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Review and Measurements of PiFi DAC+ Pi Sound Card

BDWoody

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Of course he knows the price:)
View attachment 31787

I'm saying his measurements will be different somehow?

If you think a few dollars difference is going to change the results, you just aren't paying attention.

Maybe more reading would help. You basically show up today and start whining about how it's all so unfair. What is your personal stake that you are trying to defend...?
 
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xxhh1234

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Price and performance in this realm is almost completely disconnected... Competence with regard to a DAC is a commodity, and has been for 20+ years.

Elegance on the other hand is rare. The new little balanced headphone DAC being an example.

Won't sound better, but it's slick as hell.
Yes, the results of these tests do not simply represent the quality of the dac. But in the test report and summary, the author obviously has negative emotions, including high-priced DAC+, which is obviously misleading to the readers. If I hadn't bought pifi DAC + for $13, I would have read the article and thought it was more expensive and worse than hifiberry DAC + pro. When you know that the price of pifi DAC + is less than half that of hifiberry DAC + pro, and the $35 raspberry pi, even if the performance is poor, doesn't it look that bad?
only hifiberry dac+ pro =$40 VS pifi dac+ + pi4B=$48
When you buy a product of average performance at an excessive price, you will feel worthless. But if you buy a product with the same performance at a low price, you will feel great.The same performance, but the price difference, will affect your choice and feelings. But the impact of this price should not be reflected in the test report, because the test report is actually instructive,that's what I want to say.
 
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BDWoody

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Yes, the results of these tests do not simply represent the quality of the dac. But in the test report and summary, the author obviously has negative emotions, including high-priced DAC+, which is obviously misleading to the readers. If I hadn't bought pifi DAC + for $13, I would have read the article and thought it was more expensive and worse than hifiberry DAC + pro. When you know that the price of pifi DAC + is less than half that of hifiberry DAC + pro, and the $35 raspberry pi, even if the performance is poor, doesn't it look that bad?
only hifiberry dac+ pro =$40 VS pifi dac+ + pi4B=$48

Price has nothing to do with any of this...

If you read the review and made some incorrect assumptions, how is that the reviewer's fault?
 

BDWoody

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In addition, I also asked that since it is a comparative test, we should test the validity of the data of the comparative test. Are there many test factors considered consistently?
1. To test the reliability of product samples, at least multiple test samples should be used.
2. The hardware environment of the test, including whether the test instrument has passed the calibration test, whether the tested cables are consistent, whether the test power supply is consistent, and whether the power supply indicators are consistent.
3. The test software environment, including raspberry pie configuration, system version, kernel version, test software version, audio file, since the chip is the same, it also includes whether the configuration registers of sound card are consistent, whether the registers are dump out to compare consistency, driver differences and so on, which all affect the test results. Important factors. Perhaps different filter configurations and different jitter printing configurations will lead to different results.
We all hope that the website can be better and more professional.

Your ignorance and arrogance is astonishing...by the way...
 

Eirikur

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... in the test report and summary, the author obviously has negative emotions
What exactly is your vested interest in defending this product or company?
The conclusion is as dry as it could be:
Using the same recipe as the HifiBerry DAC+, the itead PiFi DAC+ falls short in measurements. We were barely good enough with Hifiberry but now are behind the game with some 7 dB higher amount of distortion.
The following is based on (economic) logic rather than opinion:
Seeing how itead PiFi DAC+ is more expensive anyway, I see no reason to recommend it over HifiBerry offerings.
Any negative emotions you "sense" must be the sadness in the Pink Panther's eyes; yet another product that we don't need. At the very least a DAC should be capable to reproduce contents of a CD unadulterated IMHO.
 
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amirm

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Since this board is simple, and similar to the Hifiberry, can we deduce what's causing the big difference in performance ? E.g. is it board layout, the clocking scheme, setup of the DAC, inferior analogue components... ?
There are some clues in this repair video of it:


It references a website that talks about the necessary mods.
 
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amirm

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In addition, I also asked that since it is a comparative test, we should test the validity of the data of the comparative test. Are there many test factors considered consistently?
1. To test the reliability of product samples, at least multiple test samples should be used.
2. The hardware environment of the test, including whether the test instrument has passed the calibration test, whether the tested cables are consistent, whether the test power supply is consistent, and whether the power supply indicators are consistent.
3. The test software environment, including raspberry pie configuration, system version, kernel version, test software version, audio file, since the chip is the same, it also includes whether the configuration registers of sound card are consistent, whether the registers are dump out to compare consistency, driver differences and so on, which all affect the test results. Important factors. Perhaps different filter configurations and different jitter printing configurations will lead to different results.
We all hope that the website can be better and more professional.
All the conditions are identical for these recently measured DACs. I just replace the HAT and remasure using identical hardware and software setup. Ropieee is used as the OS and I simply go to the drop down and select another driver for the board I am testing.

If there are issues with driver versions and such, well, that is what you get with these products. And at any rate, I am happy to see different measurements. To the extent there aren't any, this is it then. I am not performing certification and QA for these companies. They should do all you say and document it on their website. If they have not, I don't know why you put the burden on me.

Think of me as a mechanic friend you take to decide to buy a used car. Don't expect him to take the engine apart to give you an opinion for free...
 

