel:

 

[michaelahess]

After running YPAO on it (just learned about overlays):

Edited, forgot to zero the DAC...

 

[michaelahess]

Here's the Elac. Frwd low means I'm about 20-30 degrees below tweeter and more forward of the back wall (1ft to speaker face) than side wall, high means in line with. Back means I'm perfectly in the corner of the walls. That's all the flexibility I have in my room unfortunately.

And the S38's compared to what I believe is the best position for the Elac's as highlighted above:

Needless to say the S38 has better bass response around 300-600, but I'm shocked at the high's. The Elac's sound far more clear/natural in the upper ranges. To see them drop off at 1700 and 4k didn't seem to match my expectations. They certainly don't have the heavy handed muddyness of the S38's. But that's more a tonal impression I think than anything. I like the DBR's but expected a much larger change.

Am I fooling myself with them due to my room restrictions?

 

[flipflop]

Here's the Elac. Frwd low means I'm about 20-30 degrees below tweeter and more forward of the back wall (1ft to speaker face) than side wall, high means in line with. Back means I'm perfectly in the corner of the walls. That's all the flexibility I have in my room unfortunately.
View attachment 128517

And the S38's compared to what I believe is the best position for the Elac's as highlighted above:
View attachment 128516

Needless to say the S38 has better bass response around 300-600, but I'm shocked at the high's. The Elac's sound far more clear/natural in the upper ranges. To see them drop off at 1700 and 4k didn't seem to match my expectations. They certainly don't have the heavy handed muddyness of the S38's. But that's more a tonal impression I think than anything. I like the DBR's but expected a much larger change.

Am I fooling myself with them due to my room restrictions?

I find the measurement positions a bit strange. You would probably be better off just running a single MMM measurement at the MLP. Not that it matters now, since we see the same room problems as with the S38s, namely the 120 Hz peak and 40-60 Hz dip, which need to be adressed with EQ.
As for the response above the transition frequency, I would be careful to draw any conclusions about their tonality based on the in-room response. It's the direct sound that determines the tonality of a speaker.

 

[michaelahess]

I find the measurement positions a bit strange. You would probably be better off just running a single MMM measurement at the MLP. Not that it matters now, since we see the same room problems as with the S38s, namely the 120 Hz peak and 40-60 Hz dip, which need to be adressed with EQ.
As for the response above the transition frequency, I would be careful to draw any conclusions about their tonality based on the in-room response. It's the direct sound that determines the tonality of a speaker.

What's MMM and MLP? I had the mic at ear level where I'm seated, then above my head about a foot.

 

[flipflop]

What's MMM and MLP?

MLP = Main listening position.
MMM = Moving mic method. Here's a tutorial on how to perform the measurement with REW:

Your EMM-6 should be suitable for the task.

 

[michaelahess]

Wow, that's awesome! Here's two MMM's. Red against wall, green a foot out. Only a marginal change. And I can't get the graph as smooth as Mr Sprinkle showed on that video.

Then fiddling with the EQ window, I got this:

Here's with the Yamaha set to max drop at 63Hz and a few dB at 160Hz, nothing in between. And this is a GEQ, PEQ only available with YPAO and not configurable.

 

[flipflop]

And I can't get the graph as smooth as Mr Sprinkle showed on that video.

You just need to apply smoothing again: Top left corner --> Graph --> Var smoothing

Then fiddling with the EQ window, I got this:

Looks decent. Maybe a little too bass light. How does it sound to you?

 

[michaelahess]

Yeah it was bass light, corrected that a bit and it sounds very good to me. I do notice more depth and a wider soundstage vs the JBL's. I think I'm going to like these speakers.

Now that I know how to work with REW (THANK YOU!) it'll be easier to tweak and play with the EQ as well.

Thank you for all the help!