• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Review and Measurements of Topping D10 DAC

guenthi_r

Active Member
Joined
May 8, 2019
Messages
130
Likes
103
Location
Europe/Austria
Is there any Schematics from the D10 out there?
I want to know if it is possible to change the two OPA2134 -> OPA1642 (I/V)

Edit:
Found the Reference Schematic from ESS here
 
Last edited:

Nesty

Member
Joined
May 25, 2018
Messages
23
Likes
5
Guys, I'm experiencing some random pauses very short like glitch when playing music on topping d10 with foobar wasapi on windows 10. Do you have any suggested solutions. Thanks in advance.
 

daftcombo

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 5, 2019
Messages
3,687
Likes
4,068
Guys, I'm experiencing some random pauses very short like glitch when playing music on topping d10 with foobar wasapi on windows 10. Do you have any suggested solutions. Thanks in advance.

Did you try increasing buffer size (to 500ms or more for instance) ?
 

zenon

Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2018
Messages
88
Likes
29
Location
Sofia, Bulgaria
Is there any Schematics from the D10 out there?
I want to know if it is possible to change the two OPA2134 -> OPA1642 (I/V)

Edit:
Found the Reference Schematic from ESS here
ADA4898.JPG
 

Krunok

Major Contributor
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
Messages
4,600
Likes
3,065
Location
Zg, Cro
Yes, I did and the problem is still there.

Does it happen once every minute or so? Does sound dissapear for a very short period of time, like say 1/th of the second? Does it happen more often when you are using your PC for something else other than playing music?

Download this program. Try to see if the audio dropouts you are experiencing correlate with the program output.
 
Last edited:

Krunok

Major Contributor
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
Messages
4,600
Likes
3,065
Location
Zg, Cro
Is this the real Schematic of the D10?

It is not. If you replace I/V opamps there is practically 0% chance that you will get better measurements but there is a significant chance that you will get much worse.
 

zenon

Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2018
Messages
88
Likes
29
Location
Sofia, Bulgaria
It is not. If you replace I/V opamps there is practically 0% chance that you will get better measurements but there is a significant chance that you will get much worse.

Yes, it's D10 I/V stage.
No, it's sounds much better. Synthetic tests - they sells, but they are meanless to sound.
Just curios, why You think, that situation is get worst, by changing OP amps?
 

Krunok

Major Contributor
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
Messages
4,600
Likes
3,065
Location
Zg, Cro
Yes, it's D10 I/V stage.
No, it's sounds much better. Synthetic tests - they sells, but they are meanless to sound.
Just curios, why You think, that situation is get worst, by changing OP amps?

D10 uses OPA2134 in I/V stage as well, not ADA4898 nor LME49710.

You cannot switch I/V opamps just like that, chances are you will get osillations or some other artifact that would be very much hearable. On the other hand, if you by some miracle manage to slightly reduce THD+N of D10 you certainly won't be able to hear that difference.
 

Nesty

Member
Joined
May 25, 2018
Messages
23
Likes
5
Does it happen once every minute or so? Does sound dissapear for a very short period of time, like say 1/th of the second? Does it happen more often when you are using your PC for something else other than playing music?

Download this program. Try to see if the audio dropouts you are experiencing correlate with the program output.

@Krunok , it occurs randomly in a song like 1/th of the second.
thanks the DPC tool is useful. Image below with two red bars it's gone now. As instructed I disabled my wifi device in the device manager. Great tool.

1562492982304.png
 

zenon

Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2018
Messages
88
Likes
29
Location
Sofia, Bulgaria
D10 uses OPA2134 in I/V stage as well, not ADA4898 nor LME49710.

You cannot switch I/V opamps just like that, chances are you will get osillations or some other artifact that would be very much hearable. On the other hand, if you by some miracle manage to slightly reduce THD+N of D10 you certainly won't be able to hear that difference.

Well...
You can change OP amps without any problem, if You do some mat & simulations before that.
In this case, OPA 2134 is just cheap, nothing more. No any magic here.
About oscillations You're right, its complicated, but no oscillations here (measured with scope). D10 is well engineered.
About I/V stage (DAC buffer):
This is one version of I/V stage, with diff amp.
ES9018K2M IVstage.jpg
This is version from datasheet
Clip.jpg
Note: If You want to change RF (gain), You need to change offset divider (D10 case - 4.7k, RF 910ohm). No magic at all.
You can change want You want, just do the math.
P.S. Much more critical for sound is AVCC_LR.
Hint: LDO is not an option, if You want good sound (with LDO measurements are OK).
 

HAL9000

Member
Joined
Dec 21, 2018
Messages
18
Likes
4
all you need is pair of line xformers , which you'll get as geschenk

everything after DAC is just disconnected nd xformers are ditto after



DAC,-xformer,-Buffer.jpg







in fact - you'll probably be surprised with bass , comparing to classic discrete solutions of I/V
 
Last edited:

Krunok

Major Contributor
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
Messages
4,600
Likes
3,065
Location
Zg, Cro
Yes, it's D10 I/V stage.

I suggest you stop posting false info.

Here is a link to the thread where rolling the buffer opamp was tested.

D10 has 2 OPA2134 in I/V stage and another OPA2134 acting as a buffer which can be replaced. Your diagram contains 2xADA4898 and LME 49710 as a buffer so it is clearly NOT a D10 diagram.

Capture.JPG
 

zenon

Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2018
Messages
88
Likes
29
Location
Sofia, Bulgaria
I suggest you stop posting false info.

Here is a link to the thread where rolling the buffer opamp was tested.

D10 has 2 OPA2134 in I/V stage and another OPA2134 acting as a buffer which can be replaced. Your diagram contains 2xADA4898 and LME 49710 as a buffer so it is clearly NOT a D10 diagram.

View attachment 29087
Schematics diagram is the same, OP amps are not.
Where is problem here?
If You want, You can disassemble D10 and measure values of the components.
Can You?

P.S.
Ooops...
Sorry, I understand You!
LOWPASS.JPG
Tell me, what are the differences here?
This is schematic diagram of first-order LOW-PASS filter. Schematic diagram are the same, but components are different. But LPF as schematic diagram is the same - this is LPF.
So, my schematic diagram is diagram of I/V stage (by chance this is I/V stage of D10). This is popular diagram of I/V stage, no matter what components are used.
I am sorry that my schematic diagram confused You, but the question was: "Is there any Schematics from the D10 out there? ".
Job done!
 
Last edited:

Krunok

Major Contributor
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
Messages
4,600
Likes
3,065
Location
Zg, Cro
Diagram is the same, OP amps are not.
Where is problem here?
If You want, You can disassemble D10 and measure values of the components.
Can You?

I'm an EE engineer. All I/V diagrams are similar but R and C components differ as well as opamps. The point is the diagram you posted is NOT for the D10. As I already explained, the point is also that if you swap I/V opamps without adjusting surrounding RC components chances are you will get instability and/or oscilations.

What I don't understand is why is D10 attracting so much of you guys who claim to be able to make D10 better, yet nobody of you proved it with measurements. :facepalm:

Btw, wellcome to my ignore list. ;)
 
Top Bottom