Veri

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I am happy to see different measurements. To the extent there aren't any, this is it then. I am not performing certification and QA for these companies. They should do all you say and document it on their website. If they have not, I don't know why you put the burden on me.

Think of me as a mechanic friend you take to decide to buy a used car. Don't expect him to take the engine apart to give you an opinion for free...

Preach :):)
 

xxhh1234

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All the conditions are identical for these recently measured DACs. I just replace the HAT and remasure using identical hardware and software setup. Ropieee is used as the OS and I simply go to the drop down and select another driver for the board I am testing.

If there are issues with driver versions and such, well, that is what you get with these products. And at any rate, I am happy to see different measurements. To the extent there aren't any, this is it then. I am not performing certification and QA for these companies. They should do all you say and document it on their website. If they have not, I don't know why you put the burden on me.

Think of me as a mechanic friend you take to decide to buy a used car. Don't expect him to take the engine apart to give you an opinion for free...
I'm just as grateful to all the fans for providing these test data free of charge. Your work can help more players. As an enthusiast, I hope you can develop into a professional evaluation website like Dxomark, which is more professional, more perfect and objective, and can serve more players. So please forgive my different opinions for causing you trouble. This is not my intention.
 

AudioSceptic

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All the conditions are identical for these recently measured DACs. I just replace the HAT and remasure using identical hardware and software setup. Ropieee is used as the OS and I simply go to the drop down and select another driver for the board I am testing.

If there are issues with driver versions and such, well, that is what you get with these products. And at any rate, I am happy to see different measurements. To the extent there aren't any, this is it then. I am not performing certification and QA for these companies. They should do all you say and document it on their website. If they have not, I don't know why you put the burden on me.

Think of me as a mechanic friend you take to decide to buy a used car. Don't expect him to take the engine apart to give you an opinion for free...
(I've been lurking for ages but this is my first post here.)

Amir, your conclusion about this device was that you could not recommend it because it costs more than the HiFiBerry. I don't understand that as you quote $40 (discounted to $36.50) for this and $40 for the HiFiBerry. One of the posters says that the price is actually much lower, $24 or even $13 if you know where to look. Would that change your conclusion?
 
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amirm

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(I've been lurking for ages but this is my first post here.)

Amir, your conclusion about this device was that you could not recommend it because it costs more than the HiFiBerry. I don't understand that as you quote $40 (discounted to $36.50) for this and $40 for the HiFiBerry. One of the posters says that the price is actually much lower, $24 or even $13 if you know where to look. Would that change your conclusion?
No it doesn't. The performance is below what the DAC chip can produce by some 8 dB. If for you that is no big deal, then by all means, purchase it but I would not be penny pinching that way.

Also, I don't do exhaustive price searches. If there is something you all can do, then I don't do it. :) People read past the reviews and see the information you all present. So not everything needs to be in the review.
 

AudioSceptic

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No it doesn't. The performance is below what the DAC chip can produce by some 8 dB. If for you that is no big deal, then by all means, purchase it but I would not be penny pinching that way.

Also, I don't do exhaustive price searches. If there is something you all can do, then I don't do it. :) People read past the reviews and see the information you all present. So not everything needs to be in the review.
Thanks, understood. I wonder if the HiFiBerry will turn out to be the cheapest RPi DAC worth buying? They do a number of cheaper ones, including a tiny one for the Pi Zero, which might still pass muster.

Thanks for all the work you do here. It's such a pleasant change from all the c**p in the magazines and subjectivist sites!
 

SmackDaddies

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(I've been lurking for ages but this is my first post here.)

Amir, your conclusion about this device was that you could not recommend it because it costs more than the HiFiBerry. I don't understand that as you quote $40 (discounted to $36.50) for this and $40 for the HiFiBerry. One of the posters says that the price is actually much lower, $24 or even $13 if you know where to look. Would that change your conclusion?

He doesn't recommend it because of it's poor performance. I am at a loss as to what is so hard to understand the review
 

alex.r

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@amirm
I think you've got the highest price. Even Amazon is only $24.

View attachment 31781


Actually, for this review i bought it even lower - 17.99 and sent to Mr. Amir:

1566417271610.png


Even more cheap price tag can be found on aliexpress.com, as somebody already mentioned above. Suitable case also can be found there.
 

xxhh1234

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So far, it seems the HifiBerry is the best bet but I have a few more to test as mentioned.
As a senior raspberry pi player, since the release of raspberry pi has been concerned about the surrounding products of raspberry pi, hifiberry is indeed a good choice. At the beginning, pifi DAC + and hifiberry DAC + were basically listed in 2014 at the same time. Because of the high cost-performance ratio of pifi DAC + attracted many players, and also supported infrared remote control function. Easy to build your own remote-controlled digital broadcasting system, which is one of the reasons I bought. In the following years, with the improvement of hifiberry design, hifiberry DAC + Pro was introduced only in these years. Although the upgraded hifiberry DAC + Pro is a good product, I think its price and performance will be much worse than the new product.
I also hope that @amirm can test more new products RPI-ES9038Q2M, such as the DAC based on ES9038Q2M scheme. The price is basically the same as that of hifiberry DAC + pro, but the performance of es9038q2m is much higher than that of PCM5122. I think if you test it, the results will be surprising. And es9038q2m supports DSD through and DOP, and it also surpasses PCM5122 in function. Of course, as someone said before, you may test more indicators than product functions.
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